Coffee Grinder / Fred Flinstone belly light replacement

[nightmoves]

Hi everyone.

I have a '69 F which is having issues with the original coffee grinder anti-collision beacon. This has been an (expected) expensive first year of ownership so I'm looking to get out of this repair on the cheap.

My question is,

If I wanted to replace this with something that is 20 years old or so (non-LED), does anyone know what I should look for (on Ebay, Facebook, etc)? From time to time I see people selling their belly strobes on here when they upgrade to LED but I'm not sure what fits that hole / wires and what doesn't.

While I'm at it - does anyone have a said "new to me" replacement they want to sell?

 

Thanks to all for the help and suggestions.

 

[cbarnes403]

Early Beechcraft uses the same rotating beacon.

 

[carusoam]

NM go to the Whelen website...

They have a great explanation for what you need and why...

• coffee grinder was 60s Technology (Not very good ever)
• Strobe light was 90s Technology (good but expensive to maintain if the flash needs replacement)
• LED is current Technology (good and long lasting)

You have a standard hole or two. With the wires in place already.

If you want,  getting your existing coffee grinder to work takes cleaning out old grease and lubing properly.

I have a spare coffee grinder from my 65C that I offer all the time...

Nobody takes it...

Best regards,

-a-

[DXB]

@nightmoves  Here’s a cheap and highly functional option off my plane- sill available:

 

Let me know if interested! It was on a ‘68C so hole is likely the same. I can measure it though if you like.

[Bryan]

I have this out of a 14v airframe.

[Browncbr1]

My coffee grinder beacon occasionally breaks ground connection from soot or whatever that flows under the belly... So, I've been thinking about an LED alternative eventually.

Sense I also have a white strobe, I've been contemplating removing it entirely.  I don't generally fly at night anyhow...   I'd like to eventually replace the belly strobe with wingtip LED strobes, but saving my pennies.. 

Has anyone just removed their red beacon entirely and rely on the strobe for anti collision light requirements?   

[carusoam]

My 65C had a cover on the belly hole.  The Whelen strobe was put on the roof in place of the coffee grinder...

The Whelen site nicely describes what is legally needed by the age of the plane. Based on manufacturing date.

Best regards,

-a-

[MB65E]

15 hours ago, Freemasm said:

I put one of these in my 69C probably 20 years ago. Requires a 337 but it's a no-brainer/STCd for some other aircraft. Adapter allows fit without sheet metal work. Self-contained strobe provides way more visibility and draws less current than the old RBs with the incandescent bulbs.  Just another option. Best of luck and welcome to the money pit. 

 

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/fs4400.php?clickkey=22408

This is an awesome lamp! Mine was installed in the early 90s. Frickin brite single flash. I can’t stand the triple flash on the modern strobes. 

I was after the military -60 helicopter strobe for a while. This is the closest GA example!! 

The new led strobes just blink in my opinion, they don’t strobe.

-Matt

[Browncbr1]

1 minute ago, carusoam said:

My 65C had a cover on the belly hole.  The Whelen strobe was put on the roof in place of the coffee grinder...

The Whelen site nicely describes what is legally needed by the age of the plane. Based on manufacturing date.

Best regards,

-a-

I've been thinking about getting one of these to replace my belly strobe, power supply, and beacon.. 

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/aveoredbaronmaxired3.php?clickkey=22408#faq_tab

 

[Browncbr1]

2 minutes ago, MB65E said:

This is an awesome lamp! Mine was installed in the early 90s. Frickin brite single flash. I can’t stand the triple flash on the modern strobes. 

I was after the military -60 helicopter strobe for a while. This is the closest GA example!! 

The new led strobes just blink in my opinion, they don’t strobe.

-Matt

I like that one, but felt it might cause rf noise issues with my strikefinder and i saw comments that some heard whining in their headset

[MB65E]

Yeah... I do get a little ringing in the ears now that you mention it.

