Be Careful Garmin - iPad Killer?

[N33GG]

First, let me say that I have been a fan of Garmin for a long time, and still am.  That said, here we go...

I read the recent press release and ad copy for the 796 dubbed the iPad killer (I believe it was through AOPA).  There was a line that the iPad was a product that could take pictures, video chat, and internet surf (I am recalling from memory, so if I missed something a bit, apologies in advance, but that was the general impression I had from the ad).  The 796 is for aviation and aircraft, by golly, says Garmin! That ought to make everyone run to buy the 796 and put away the iPad, right?

Just by coincidence, I received my first iPad this week, and have been getting to know ForeFlight.  Hmmmmm....

OK Garmin, has it occured to you that the iPad is a rather successful product?  And its maker is Apple, a corporation that is now the largest in the USA (bigger than Exxon, if I have it right)?  If I were in charge of Garmin, I wouldn't throw anything that could be considered a challenge at Apple, because they just might think to themselves, "Hey, why don't we go after this aviation market?  Maybe introduce the G1000 killer?"  Wasn't it Jobs that developed Pixar?  Can you imagine the virtual terrain Apple could provide?  And I sure wouldn't want to challenge Apple with human interface, whether for the cockpit, or anywhere else.  Also, Apple can cram more capability into a smaller package than anyone I have ever seen. 

Throw rocks at the iPad (and hence Apple) if you want.  Kind of reminds me of when I was very young and thought it would be a good idea to stand off and throw a rock at a big wasp nest.  Never had to learn that lesson again. 

[panther1400]

I started off with WingX and sky radar and think it is great, how do you like foreflight?

[MATTS875]

George, I have a friend that has the ipad with foreflight and he loves it.He has a garmin 396 but likes the ipad for charts.One thing that I do like about foreflight is the options and the price cannot be beat.Garmin is a good product but they seem to charge high prices for every little thing whereas other companies are doing it at one low price. I am going with the ipad.I think he told me he pays like 149.00 per year.I think that is right...can't beat that.I am about to start my IFR training and looking at what my Garmin 430W updates are  ...scary.I think you made the right choice. and I am going with the same setup.which ipad did you get George?

[dougmilam]

Agree that Apple could build a great aviation device.

I find tablets great for backup charts of surrounding states, or the whole US for that matter, but when I am descending through real soup a paper chart is most comforting.  It may be a while before I give up my subscription.

[stevesm20b]

I think Garmin has an excellent product. But it's outrageous what they charge for all the updates. At least with the ipad you have a lot more options and your not paying every month for updates. It's amazing all the stuff that has come out recently for the ipad. Moving maps, charts, weather, synthetic vison. And it seems every month or two someone is coming out with something even better. All without reoccuring monthly fees. Garmin is going to have to lower their update fees if they want my business.  

[DaV8or]

I love the idea of an aviation specific tablet. One that oh, I don't know, you can read in direct sunlight and won't shut down because of overheating! I just wish it were someone other than Garmin making it. Their pricing reflects their "you need us more than we need you" attitude. Having said that, if I hadn't just invested in a 696, I would be very interested in the 796. The iPad is pretty cool and I like mine, but it still has a lot to be desired with regards to use in the cockpit IMO.

[N33GG]

I bought the top of the line 64GB with 3G iPad for a little over $800.   You need the 3G because it has a GPS chip in it that the non-3G units lack, and is needed for ForeFlight GPS performance (at least that is what I understand from all of my reading).  However, for now at least, I am not signing up for the AT&T wireless service, as I have internet at my home and business... seems to work great!  Like I said, I just got it, but I am blown away with the performance and ease of use, both iPad and ForeFlight are awesome.  Charts are beautiful and easy to read.  GPS performance is amazing.  And there is so much more capability that is there.  The basic package for ForeFlight is  $75 per year, and the PRO version is $150 per year.  I am using the basic for now, but you can upgrade anytime you want.  I suspect the basic will fit my needs just fine.  The ForeFlight website has a lot of good information.  BTW, I bought the highest memory because I use a lot (make that A LOT!) of pictures in my business.  Otherwise, ForeFlight recommends the 32GB.

I have stuck with my paper charts, but they are getting harder to find when I need something that I don't already have in a hurry.  Of course you can subscribe or mail order, but when you need one right now, fewer and fewer places are carrying them.  I was as reluctant as anyone to go the iPad route, but several of my flying friends have gone to the dark side, and well, I have given in to the temptation too.  I am planning to have a 430W added to my panel soon, and already have a 496 in a gizmo mount.  I guess I feel ok with that many nav aids and virtual charts in the cockpit.  For now I will certainly carry old charts in a case for backup, but I have a feeling they will get removed from the cockpit soon as well.

