M20J Main Gear Tire and Tube Recommendations

[SARNorm]

I am a new Mooney owner (1979 M20J) and want to replace the main gear tires and tubes. A friend (who doesn't fly Mooney's) suggested the Desser Retread Monsters. Does anyone have any experience with these tires? Will they fit in the M20J wheel wells? If not the Desser's, other recommendations? Any recommendations for tubes? And, what valve type (straight, 90 degrees, etc.) works best? Thanks for the information and help.

[201er]

Air Hawks and Michelin Airstop cause I fly a lot and rub out the tires sooner than age. And because a leaky tube is a lame reason for unplanned mx or downtime.

[carusoam]

Iirc…

The Monsters have extra tread on them?

Extra tread makes the diameter change…

I think there are discussions around here for that…

 

Why did somebody recommend them?

 

Mooneys don’t typically use a lot of tread… until you start flying around the world… (note for 201er… )

Most often run into challenges regarding UV ‘checking’… after a decade…

 

PP thoughts only, not a mechanic…

-a-

[201er]

32 minutes ago, bluehighwayflyer said:

You will get a million opinions on this but I go with Goodyear Flight Custom III tires with Michelin Air Stop tubes. They probably cost the most but they are the best and it is great only having to add air once between annual inspections.  Frankly, they last so long that their cost differential with the cheaper options isn’t worth even considering to me, and I proudly identify as a Mooney Cheap Bastard! 

Until you flat spot a $250 tire… much less painful when it’s a $125 Airhawk

The expensive tubes are worth it though. Unless you pinch it going on. Then you’ll have a bad day.

[N201MKTurbo]

1 hour ago, SARNorm said:

I am a new Mooney owner (1979 M20J) and want to replace the main gear tires and tubes. A friend (who doesn't fly Mooney's) suggested the Desser Retread Monsters. Does anyone have any experience with these tires? Will they fit in the M20J wheel wells? If not the Desser's, other recommendations? Any recommendations for tubes? And, what valve type (straight, 90 degrees, etc.) works best? Thanks for the information and help.

Do not put monster retreads on a Mooney! They will damage your plane. If you want retreads, get the regular retreads, not the monsters.

[carusoam]

Jim is just tempting the tire gods….   

-a-

[Hank]

On 1/16/2022 at 10:40 PM, carusoam said:

Jim is just tempting the tire gods….   

-a-

I'm not saying anything, cause my experience is only 1/3 of his . . . .

Air Stop tubes, certainly! But I buy regular Goodyear Flight Custom tires. Going up in number raises both price and rated groundspeed, and -III tires are rated to roll on the runway at my cruise speed, well above Vg. So I save a few bucks.

I keep Flight Hawk tire on the nose wheel, with Air Stop tubes. Next change I may move to Goodyear, since I'm no longer based where every takeoff & landing requires back taxi and 180° turn.

[SARNorm]

Thanks to all for the good information and logical explanations. Very helpful.

[jaylw314]

On 1/16/2022 at 7:10 PM, SARNorm said:

I am a new Mooney owner (1979 M20J) and want to replace the main gear tires and tubes. A friend (who doesn't fly Mooney's) suggested the Desser Retread Monsters. Does anyone have any experience with these tires? Will they fit in the M20J wheel wells? If not the Desser's, other recommendations? Any recommendations for tubes? And, what valve type (straight, 90 degrees, etc.) works best? Thanks for the information and help.

Watch out, the mains require straight valve tubes and the nose requires 90 deg valve tubes.  Unless it's the other way around, dangit, I can't remember, but I do know the two are different.

[Yetti]

The Type Certificate Data Sheet determines what size of tires go on your plane.   All the tires sold by Dresser are FAA approved by PMA.   https://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgMakeModel.nsf/Frameset?OpenPage

[Andy95W]

The Airstop tubes are really good, but they’re not the only ones made of Butyl rubber.

I just changed my main tires and tubes last June.  I bought the Aero Classic Leakguard tubes that are also made of Butyl rubber.  I bought the Leakguard tubes because I wanted the 70° angle metal valve for my old wheels.

7 months and an ambient air temperature drop of almost 80° and I’ve only had to add air once- which is as good as my old Airstops.  (They’re also $33 cheaper than the Airstops, but that was a secondary consideration.)

[MisfitSELF]

On 1/16/2022 at 7:17 PM, 201er said:

Air Hawks and Michelin Airstop cause I fly a lot and rub out the tires sooner than age. And because a leaky tube is a lame reason for unplanned mx or downtime.

+1 for this combo.  I used to have to service my right tire every 2 weeks or less, now they only drop 1-2 psi in six months. 

I was also one of those "I've never flat spotted a tire cause I'm god's gift to aviation" type of guys until I flat spotted a tire in stiff cross winds.  It only takes a fraction of a second of being on brake at the wrong moment and your expensive tire becomes a hangar story.

[StevenL757]

On 1/16/2022 at 10:10 PM, SARNorm said:

I am a new Mooney owner (1979 M20J) and want to replace the main gear tires and tubes. A friend (who doesn't fly Mooney's) suggested the Desser Retread Monsters. Does anyone have any experience with these tires? Will they fit in the M20J wheel wells? If not the Desser's, other recommendations? Any recommendations for tubes? And, what valve type (straight, 90 degrees, etc.) works best? Thanks for the information and help.

