Prime Aviators

[Prime Aviators]

I have a 1966 M20C it has the original transponder what would I need to change it to GTC-37 anything special?

[LANCECASPER]

26 minutes ago, Prime Aviators said:

I have a 1966 M20C it has the original transponder what would I need to change it to GTC-37 anything special?

Garmin transponders start with "GTX-"

The two panel mount choices if you're looking for ADS-B out are the:

GTX-335 (https://www.garmin.com/en-US/p/140939)

and the GTX-345 also gives you ADS-B in (https://www.garmin.com/en-US/p/140949/pn/010-01216-06)

If you are trying to "future-proof" your investment go with the 345. It will interface with anything else panel mounted or portable to allow you to display weather and traffic.

[KLRDMD]

39 minutes ago, LANCECASPER said:

Garmin transponders start with "GTX-"

The two panel mount choices if you're looking for ADS-B out are the:

GTX-335 (https://www.garmin.com/en-US/p/140939)

and the GTX-345 also gives you ADS-B in (https://www.garmin.com/en-US/p/140949/pn/010-01216-06)

If you are trying to "future-proof" your investment go with the 345. It will interface with anything else panel mounted or portable to allow you to display weather and traffic.

Or, if your C model needs a panel mount GPS, consider the GTX375.

[PeteMc]

If you're looking for the simplest way to be compliant for ADS-B Out, I believe the uAvionix TailBeacon has been approved for all Mooneys.  But it is OUT ONLY.

If you are also looking for a GPS that will let you shoot approaches, then seriously look at GTX375.

And if you fly to Canada a lot or you're just looking for the big boy for ADS-B In and Out, then GTX345 is another serious contender.  You can get it with an internal GPS if you do not have a current WAAS GPS source and for Canada you can get a Diversity unit.  (Not required now and may be delayed again, but I think eventually Canada is going to require it since they can't easily put in Ground Stations everywhere in the North.) 

 

[Schllc]

17 minutes ago, PeteMc said:

If you're looking for the simplest way to be compliant for ADS-B Out, I believe the uAvionix TailBeacon has been approved for all Mooneys.  But it is OUT ONLY.

If you are also looking for a GPS that will let you shoot approaches, then seriously look at GTX375.

And if you fly to Canada a lot or you're just looking for the big boy for ADS-B In and Out, then GTX345 is another serious contender.  You can get it with an internal GPS if you do not have a current WAAS GPS source and for Canada you can get a Diversity unit.  (Not required now and may be delayed again, but I think eventually Canada is going to require it since they can't easily put in Ground Stations everywhere in the North.) 

 

I would not recommend the tail beacon.  The only experience I have had with them has been bad. It’s a budget solution that backfired.  Get something that has in, and out. It’s just a better solution. 

[MikeOH]

2 hours ago, Schllc said:

I would not recommend the tail beacon.  The only experience I have had with them has been bad. It’s a budget solution that backfired.  Get something that has in, and out. It’s just a better solution. 

I highly recommend the uAvionox TailBeacon. It’s a low cost solution ($2200 with tax and install) that was super easy to install and has worked flawlessly. I have an iPad with separate $200 receiver for ADSB In.

I saw no reason to spend thousands more to satisfy the mandate…and I still don’t!

[PeteMc]

4 hours ago, Schllc said:

I would not recommend the tail beacon.  The only experience I have had with them has been bad. It’s a budget solution that backfired.  Get something that has in, and out. It’s just a better solution. 

What issues did you have and did you reach out to uAvionox to see if they could resolve the issues?  I've never worked with them (I have a Diversity GTX345), but I usually only hear good things about them.  Limited to Out Only, but for people that need an inexpensive solution if they occasionally fly into airspace where ADS-B out is required it seems like a simple fix.

But agree that there are a better higher end solutions like the 345 or 375 that I recommended, if you've got the budget.

 

[Schllc]

18 minutes ago, PeteMc said:

What issues did you have and did you reach out to uAvionox to see if they could resolve the issues? 

 

I didn’t purchase one, and I wouldn’t.
A plane I fly regularly has one and it’s been a problem. It works intermittently without explanation, the app says it’s working fine but it isn’t. 

Is it cheaper?  Yes.  Does it work for most people?  Apparently.  
Would I recommend it?  No. 
I do not like flying without traffic, an additional 4 or 5k is a rounding error in ownership costs, especially for the benefits it provides. 
I’m glad the uavionics products work for those here who bought them, my experience is not good. 
To each their own. 

[MikeOH]

I occasionally run a PAPR and it always comes back fine.

If I wanted to fly out of the country or in the flight levels then I would have been forced into a more expensive solution.

Beyond that, what other benefits and compelling reasons are there for spending significantly more?

[MikeOH]

Just now, bluehighwayflyer said:

So do I and same here.  The biggest benefit I can see of one of the other more expensive solutions would be getting rid of your legacy mode C transponder, encoder, and portable ADS-B “in” receiver.  But to that end, of course, the TailBeacon X would be another very attractive option for many of us.  

