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real world performance differences between Acclaim and Ovation

RobertE

By RobertE
in Modern Mooney Discussion

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Hank Grand Master

Hank

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, aviatoreb said:

Ok - I call uncle.  That Acclaim is FASTER than my personal rocket.

But not dramatically so.  Well - yes dramatically so on the same fuel burn since that engine is furthermore more efficient than my rocket, but on standard cruise settings 65% (book says 18gph) and 72% (20gph) and 75% (21gph) my speeds are slower than that acclaim, but not a lot so.  Reasonably close.  I am burning 65% and you are I bet we are pretty close -  But if you are burning 21gph and I am burning 21gph then you are going quite a fair bit faster.

Looks to me like Mike's screenshot it 21.1 gph, 202 KTAS at 11,800 msl. Sorry . . . . . .

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Joe Zuffoletto
Joe Zuffoletto

Robert, I bought an Acclaim precisely because I routinely cross the Rockies and Sierras, and I wanted to do so with the best combination of performance and range possible. I installed the 31

Geoff
Geoff

I recently upgraded from a 231 to an Acclaim.  What I tell people about it is that flying the Acclaim is like having the entire Mooney M20 stable in my hangar.  I can fly it a 11 GPH like a J and get

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aviatoreb Grand Master

aviatoreb

Posted
Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, Hank said:

Looks to me like Mike's screenshot it 21.1 gph, 202 KTAS at 11,800 msl. Sorry . . . . . .

I don't understand.  Sorry of what?  At 21.gph that is going faster than my personal rocket goes - but no by a lot - and slower than the advertised (rocket book speed is 205TAS at 12k on 22gph) and mine is more like 195 (on a good day - and 190 on a bad day) on 21gph at 12k.  I always figured mine is slow because of tks and also because it is a 231 vs a 252.

Edited by aviatoreb
Geoff Proficient

Geoff

Posted
Posted (edited)

I recently upgraded from a 231 to an Acclaim.  What I tell people about it is that flying the Acclaim is like having the entire Mooney M20 stable in my hangar.  I can fly it a 11 GPH like a J and get 145 KTS, at 13 GPH at 170 KTS like a K or like a TN at 20 GPH and 200+ KTS at any altitude I choose. 

It is the ultimate in flexibility.  That flexibility allows me to negate any perceived shortcomings of useful load. 

I can fly far and fast with a light load, far and somewhat slower with a heavier load, or even farther and slower still with a really heavy load.

 

Edited by Geoff
  • Like 7
ArtVandelay Grand Master

ArtVandelay

Posted
Posted
I recently upgraded from a 231 to an Acclaim.  What I tell people about it is that flying the Acclaim is like having the entire Mooney M20 stable in my hangar.  I can fly it a 11 GPH like a J and get 145 KTS

11? I do ~153 kts on 9 gph in my J. You may be faster, but you’re not as efficient. The advantages of being lighter and 2 less cylinders. :-)
  • Like 3
Tim Jodice Proficient

Tim Jodice

Posted
Posted
21 hours ago, aviatoreb said:

I always figured mine is slow because of tks and also because it is a 231 vs a 252.

What are the differences in a 231 and a 252? I thought it was just a much better engine package.

carusoam Grand Master

carusoam

Posted
Posted

Decades of development from the 231 to the last of the M20Ks... including engine, turbo, MP controllers, and intercoolers...

Congrats to Mr. Vandalay... for bringing a shiny knife to the big gun battle... :)

Best regards,

-a-

  • Haha 1
aviatoreb Grand Master

aviatoreb

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, airtim said:

What are the differences in a 231 and a 252? I thought it was just a much better engine package.

Almost entirely the same but the more recent 252 eventually had a smooth belly and a triple closing gear door both of which add a bit to aero.  The first the belly can be retrofitted and may well be in one you might buy.

Davidv Mentor

Davidv

Posted
Posted
20 hours ago, mike_elliott said:

And here is one of the fastest J I have been in, still the champ, taken today just west of Longview, 9.2 GPH4636e0ee5491244cad6e1f99d360e82d.jpg

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
 

I get a few more knots at that altitude - at 2X the fuel.

gsxrpilot Grand Master

gsxrpilot

Posted
Posted

All the Mooneys are fast and efficient. And if you're willing to burn more gas, you can go faster. But if you're willing to strap on the O2 mask, I still don't think anything can beat the pure efficiency of the 252. And remember, the best speed mod is skipping a fuel stop. 

DB5B23F9-C777-4480-923D-45E6037560EC.thumb.jpeg.fb84d2281bf9cb3fa456ef18d0b03355.jpeg

 

  • Like 4
carusoam Grand Master

carusoam

Posted
Posted

Doing the math quickly...

265mph

9.4gph

28.2 mpg... 

 

Check my math, let me know if I missed something...  :)

 

Go Mooney, Modern day sailor!

Best regards,

-a-

  • Like 1
gsxrpilot Grand Master

gsxrpilot

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, carusoam said:

Doing the math quickly...