Aside from ForeFlight, the iPad is a typical Apple product, simply amazing capability and performance at an incredible price.  My heavy laptop is going to become a stationary fixture at either my home or business, because the iPad is just so easy to use.  An added plus is when you get a case with magnet sleep function, the thing turns on and off instantly when you open or close the case.  No more waiting for everything to power up and get ready for me to do work.  And the battery life is awesome.  I might add the 3G wireless plan if I decide I need it, but for now it doesn't seem to be an issue with all of the wi-fi available. 

Well done Apple, once again.  And thank you for another amazing product. 

[Jeff_S]

Quote: N6719N

 And its maker is Apple, a corporation that is now the largest in the USA (bigger than Exxon, if I have it right)?  

[rbridges]

I bought a bad elf for my non-3g ipad.  If you plan to get an ipad for foreflight (or whatever), you might as well spring for the 3g version.  The difference b/t a wifi version+bad elf and the 3g version is not much, and you don't have to worry about losing the bad elf.

[PTK]

The iPad and the 796 comparison is not apples to apples. They are at different levels. The 796 is in a class all by itself. The undisputed state of the art, latest and greatest dedicated aviation handheld GPS. The iPad is a state of the art latest and greatest tablet.  This means that the 796 hardware and software is 100% aviation and thus can be trusted to perform flawlessly in the cockpit. This is a huge statement the iPad cannot make. It is an all around ok tablet that will run software most of the time. 

Garmin is the leader in GA.  The 796, or anything else Garmin offers in aviation, has no competition. Hence the price difference. As always we get what we pay for.

The subscription for georeferenced plates on the 796 is $199 per year. Not all that bad for aviation dedicated backup. 

[Piloto]

But, but the iPad does not comes with a yoke mount or the XM\WX antenna or external GPS antenna option. Apple iPad is a great product but for aviation application the 796 definetly beat it.

José

[danb35]

Quote: N6719N

I bought the top of the line 64GB with 3G iPad for a little over $800.   You need the 3G because it has a GPS chip in it that the non-3G units lack, and is needed for ForeFlight GPS performance (at least that is what I understand from all of my reading).

[panther1400]

RAM Mounting Systems RAM-B-121-AP8U Ram Mount Yoke C-Clamp Mount for Apple iPad

[danb35]

Quote: allsmiles

This means that the 796 hardware and software is 100% aviation and thus can be trusted to perform flawlessly in the cockpit.

[panther1400]

Im using the Dual gps, just put it on the dash and turn it on, also bought a cigerette light to dual usb adapter to charge anything if needed, but so far with a 10 hour battery life no need to charge anywhere but at home.

[Earl]

I have an ipad with Foreflight and a 696.  One is better on the ground and for pre-flight planning (ipad) and the other is better in the air because of XM weather (696).  The 796 is not an ipad killer, it is a 696 killer.  I use the 696 for primary approach plates (excellent with georef) and the ipad/foreflight as my backup so I can safely go paperless.  Of course the 430 is my primary gps nav tool.  I've never had problems seeing my ipad once it is on bright and has never overheated and shut down.  Yes the 696 is expensive to keep updated but considering all the other costs of flying and owning a plane it is a drop in the bucket when you consider the safety factor.

[fantom]

Quote: allsmiles

Garmin is the leader in GA.  The 796, or anything else Garmin offers in aviation, has no competition. Hence the price difference. As always we get what we pay for.

 

ROTFLMAO......

[danb35]

Quote: fantom

[PTK]

Quote: danb35

[PTK]

Quote: fantom

[Parker_Woodruff]

I like an iPad for charts, and I like my GPS equipment in the panel.  The fact that the iPad has built in GPS for georeferencing on charts is nice, but I don't pay for the service on approach plates.

I don't feel comfortable using charts on an aviation GPS.  I want them in my lap and I don't want to pay Jepp/Garmin prices.

[danb35]

It's also important to remember that the app developers can add features to the iPad apps whenever they want.  The only thing the 796 does that the iPad simply can't do is integrate the XM receiver in the same box--with the iPad, it will be two separate (and somewhat bulky) devices in addition to the iPad itself.  OTOH, the iPad 2 has gyros built in, so it's entirely possible that a backup panel display could be coded that would be superior to any of the Garmin portables.

As it stands now, the 796 is a better in-flight navigator, and the iPad is a better EFB.  But the navigation functions can be added to the iPad if somebody codes them, and the EFB functions can't be added to the 796.

[DaV8or]

Quote: allsmiles

 Where would GA be without innovations from Garmin?

[jetdriven]

The original 430 was Apollo's idea

The ipad is the best 700$ we have spent on the plane. The aera does different things but it was comparable in price. The updates for the data are the same cost as the unit.   These 795s are getting out of hand.

Quote: DaV8or

Without Garmin, we'd still have Apollo and likely have better radios.

[danb35]

Quote: jetdriven