Help me decide - Manual vs Electric Gear

[gwav8or]

I'm in the market for my first Mooney.  The more I read, watch, etc about Mooneys the more I want one.  I flew one about 6 years ago and was impressed with the speed, simplicity and ease of flying it.  I mean, if i can fly it, anybody can! lol. The one I flew had the Johnson bar gear and I told myself after that one flight, if I ever bought a Mooney I wanted the J bar.  However, I've talked to a few people that are true believers in the Dukes transmission/actuator.  I've talked to some saying the J bar is more prone to issues than the electric gear.  Of course there are those that have the opposite opinion.  I'm looking for an F. I like the 9 inch stretch and the IO-360.  Some have the J bar and some are electric.  How do I decide?  One voice inside me is saying don't compromise, stay with what you want and get the J bar.  The other voice is saying, don't be dumb, go for the electric gear.

I know this topic has been beat to death but a quick search and I didn't really find the right thread so feel free to point me to that thread if it exists.

1. How reliable is the J bar gear and what issues are there?

2. Are there really any major issues with the electric?  I'm assuming there is a manual extension?

[kortopates]

the j-bar is no less reliable than the electric. think of the electric as a j-bar with an electrical motor as they are otherwise very identical. the electric does have a emergency manual extension.

it’s your personal preference.

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[neilpilot]

Don't make your decision based on the gear.  Given that the market is typically limited, base your decision on how the panel is equipped and overall condition. 

[201Steve]

Short take: if you are basing which plane you buy primarily on the mechanism for which the gear is raised and lowered, you are focused on the wrong thing. They are both fully capable of doing their job of raising and lowering the wheels. Find the best bird you can possibly find for your budget and accept whichever gear actuating mechanism it comes with. 
Sure, the manual system is “neat” and “less prone to failure” etc. but there’s a reason no manufacturers are making new planes with them. 

[Mooneymite]

16 minutes ago, neilpilot said:

Don't make your decision based on the gear.  Given that the market is typically limited, base your decision on how the panel is equipped and overall condition. 

Absolutely!  Find the Mooney you like and either gear system is fine.

My C has the electric gear, I originally wanted the manual, but bought the C because it had everything else I wanted and "accepted" the electric gear.  Flash forward 23 years:  my bursitis now is extremely grateful for the electric gear and other than the AD (which is really just routine maintenance), the gear has been completely trouble free.

There is probably a reason that Mooney moved away from the manual gear.

[EricJ]

+1 that they both have pluses and minuses.   My personal preference is for the electric gear, but you're right that you'll hear religious dogma from either side.   Find a good airplane you like and don't worry about which type of gear it has unless you personally have a preference.

If you get a J bar, make sure the gear is rigged correctly and the locks (especially the down lock) are in good condition.   Electric systems seem less sensitive to rigging issues and don't have the lock problems.   They have actuator gear wear and back spring issues, which are also not Big Deals and are very managable.

 

Edited March 13, 2022 by EricJ

[DCarlton]

1 hour ago, Mooneymite said:

Absolutely!  Find the Mooney you like and either gear system is fine.

My C has the electric gear, I originally wanted the manual, but bought the C because it had everything else I wanted and "accepted" the electric gear.  Flash forward 23 years:  my bursitis now is extremely grateful for the electric gear and other than the AD (which is really just routine maintenance), the gear has been completely trouble free.

There is probably a reason that Mooney moved away from the manual gear.

Same story for me and my F.  

[Culver LFA]

Well, I’ve had both electric and manual (in the same airplane) and I don’t regret the decision to convert my F back to Johnson bar one bit.

I do not agree with the opinion that the manual gear is as maintenance intensive or failure prone as the electric gear, it is a much simpler and lighter system.  The up and down blocks wear and can cause issues, sure, but if you ignore any worn out part long enough it’s not the components fault for failure it is yours. At least you can easily inspect these parts before flight without a labor intensive AD being required between annuals. 
When it comes down to buying the right airplane, especially right now with such limited inventory, don’t base it off the manual or electric gear. Get the absolute best airplane you can find and take whatever gear configuration it is equipped with.

[Culver LFA]

1 hour ago, Mooneymite said:

There is probably a reason that Mooney moved away from the manual gear.

I agree Gus, I think the reason was marketing to keep up with the advancements of the competition. Flipping a gear switch makes you feel like you’re flying an airliner!

[RLCarter]

Like others have said, buy the BEST plane for the money. And if your lucky it will have manual gear ….

