M20C Panel Upgrade Experience, Thoughts & Product Reviews

[MitchS]

This past November & December I did an extensive upgrade to my M20C and thought I'd share my experience here for those that might be curious or thinking about upgrading their aircraft. 

The Before

Before the upgrade I had a very traditional 6-pack configuration, no HSI, and my DG didn't have a heading bug.  Made for some fun IFR work getting my training done.  I did have a Gamin CDI and my backup.  I had a 430W, and a panel mounted Garmin 496.  I also have the factory Wing Leveler, there ot help a bit.  My goals were simple, I loved the mooney, but I wanted a setup that had an easier workflow for the IFR scan, Auto-Pilot for those long trips, and to comply with ADS-B so I was future proofed.

The Upgrades

After a lot of research, and getting quotes from 4 different avionics shops, I finally settled on the upgrades that were to be done. 

• New Pilot Side Panel
• Aspen Evolution 1000 Pro Plus (With Synthetic Vision & AOA)
• Garmin GTX330ES Transponder
• Garmin GDL-88
• S-Tec System 30 Auto Pilot
• Removal of: Wing Leveler, Narco Transponder, old DG, Old VSI, Old Turn & Bank, & GI-106A 

One of the biggest things that I found different when getting the quotes was how the different shops were going to tie everything together.  Some had different ideas all along...and the final decision to go with the company I did was their desire to make EVERYTHING work as it should.

Some of the key differences & setups that this vendor did for me.  The Aspen has full support for Nav1, Nav2, and GPS.  Where many shops were only going to have Nav1 & GPS.  Weather & Traffic data from the GDL-88 is displayed on the 430W (Will go to the Aspen, as soon as aspen gives details on how they are to do it. at no extra cost to me, wires already ran.)  Auto-pilot disconnect is in place of the old disable button for the Wing Leveler.  While they were in there they fixed a bunch of oddities, and even wired up the dimmers for some of my stuff that wasn't working/lighted before.  

Flying Now

I've only got about 6-8 hours in on the new setup due to the lovey Iowa winter....and travel schedules.  But it has been amazing so far.  Auto-pilot and the Traffic displays are by far the best additions.  With the GDL-88 & Transponder I see all kinds of traffic, including those without ADS-B, it really helps with situational awareness at times.  The Aspen is great as well, still getting used to the amazing display. 

Just thought I'd share.  Here are a few pictures, during & after the upgrades.  Anyone thinking about this, or that might have questions feel free to ask away.

 

[irishpilot]

That looks really clean! Congrats on the upgrade. How did they end up wiring the new panel to protect electrical failure? I've seen different methods in the experimental world, but not on our planes.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

[Marauder]

Ah, another joins the "You spent what on upgrading a XX year old airplane?".

Looks good. I hope your installer is correct about the GDL-88. I am an Aspen 2000 owner and have been following the GDL-88 saga since it was released in early 2013. If the GDL-88 does open the correct protocol, be prepared to pay Aspen for an unlock code for the PFD to use the ADS-B data. Nothing will display on it unless it is unlocked. And there are different unlocks. The MFD is unlocked by Aspen.

As for the PFD, the installers who told you that only VOR 1 and GPS signals were only available were trying to get out of work. If you had a dual GPS, the Aspen can display 4 signals.

Any reason you went with a 330ES? The GDL-88 can support a non-squitter version. And since your plane is a C, it is unlikely you will be doing much flying above 18,000.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Marauder]

That looks really clean! Congrats on the upgrade. How did they end up wiring the new panel to protect electrical failure? I've seen different methods in the experimental world, but not on our planes.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

If you are referring to electrical backup, the only true protection is the Aspen PFD. It has the capability of running off of battery to continue to provide you information. The Aspen PFD has a backup GPS that will retain your navigator flight plan. It will display on the HSI background. You can't change it, but if it was loaded, it will be there.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[carusoam]

That sure answers the question...

Does it make sense to install a GPS in an M20C..?  

That is one powerful panel!  (Urs has the other C power panel in Switzerland)

Have you had a chance to explore the AOA feature yet?

Best regards,

-a-

[KSMooniac]

Looks great! My only advice is to get the shop to install the remote button mode selector for the STEC 30. The knob/selector on the unit itself connects to a very, very weak plastic u-joint that is not durable. You can use the remote button for mode changes and disconnecting.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Edit...after reading again, hopefully what you called the disconnect switch on the yoke is the one I'm referring to. Try to minimize pushing on the plastic knob.

[irishpilot]

That's what I was wondering. Thanks.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

[Bob_Belville]

2 hours ago, Marauder said:

Ah, another joins the "You spent what on upgrading a XX year old airplane?".

Yeah, welcome to our less and less exclusive club! Nice. Prudent choices for the more important capacities. (Just stay away from folks with GTN 750s. Traffic and weather depiction loves a large monitor...) 

[MitchS]

6 hours ago, irishpilot said:

That looks really clean! Congrats on the upgrade. How did they end up wiring the new panel to protect electrical failure? I've seen different methods in the experimental world, but not on our planes.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

Electrical failure prevention is all about the backup battery, and calculation of the reserve capability of the planes battery itself.  So in the case of loss of charging they had to calculate the reserve battery to ensure that with all of the new goodies it would last for the required amount of time.  (I think 30 minutes+) and then the Aspen has its own backup battery as well, which has to be tested each year at a minimum.  My LED landing light was a big help in those calculations!