Michelin Air tubes and tires.  I've been through 2 sets of Goodyear FC3s, and they typically give a harder ride vs. the Michelins.  Don't muck about and skimp on these.  Saving a couple of dollars isn't worth it.  You get what you pay for.

[201er]

49 minutes ago, MisfitSELF said:

I was also one of those "I've never flat spotted a tire cause I'm god's gift to aviation" type of guys until I flat spotted a tire in stiff cross winds.  It only takes a fraction of a second of being on brake at the wrong moment and your expensive tire becomes a hangar story.

Thing is, I don't think you need to touch the brakes to slowly develop a flat spot. They have a tendency to touchdown on the same spot every time, so it gets worn harder than everywhere else. I've noticed this on every set of tires I've had including the Goodyear III's. Whatever spot reaches cord first is the end of your tire, even if there's a bunch left everywhere else.

The Goodyear Flight Custom III are 2x the price of Air Hawks. From what I heard and my own experience, they last 2x the number of landings. From a maintenance perspective, that's half the work and should be slightly better value that way. However, they're already pulling the wheels at annuals so if you get it replaced then, it doesn't add anything. However, a flat spot from braking or repeated touchdown wear can end the tire's life early. For this reason, replacing the half price airhawks twice as often is my preferred way to go.

[Bunti]

Since about 4.5  years, I have a set of normal Desser tires (not the monster) installed on my Mooney M20F. In comparison to the tires I used before the Desser tires give me the impression that they last very long. It looks to me that the material the Dessers are made from is somehow better or harder. The old ones used some tread over the time and even developed a spot once in a while. If needed, I would replace them again with a set of Dessers.

[kortopates]

37 minutes ago, 201er said:

However, they're already pulling the wheels at annuals so if you get it replaced then, it doesn't add anything.

Pulling the wheel to pack the bearings is no where near the same labor to spit the wheel and mount a new tire and tube. Not that either of these is a big job,  but mounting new tires and tubes certainly adds labor. 

[RobertGary1]

Spend good money on tubes. Tire brands for light planes make no difference. AirHawks will last as long as anything. Been running them for 25 years. 

[RobertGary1]

1 hour ago, StevenL757 said:

Michelin Air tubes and tires.  I've been through 2 sets of Goodyear FC3s, and they typically give a harder ride vs. the Michelins.  Don't muck about and skimp on these.  Saving a couple of dollars isn't worth it.  You get what you pay for.

Do you fly your Mooney or just taxi it around? I can’t imagine noticing or caring how smooth the taxi out to the runway is. 

[jaylw314]

51 minutes ago, bluehighwayflyer said:

Do you guys buy cheap tires for your cars because you might pick up a nail, too?   If not you probably should be.  I pick up nails in my car tires all of the time.  

I do, my OEM tires were amazing near-slick tires that were $250 each when one came apart on the highway, probably from road debris.  Since I have AWD, that would have ben about $1300 to replace everything with the OEM tires.

I ended up using Kumho's (a budget Korean brand) for 10 years.  They cost about $600 for a set of 4, and I had to replace a set twice due to road debris (clearly I'm a magnet for the stuff), but was happy with them otherwise.

Edited January 18, 2022 by jaylw314

[jaylw314]

3 minutes ago, bluehighwayflyer said:

Fair enough.  My wife’s AWD Mercedes E class absolutely eats tires.  20 to 25 thousand miles max.   I gave up on expensive tires for it years ago.  

Ooof, imagine having the 4WD version and having to replace all 4 in a go.  That's AMU territory right there 

[KB4]

3 hours ago, kortopates said:

Pulling the wheel to pack the bearings is no where near the same labor to spit the wheel and mount a new tire and tube.

Really?  It’s like 3 nuts torqued to around 7 ft.lb.  and takes less than 5 minutes to split.   Get a bead breaker make quick work. 

[KB4]

3 hours ago, kortopates said:

Pulling the wheel to pack the bearings is no where near the same labor to spit the wheel and mount a new tire and tube.

Really?  It’s like 3 nuts torqued to around 7 ft.lb.  and takes less than 5 minutes to split.   Get a bead breaker make quick work. 

[carusoam]

4 hours ago, KB4 said:

Really?  It’s like 3 nuts torqued to around 7 ft.lb.  and takes less than 5 minutes to split.   Get a bead breaker make quick work. 

Paul MAY know that already….  
 

Can you seen his signature line?  
 

Best regards,

-a-

[cliffy]

The wheels on Moneys were designed for "short" valve stem tires   You can't find them any more The long stem tires bend the valve body at the bear race hub and put a strain on the outside of the bend so as they age they crack on that side culminating in a flat tire . Many flats happen because of this one item.

One way "some" find to alleviate this condition is in using 8.00x6   tubes with 90 degree angled  metal valve stems on the main wheels. For those who go this way it seems to work very well for years. 

Check the TCDS sheet for your  airplane model to determine what size and PLY rating is approved for your airplane.

[Andy95W]

1 hour ago, cliffy said:

 

One way "some" find to alleviate this condition is in using 8.00x6   tubes with 90 degree angled  metal valve stems on the main wheels. For those who go this way it seems to work very well for years. 

 

 

Not to take away from what Cliffy said, but the tube below works awesome.  The 70° stem fits great for the old “vintage” wheels.  The Leakguard is at least comparable to the Airstop by Michelin for not leaking air pressure.  This is the tube that @Jim Peace should have requested for his M20C.

 

https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/lgpages/aero_06-03303.php

Edited January 20, 2022 by Andy95W