[FlySafe]

gwav8or,

Agree with @DCarlton, both opotions are good, electric great for those with or at risk of bursitis ;).  i've flown with both, love the manual for its simplicity but now that i'm older and as a cfi finding the electric has advantages such as being able to fly from right seat and manage the gear without having to be a contortionist. Rember, risk of gear up landings about same for either...three gear down an locked checks on every landing  happy hunting

 

[FlySafe]

sorry that was a quote from @Mooneymite, "Absolutely!  Find the Mooney you like and either gear system is fine."

[MikeOH]

Chiming in late...but, I was faced with the exact situation 5 years ago: I wanted an F with manual gear.  I looked at a LOT of planes before finding mine; it had everything I wanted BUT had electric gear!  I bought it anyway as the REST of the plane and its condition was way more important than what kind of gear it had.  I have not regretted the decision (i.e. the electric gear has been trouble free!)

The F does not have the no back spring of the J and later models, but the Dukes transmission in the F has 100/200 hour periodic maintenance requirements (inspection and lubing with special moly grease) that you do NOT want to skip!

And, the gear is nearly as quick as the J bar! (I have many hours in a J-bar M20B)

IMHO, you'll be happy with either one; just don't make the buy decision on the gear!

[gwav8or]

Thank you everyone!!! Fantastic group of people here in the Mooney Space! Y’all seem to be more friendly than the folks over in the Piper forums where I used to hang out when I had a Piper.

I’ve added the electric gear back into my search and may have a lead on one already! I’ll let y’all know when I finally get my Mooney!


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[KLudwick]

Echoing pretty much what everyone else has said - there are plusses and minuses to both.  I've owned my '71E with electric gear for four years and absolutely love it.  I also did transition training for multiple new J-bar Mooney owners last year, and they all love their machines (and J-bar gear) too (many are on this forum).  You'll end up liking whichever system your new-to-you Mooney has installed! 

[Niko182]

Id do manual just because of the no backspring SB.

[icurnmedic]

Mine is manual, which I like fine.

but would have preferred electric.

like others have said, buy the plane and panel, not the gear

[0TreeLemur]

Tonight on a flight back from Gulf Shores after takeoff my Hobbs log booklet fell down on the floor without me noticing.  Made locking the gear up impossible because it was under the J bar.  Co-pilot got flashlight and fished it out.  I couldn't see it.    You won't have that problem with electric gear...  That said, I don't mind the manual gear.

[A64Pilot]

Probably less likely to forget to put manual gear down. Other thing I’ve not heard is that manual gear takes up room

Edited March 14, 2022 by A64Pilot

[Hank]

12 minutes ago, A64Pilot said:

Probably less likely to forget to put manual gear down. Other thing I’ve not heard is that manual gear takes up room

The electric gear allows me to keep lunch / snacks / beverages between the seats. I used to keep sectionals there, and approach plates sideways below the quadrant. None of that is possible with the J-bar.

[gwav8or]

The electric gear allows me to keep lunch / snacks / beverages between the seats. I used to keep sectionals there, and approach plates sideways below the quadrant. None of that is possible with the J-bar.

Probably the best reason I’ve heard to go with electric gear. Gotta have some snacks!


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[Browncbr1]

I have a jbar F.  When I bought it, the market allowed the ability to seek it out.  I prefer the jbar.   In this market, get the best non-corrosion plane you can find and live with it.   The only draw back to the jbar is you have to watch out that nothing is in the way of swinging the bar.  

[Skates97]

1 hour ago, Hank said:

The electric gear allows me to keep lunch / snacks / beverages between the seats. I used to keep sectionals there, and approach plates sideways below the quadrant. None of that is possible with the J-bar.

 

25 minutes ago, gwav8or said:

Probably the best reason I’ve heard to go with electric gear. Gotta have some snacks!

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In the short body the back seat is close enough the small cooler which is known as the "feed bag" stays on the backseat and is easily within reach.

If you don't plan to be flying with 3-4 seats filled all the time I would open your search up to the C and E's as well. You can also put 4 adults in the short body planes. My wife and I are both 5,10" and my youngest son is 5'9" and sits behind either of us just fine, even on long trips.

[kortopates]

Probably less likely to forget to put manual gear down. Other thing I’ve not heard is that manual gear takes up room

You would think so but the gear up landing statistics are evenly divided between manual and electric.

plus it seems gears folding on landing is more common on the manual gear. (perhaps just more deferred maintenance on the older manual gear planes though).


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[gwav8or]

In the short body the back seat is close enough the small cooler which is known as the "feed bag" stays on the backseat and is easily within reach.
If you don't plan to be flying with 3-4 seats filled all the time I would open your search up to the C and E's as well. You can also put 4 adults in the short body planes. My wife and I are both 5,10" and my youngest son is 5'9" and sits behind either of us just fine, even on long trips.

I’m leaning towards the IO-360 for 200 HP. Is there a 200HP version of the C?


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