265mph

9.4gph

28.2 mpg... 

 

Check my math, let me know if I missed something...  :)

 

Go Mooney, Modern day sailor!

Best regards,

-a-

28.2 mpg x 74 useable gallons = over 2000 miles or a very long way in a piston single. :D

Not everyone uses their airplane for long trips. But I love them, and the longer the better. 

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aviatoreb Grand Master

aviatoreb

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, gsxrpilot said:

All the Mooneys are fast and efficient. And if you're willing to burn more gas, you can go faster. But if you're willing to strap on the O2 mask, I still don't think anything can beat the pure efficiency of the 252. And remember, the best speed mod is skipping a fuel stop. 

DB5B23F9-C777-4480-923D-45E6037560EC.thumb.jpeg.fb84d2281bf9cb3fa456ef18d0b03355.jpeg

 

Ground speed is meaningless and both more than good luck the wind happens to be at your back.

a ballon will do 200gs with a 200kts tail wind and burn 0gph.

and I’m sorry I’m sure you have a very nice airplane but it must be painful and slow looking at 122 indicated no matter how high you are.

there did everyone enjoy my grumpy old man impersonation? :-)

Edited by aviatoreb
gsxrpilot Grand Master

gsxrpilot

Posted
Posted

Of course, you have to know how to read the instruments. The important number isn't the 230 GS or the 122 IS. 

The important numbers are 179 TAS on 9.4 GPH. 

  • Like 1
aaronk25 Veteran

aaronk25

Posted
Posted
And here is one of the fastest J I have been in, still the champ, taken today just west of Longview, 9.2 GPH4636e0ee5491244cad6e1f99d360e82d.jpg

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk



That’s moving!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
  • Like 1
PJClark Proficient

PJClark

Posted
Posted

Well I jumped into this thing as a Rocket-Acclaim speed comparison, and I think the Rocket is very close--but probably only up to the low teens and probably even then only at reasonable cruise power settings.  I gave it a shot yesterday at 21 gph, but only at about 8000 feet, and could only get 186 KTAS.  

I have also been at 15k, 20 gph, and 199 KTAS (but not this weekend), which would be sorta close to an Acclaim, but not as fast.  I think the parasite drag of the better acclaim aero starts to tell above about 165 KIAS.  Beyond that I can throw more gas at it but don't get much speed.  Higher I'll be faster and more efficient, but I'll always be 5-10 knots slower than the Acclaim and heading toward 15-20 knots slower above about FL 180.

They're all fast airplanes, no doubt.  Some are the perfect balance of speed vs efficiency, and for that the Acclaim and the 252 or Encore will compete pretty closely.  For those of us who are used to burning 1000 pph of JP8  and running at .95 mach in cruise...well, a Rocket is plenty good enough. All depends on what makes you feel good: elegant operational efficiency, or brute force and "capital efficiency", or no holds barred capital outlay and the latest, baddest mutha in the valley!

whatevery puts the smile on your face when you see the numbers!

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mike_elliott Grand Master

mike_elliott

Posted
Posted
15 hours ago, aaronk25 said:


That’s moving!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

15 hours ago, aaronk25 said:


That’s moving!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

And that’s with full fuel, 2 people..it’s one fast J

carusoam Grand Master

carusoam

Posted
Posted

For best speed comparisons...

Need to use the advantage that the O doesn’t get...

1) thin air...

2) high power...

The O can get to the thin air... but becomes power limited...

Be really up on your O2 system and it’s back-up... the FLs can be pretty dangerous in the wrong hands... :)

Best regards,

-a-

  • Like 1
  • 2 years later...
GaryP1007 Proficient

GaryP1007

Posted
Posted
For best speed comparisons...
Need to use the advantage that the O doesn’t get...
1) thin air...
2) high power...
The O can get to the thin air... but becomes power limited...
Be really up on your O2 system and it’s back-up... the FLs can be pretty dangerous in the wrong hands... 
Best regards,
-a-

What’s the cause of the acclaims speed superiority when they both have the 310?


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Hank Grand Master

Hank

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, GaryP1007 said:


What’s the cause of the acclaims speed superiority when they both have the 310?

The Ovation has no turbo, so manifold pressure drops with altitude. The Acclaim carries full manifold pressure into the flight levels, much more power is available. 

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GaryP1007 Proficient

GaryP1007

Posted
Posted
The Ovation has no turbo, so manifold pressure drops with altitude. The Acclaim carries full manifold pressure into the flight levels, much more power is available. 

At 10k would they be equals?


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Niko182 Grand Master

Niko182

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, GaryP1007 said:


At 10k would they be equals?


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No. Acclaims are supposed to fly LOP at 17gph. An Ovation Is LOP at 12.5 to 13GPH. Ovations flying at 186HP and the acclaim at 233hp.

GaryP1007 Proficient

GaryP1007

Posted
Posted
No. Acclaims are supposed to fly LOP at 17gph. An Ovation Is LOP at 12.5 to 13GPH. Ovations flying at 186HP and the acclaim at 233hp.

Thanks


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