Exactly!

If I ever get up the courage to fly outside the US the TailBeacon X is my plan.

[Schllc]

5 hours ago, MikeOH said:

Beyond that, what other benefits and compelling reasons are there for spending significantly more?

Traffic & weather. 

[PeteMc]

8 hours ago, Schllc said:

Traffic & weather. 

Personally I agree that I like it all in one box.  Hence my GTX345 Diversity installation.

But from all accounts the TailBeacon is a great fit for those that just want the legal requirement and quite possibly do most of their flying where it's not even required.

As for Traffic & Wx...  I had both for a few years before my panel upgrade.  You don't need a panel installation to get either.  Yes, an extra gizmo to have to carry around and hook up if you don't want to leave it in the plane (as I did), but a lot of people stick whatever ADS-B receiver they have in the plane and leave it. 

As for the installation in the plane you fly, sounds like either a defective unit or a poor installation.  But it sounds like something that needs to be looked into on the owners side, not something to trash the TailBeacon that apparently works as reliable as any of the Garmin gear as there are a percentage of those installations that are also defective out of the box.

[MikeOH]

9 hours ago, Schllc said:

Traffic & weather. 

Which I have with my $200 Scout ADSB-in receiver

[MikeOH]

54 minutes ago, PeteMc said:

 But it sounds like something that needs to be looked into on the owners side, not something to trash the TailBeacon that apparently works as reliable as any of the Garmin gear as there are a percentage of those installations that are also defective out of the box.

Exactly!

 

[Hank]

1 hour ago, PeteMc said:

But from all accounts the TailBeacon is a great fit for those that just want the legal requirement and quite possibly do most of their flying where it's not even required.

I fly so little in ADSB-required airspace that I don't have anything. Maybe once a year? And the FAA has a preflight approval process for those, but I've not tried to fly into and out of on the same day, for example a trip to Spruce under the ATL Bravo. But had no trouble getting into and out of Tampa for the Mooney Summit.

But I may break down and get a Tailbeacon, especially if I can find an inexpensive, compatible ASBD-In device with traffic and weather display. So far, the Stormscope hasn't let me down yet, although I did go through one cloud where the rain was so hard (did I hear hail? No paint damage, though.) that I asked ATC for diversions after that while coming home from Tampa. 

[Will.iam]

I was fortunate enough that the previous owner put in a gtx-345. Pulling up wx and digital atis is awesome! I no longer have to listen to two frequencies and try to hear through the static when I’m too far away. Plus i can get the atis from any range out. Having it call out traffic when it’s a threat is a hugh safety bonus especially flying around dfw where there is so much traffic compressed below the class B shelves and so many small airports around. 

[EricJ]

52 minutes ago, Hank said:

I fly so little in ADSB-required airspace that I don't have anything. Maybe once a year? And the FAA has a preflight approval process for those, but I've not tried to fly into and out of on the same day, for example a trip to Spruce under the ATL Bravo. But had no trouble getting into and out of Tampa for the Mooney Summit.

But I may break down and get a Tailbeacon, especially if I can find an inexpensive, compatible ASBD-In device with traffic and weather display. So far, the Stormscope hasn't let me down yet, although I did go through one cloud where the rain was so hard (did I hear hail? No paint damage, though.) that I asked ATC for diversions after that while coming home from Tampa. 

I'd suggest it's worth it just to make you more visible to other traffic that have ADS-B-in for situational awareness.

[Hank]

1 hour ago, EricJ said:

I'd suggest it's worth it just to make you more visible to other traffic that have ADS-B-in for situational awareness.

Too many people keep their attention on the TVs in their panel. But it's everyone's job to LOOK OUT THE WINDOWS AND SEE WHERE YOU'RE GOING! Getting a TV for me to watch is pretty low on my priority list, and it will do little to improve safety. 

Looking out the window improves in-flight safety. In crowded airspace, so does flight following and IFR flight plans; but even when IFR, if conditions are VMC it's still up to the pilot to use eyes out the windows to maintain separation. 

[LANCECASPER]

16 minutes ago, Hank said:

Too many people keep their attention on the TVs in their panel. But it's everyone's job to LOOK OUT THE WINDOWS AND SEE WHERE YOU'RE GOING! Getting a TV for me to watch is pretty low on my priority list, and it will do little to improve safety. 

Looking out the window improves in-flight safety. In crowded airspace, so does flight following and IFR flight plans; but even when IFR, if conditions are VMC it's still up to the pilot to use eyes out the windows to maintain separation. 

Nothing wrong with looking out the window, but getting traffic alerts, audible and visual, helped me to appreciate how very few I could actually see looking out the window,

[EricJ]

24 minutes ago, Hank said:

Too many people keep their attention on the TVs in their panel. But it's everyone's job to LOOK OUT THE WINDOWS AND SEE WHERE YOU'RE GOING! Getting a TV for me to watch is pretty low on my priority list, and it will do little to improve safety. 