That just lets you know it’s working!

Darn!

-Matt

[carusoam]

11 hours ago, Browncbr1 said:

I've been thinking about getting one of these to replace my belly strobe, power supply, and beacon.. 

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/aveoredbaronmaxired3.php?clickkey=22408#faq_tab

 

There is a paragraph at the bottom that looks like it doesn’t belong...

The top of the page says all the detail needed for certified planes.  At the bottom it says something like experimental only...

Looks like AS made a mistake during the cut and paste exercise....

Aveo definitely knows the certified world with the nice Mooney wing tips...

Be sure to check the details when ordering...

PP thoughts only...

 

Best regards,

-a-

[Igor_U]

It is not certified. In Questions and Answers they state: "This product is not FAA Approved. For the FAA Approved version, please search part #  on our website. "

This part 11-11554 is listed for $999.  Way too much for me but it is a cool product. I guess I'll keep my Whelen strobe for a while.

 

[Raptor05121]

On 3/22/2018 at 11:25 AM, Browncbr1 said:

I've been thinking about getting one of these to replace my belly strobe, power supply, and beacon.. 

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/aveoredbaronmaxired3.php?clickkey=22408#faq_tab

 

I'm looking at getting the same.

14 hours ago, carusoam said:

There is a paragraph at the bottom that looks like it doesn’t belong...

The top of the page says all the detail needed for certified planes.  At the bottom it says something like experimental only...

Looks like AS made a mistake during the cut and paste exercise....

Aveo definitely knows the certified world with the nice Mooney wing tips...

Be sure to check the details when ordering...

PP thoughts only...

 

Best regards,

-a-

If your FSDO is up to it, they will sign it off. I know of a few guys running these on their Cherokees and even in the reviews sections shows some Cessnas running them

[Skates97]

On 3/22/2018 at 8:25 AM, Browncbr1 said:

I've been thinking about getting one of these to replace my belly strobe, power supply, and beacon.. 

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/aveoredbaronmaxired3.php?clickkey=22408#faq_tab

 

 

4 hours ago, Raptor05121 said:

I'm looking at getting the same.

If your FSDO is up to it, they will sign it off. I know of a few guys running these on their Cherokees and even in the reviews sections shows some Cessnas running them

I've been looking at the same one for quite a few months.

[cbarnes403]

5 hours ago, Raptor05121 said:

I'm looking at getting the same.

If your FSDO is up to it, they will sign it off. I know of a few guys running these on their Cherokees and even in the reviews sections shows some Cessnas running them

Go to the web site, it has been approved under TSO for installation on certified aircraft. 

http://www.aveoengineering.com/redbaron-xp-galactica/

TSO Certified

The RedBaron series of anticollision lights were designed for certified aircraft requirements. They represent the cutting edge in optics design and the use of LED arrays that have been optimized for coverage patterns. This light features highly polished reflectors and is available in either red, white or custom order NVIS/IR.

[kpaul]

2 hours ago, cbarnes403 said:

Go to the web site, it has been approved under TSO for installation on certified aircraft. 

http://www.aveoengineering.com/redbaron-xp-galactica/

TSO Certified

The RedBaron series of anticollision lights were designed for certified aircraft requirements. They represent the cutting edge in optics design and the use of LED arrays that have been optimized for coverage patterns. This light features highly polished reflectors and is available in either red, white or custom order NVIS/IR.

Right, they are TSO'd, so they meet a minimum requirement, they however are not PMA'd or STC'd.

[Skates97]

4 hours ago, kpaul said:

Right, they are TSO'd, so they meet a minimum requirement, they however are not PMA'd or STC'd.

Which could leave you SOL if you (like me) are looking for the CBO (Cheap Bastard Option). 

