J model LED nav lights

[PLB]

Anyone installed the wonderful Whelen OR 500 & OR 650 LED nav/strobe lights on a J model?  If so, how did you get it signed off in the log book? It seems they are STC'd for the Mooney, all except the J model.  An IA will not sign it off because of that. The only option I'm told is to get a DER to sign it off which can/will cost several hundred to a couple thousand dollars. Suggestions?

[N231BN]

An STC wasn't necessary for J-models and later because they came from the factory with TSO approved strobes. The Orion is a TSO approved anti-collision light system, no approval is necessary for replacing TSO equipment with functionally-similar TSO equipment.

[PT20J]

Also be aware of the peculiar circuit that Mooney used for dimming the landing gear annunciator. It depends on current flowing through the low resistance of the nav light bulb filaments when the nav lights are off in order for the annunciator to not be dim all the time. It is described in the Service and Maintenance Manual and there are threads hereabouts that describe work arounds. Since your IA seems picky, you might want to discuss this with him.

Skip

[jaylw314]

6 hours ago, PLB said:

Anyone installed the wonderful Whelen OR 500 & OR 650 LED nav/strobe lights on a J model?  If so, how did you get it signed off in the log book? It seems they are STC'd for the Mooney, all except the J model.  An IA will not sign it off because of that. The only option I'm told is to get a DER to sign it off which can/will cost several hundred to a couple thousand dollars. Suggestions?

I had mine installed at annual, and my IA/A&P just signed it off as a minor modification.

Also watch out, if you have the later J model with the wingtip fairings, you need the Orion 650E.  If you have the flat tip wings, you use the 650's.

 

[PeytonM]

I did a search and could not find the thread for my problem; I know I’ve seen it!
After installing LEDs for Nav & strobes, now my Gear Down annunciator light is dim, regardless of whether Nav lights are on or not. I’d be just fine if it was bright all the time.  

[A64Pilot]

Since it seems it’s a 28V bulb installed in the 14V aircraft, I wonder if simply installing a 14V bulb would fix the issue?

[carusoam]

12 minutes ago, PeytonM said:

I did a search and could not find the thread for my problem; I know I’ve seen it!
After installing LEDs for Nav & strobes, now my Gear Down annunciator light is dim, regardless of whether Nav lights are on or not. I’d be just fine if it was bright all the time.  

Peyton,

keep in mind what turns on/off the dimmer function in many Mooneys….

The act of turning on the nav lights… tells the annunciator panel to go into a dimmed mode…

Going LED seems to interrupt this function…

 

Possible solution… find the wire that automatically dims the light and attach it to something else… that only gets used at night…

 

I am a big fan of using nav lights during the day… but it does turn down my Green gear down light…. That I like to use on short final…

 

Hope that helps…

Best regards,

-a-

[Hank]

10 minutes ago, PeytonM said:

I did a search and could not find the thread for my problem; I know I’ve seen it!
After installing LEDs for Nav & strobes, now my Gear Down annunciator light is dim, regardless of whether Nav lights are on or not. I’d be just fine if it was bright all the time.  

My panel dims with the landing light, not the nav lights. Then again, I have a C, not a J. Just one more thing to check.

[ZuluZulu]

On 11/13/2021 at 7:32 PM, PT20J said:

Also be aware of the peculiar circuit that Mooney used for dimming the landing gear annunciator. It depends on current flowing through the low resistance of the nav light bulb filaments when the nav lights are off in order for the annunciator to not be dim all the time. It is described in the Service and Maintenance Manual and there are threads hereabouts that describe work arounds. Since your IA seems picky, you might want to discuss this with him.

Skip

Skip -- I know this is an old post, but which workaround do you recommend, if any?  The dim annunciator light with LEDs on is something I would like to fix but since I'm only in Year 2 of my ownership, the list is still quite long...  @PT20J

[PT20J]

2 hours ago, ZuluZulu said:

Skip -- I know this is an old post, but which workaround do you recommend, if any?  The dim annunciator light with LEDs on is something I would like to fix but since I'm only in Year 2 of my ownership, the list is still quite long...  @PT20J

The simplest solution is to keep one incandescent bulb in the circuit. If that isn’t feasible, I would have a relay installed. Any good avionics shop should be able to figure it out. Also, there is an old thread on MS where someone provided the details on their implementation.

Skip

[PeytonM]

I am at my wits’ end on this! 1989J/28V, enclosed wingtips. I had the Whelens installed late last year, but did not wire tail position light because no wire there. Lights good and Gear Down light bright.
 

THEN at avionics upgrade, I had them run a wire to the tail to add white position light. They also upgraded strobe lights to shielded wiring and added synch wires to strobes. 

Now my Gear Down light is always dim. AND my LEFT white position light is inop; measured connector w/VOM and no power to the connector for white  position light.  Red LED position light ok.

Both RIGHT wing position lights ok. We also disconnected tail LED position light, to no avail. 
 

Suggestions, please.

 

[PeytonM]

I still have NO resolution to my dim Gear Down light: it’s always dim! Any thoughts?

SERVICE AND MAINTENANCE MANUAL.pdf

 

[PT20J]

50 minutes ago, PeytonM said:

I still have NO resolution to my dim Gear Down light: it’s always dim! Any thoughts?

SERVICE AND MAINTENANCE MANUAL.pdf

 

Best solution is to have avionics shop install a relay. Any good shop should be able to figure it out. You have the appropriate page from the manual.

[carusoam]

LED lights may have something to do with it…

1) The usual incandescent nav lights when on, cause the annunciator panel to dim the gear’s green light….  Making it difficult to see during the day.  Based on a current measurement…(?)

2) With the nav lights off, the green light on the annunciator panel is nicely bright enough to see well during the day…

 

3) Beyond that… the maintenance manual has a full wiring diagram for the various annunciator panels that were ever produced….

4) We can also invite the Whelen guy to see if he has any insight….   @OSUAV8TER

5) Sounds like something is causing the annunciator panel to think it is dark out… and dimming the gear light…

6) to test the LED vs Incandescent theory… you might only need a temporary incandescent light hooked up to it…

Unfortunately, I don’t see the connection… but, somebody else armed with these details might….

PP thoughts only, not a mechanic… or electrician…

Best regards,

-a-

[Tommooney]

Maybe this could help: I spent a lot of money fixing the dash gear light that turned out, after a lot of shop time chasing it down, to the strobe voltage leaking thru the connector at wing tip to the 28V nav light thru the common connector. First local shop was a waste of time / money. Finally, months later at annual at Top Gun, Tom R figured it out. It was hard. It may be worth a look at the wingtip light electrical connectors.

Good luck

Tom