Looking out the window improves in-flight safety. In crowded airspace, so does flight following and IFR flight plans; but even when IFR, if conditions are VMC it's still up to the pilot to use eyes out the windows to maintain separation. 

You misunderstood me.   Many, many people use ADS-B-in to improve situational awareness with other traffic.    Many traffic targets show up on displays that one would likely not see otherwise, or not see nearly as soon, so it is a very useful tool to have.    Having ADS-B-out makes YOU visible to far more other airplanes than you would be otherwise, which absolutely increases safety.   It is entirely possible and practiced every day to look out the window and at tools you have available in the cockpit.   Make yourself as visible as possible.

 

[glbtrottr]

Garmin Garmin ugh garmin.

I still resent the ganes they played lobbying to make ADSB mandatory and then practically monopolizing the space.

Worse, fanboys continue to give them millions because oh the stuff is so cool…

I gave them thousands for a shiny 430, gmx200, gsn480, gdl69, gtx330 when it was all the rage. They rewarded me by discontinuing service for the 430 and 480 even though fiscally they had no reason to do so beyond profiteering with new product. While both 480 and 430 support ADSB just fine, they killed support .

No thanks.

When I buy an airplane, a tailbeacon does the trick. If I have time I will grab a navworx 113 from the shelf, or a free flight 978, a nice sl70, and pin up the harness- ADSB in displays just fine on a used MX20 from eBay for $200. A gtx 33es or 330es provides compliance just fine, so there’s that. Gtx327’s work well as control panels too for non garmin ADSB panel mounted solutions.

I’ll save the gtx 345’s for my mooney or seneca - and even then I’ll try alternate solutions. Garmin can’t even keep up with production in their Chinese factories - try getting your hands on a 345 this minute.

Nope, I’ll avoid shiny garmin like the plague. All you all can keep up with the joneses…a scout, stratus or else in my monster 12” iPad does fine if I must


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Will.iam]

32 minutes ago, Hank said:

Too many people keep their attention on the TVs in their panel. But it's everyone's job to LOOK OUT THE WINDOWS AND SEE WHERE YOU'RE GOING! Getting a TV for me to watch is pretty low on my priority list, and it will do little to improve safety. 

Looking out the window improves in-flight safety. In crowded airspace, so does flight following and IFR flight plans; but even when IFR, if conditions are VMC it's still up to the pilot to use eyes out the windows to maintain separation. 

You don’t have to look at the screen. If the traffic is within a set limit in the ads-b my gtx-345 will tell me through my headset traffic 2 o’clock guiding me to focus my attention in that area to find the traffic. It’s an especially quick attention getter to look outside if at that moment i was changing a frequency or looking at my instruments as let’s face it you can’t always be looking outside all the time it’s just not practical and even if you could there is a vision complacently that you have to fight by not staring at one thing too long or not starting long enough to see the object. What’s really eye opening are the times you have to deviate from your IFR altitude because the controller got busy with something else and you had to get the separation vertically yourself although that is very rare its a last layer of defense to breaking the chain of a midair collision. 

[Schllc]

I think for me it was just the shock of seeing how much traffic was actually out there, that I never really saw before. 
There is probably at a minimum of 30% of airspace( if not more) that you cannot see, no matter how close they are, nor how hard you look. 
good example was that Malibu and 172( maybe a 150) that  ran in to each other on approach. High wing under a low wing…

The OP was asking for recommendations, there are very good reasons to have Adsb in and out, it’s easier to see on your primary navigation device than an iPad or iPhone,  seeing traffic and being seen by traffic is inarguably safer.  
The tail beacon obviously does what it advertises for most buyers, it just doesn’t do much. 
It doesn’t upset me that some don’t agree with my recommendation.

I also don’t love the fact that Garmin is somewhat monopolizing the industry, but their stuff works, and the support is good. 

I doubt seriously garmin stopping support for products that are 30 years old is a nefarious plot to force people to upgrade, they are a business and probably like to make money, and at some point most electronic devices are too old for reasonable support. 
That being said, I’m sure the market will be ripe with working replacements as other people upgrade for most of us posting here’s natural lives.  

[Fly Boomer]

1 hour ago, LANCECASPER said:

Nothing wrong with looking out the window, but getting traffic alerts, audible and visual, helped me to appreciate how very few I could actually see looking out the window,

Everybody I know who bought some kind of device that displays traffic says the same thing -- "Where did all those airplanes come from?"

[Skates97]

5 hours ago, MikeOH said:

Which I have with my $200 Scout ADSB-in receiver

I built a Stratux for under $200 over 6 years ago when I was doing my PPL. It has been working and providing traffic and weather to my tablets ever since, no issues. Like you said, no need to spend the big bucks for traffic and weather in.