[cbarnes403]

11 hours ago, kpaul said:

Right, they are TSO'd, so they meet a minimum requirement, they however are not PMA'd or STC'd.

you can install using a 337

[Hank]

1 hour ago, cbarnes403 said:

you can install using a 337

Does changing the belly strobe really meet the requirements listed in the FARs for a major modification? If not, then by definition it's a minor mod with a logbook sign off. The reluctance of so many A&Ps to do anything at all without a 337 and its required "approved data" is part of what is killing GA. 

By the way, what data do you have to submit with the belly strobe 337? Who approves the data?

Our old GE landing lights are not made under TSO or PMA, but we all used them until LEDs appeared . . . . .

Edited March 24, 2018 by Hank

[cbarnes403]

6 hours ago, Hank said:

Does changing the belly strobe really meet the requirements listed in the FARs for a major modification? If not, then by definition it's a minor mod with a logbook sign off. The reluctance of so many A&Ps to do anything at all without a 337 and its required "approved data" is part of what is killing GA. 

By the way, what data do you have to submit with the belly strobe 337? Who approves the data?

Our old GE landing lights are not made under TSO or PMA, but we all used them until LEDs appeared . . . . .

So you believe that the FAA will approve a company to manufacture a product and give them a TSO but won't approve it to be installed on an aircraft.  A 337 gives traceability and will stay in the FAA documents for the aircraft. 

Use the Tech Data and 43.13 to install.

[Hank]

51 minutes ago, cbarnes403 said:

So you believe that the FAA will approve a company to manufacture a product and give them a TSO but won't approve it to be installed on an aircraft.  A 337 gives traceability and will stay in the FAA documents for the aircraft. 

Use the Tech Data and 43.13 to install.

Does anymof that exist for the old GE landing lights? I don't think so . . . .

Also, 337s are for Major Modifications. If you don't believe the title of the form, look up in the fars for the defi jtion of Major Modification and tell me which category a replacement belly strobe (or landing light) fits into, and why. Personally, I think they both fit into the category that says  "everythjng not listed above is a Minor Modification." Doesn't matter if the manufacturer pursues TSO, PMA or STC . . . That's just more being afraid of some lone inspector not liking what he sees instead of  (everyone) simply following the regulations.

Some of the dumbest things I've heard of is filing a 337, getting it approved by the FSDO, then flying somewhere and getting written up by an inspector in another FSDO and being told the (already approved) plane is not airworthy due to whatever the modifcation was. . . . .

[Browncbr1]

I am also unclear how a change would be viewed through the lense of how the plane was certified.   I’ve read on other forums that sometimes a beacon and strobe are sometimes both part of the type certificate, so neither can be removed or substituted.   

Many believe the FAA has bigger fish to fry than grounding vintage planes for having a bright modern strobe..    

[cbarnes403]

2 hours ago, Hank said:

Does anymof that exist for the old GE landing lights? I don't think so . . . .

Also, 337s are for Major Modifications. If you don't believe the title of the form, look up in the fars for the defi jtion of Major Modification and tell me which category a replacement belly strobe (or landing light) fits into, and why. Personally, I think they both fit into the category that says  "everythjng not listed above is a Minor Modification." Doesn't matter if the manufacturer pursues TSO, PMA or STC . . . That's just more being afraid of some lone inspector not liking what he sees instead of  (everyone) simply following the regulations.

Some of the dumbest things I've heard of is filing a 337, getting it approved by the FSDO, then flying somewhere and getting written up by an inspector in another FSDO and being told the (already approved) plane is not airworthy due to whatever the modifcation was. . . . .

Why are you hung up on landing lights.

337 are also for Major Alterations, but i guess you already knew about that. 

Look I'm not trying to be difficult, install don't install, doesn't matter to me.  Just trying to offer information.

AC 43.13-2B - Acceptable Methods, Techniques, and Practices - Aircraft Alterations

[jetdriven]

The very title of the 337 is for major repairs and alterations. Does the beacon meet the definition of major alteration?  If so, why, and if not, then why use the incorrect form.  

Edited March 25, 2018 by jetdriven