The master for the Aspen as well is a separate switch from the Avionics Master.

[MitchS]

3 hours ago, Marauder said:

 

Ah, another joins the "You spent what on upgrading a XX year old airplane?".

Looks good. I hope your installer is correct about the GDL-88. I am an Aspen 2000 owner and have been following the GDL-88 saga since it was released in early 2013. If the GDL-88 does open the correct protocol, be prepared to pay Aspen for an unlock code for the PFD to use the ADS-B data. Nothing will display on it unless it is unlocked. And there are different unlocks. The MFD is unlocked by Aspen.

As for the PFD, the installers who told you that only VOR 1 and GPS signals were only available were trying to get out of work. If you had a dual GPS, the Aspen can display 4 signals.

Any reason you went with a 330ES? The GDL-88 can support a non-squitter version. And since your plane is a C, it is unlikely you will be doing much flying above 18,000.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Oh yes....there were a few that made that exact "You spent WHAT!!" comment!  Totally worth it.

For what it's worth, I have it on paper from the installer that the GDL-88 WILL provide traffic/weather to the Aspen, so with a bit of luck, and given their reputation I hope that even if it does require another unlock it will not cost me extra to make it happen.  (Granted it could be a pipe dream that it is really true...but I'll live in wonder for a bit yet.)

The crazy part about the VOR1 & GPS only signal stuff....two of the shops I talked to first both made that comment....and then the shop I went with started out with "It will be awesome as you can have it all run through."  Pretty much won the deal before I even saw the price.

If I recall correctly, the reason for the 330ES was to ensure that with the combination of it & the GDL-88 I get the full benefit of ADS-B by not requiring someone else to ping the ground station so that I can receive the full notifications.  (Don't quote me on that, I'd need to go find my notes from before.)  It was a very interesting discussion, as yes the C will not get much past 10K really.  (At least from my one time trying!)

[MitchS]

35 minutes ago, Bob_Belville said:

Yeah, welcome to our less and less exclusive club! Nice. Prudent choices for the more important capacities. (Just stay away from folks with GTN 750s. Traffic and weather depiction loves a large monitor...) 

I played with one at the avionics shop, I think I'm pretty safe.  I'd love it...but I like the fact that I have the 496 & the 430W...and still not sure about my thoughts with touchscreen...

Oh, and I'm out of airplane upgrade budget for the next....well long time!

3 hours ago, carusoam said:

Have you had a chance to explore the AOA feature yet?

Yes, I've played with it a bit.  The calibration flight was fun, not sure how I would have done it without Auto-Pilot.

The indications seem to be spot on, with a good bit of warning before as well.

[ArtVandelay]

Aspen looks like it's very readable in direct sunlight, good to know.

[MitchS]

here is a night shot, it looks way more "distracting" than it is.  Readable, without causing too much distraction with extra light at night.

I have found it is better at night to NOT use Synthetic Vision though as the background color is darker on the other screens.

[MitchS]

4 hours ago, Marauder said:

 

Ah, another joins the "You spent what on upgrading a XX year old airplane?".

Looks good. I hope your installer is correct about the GDL-88. I am an Aspen 2000 owner and have been following the GDL-88 saga since it was released in early 2013. If the GDL-88 does open the correct protocol, be prepared to pay Aspen for an unlock code for the PFD to use the ADS-B data. Nothing will display on it unless it is unlocked. And there are different unlocks. The MFD is unlocked by Aspen.

As for the PFD, the installers who told you that only VOR 1 and GPS signals were only available were trying to get out of work. If you had a dual GPS, the Aspen can display 4 signals.

Any reason you went with a 330ES? The GDL-88 can support a non-squitter version. And since your plane is a C, it is unlikely you will be doing much flying above 18,000.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Just heard from Aspen....software update slated for end of March with GDL-88 support

[Marauder]

4 hours ago, Marauder said:  

Ah, another joins the "You spent what on upgrading a XX year old airplane?".

Looks good. I hope your installer is correct about the GDL-88. I am an Aspen 2000 owner and have been following the GDL-88 saga since it was released in early 2013. If the GDL-88 does open the correct protocol, be prepared to pay Aspen for an unlock code for the PFD to use the ADS-B data. Nothing will display on it unless it is unlocked. And there are different unlocks. The MFD is unlocked by Aspen.

As for the PFD, the installers who told you that only VOR 1 and GPS signals were only available were trying to get out of work. If you had a dual GPS, the Aspen can display 4 signals.

Any reason you went with a 330ES? The GDL-88 can support a non-squitter version. And since your plane is a C, it is unlikely you will be doing much flying above 18,000.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Just heard from Aspen....software update slated for end of March with GDL-88 support

Did you ask about the unlock code price?

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Marauder]

3 hours ago, Marauder said:  

Ah, another joins the "You spent what on upgrading a XX year old airplane?".

Looks good. I hope your installer is correct about the GDL-88. I am an Aspen 2000 owner and have been following the GDL-88 saga since it was released in early 2013. If the GDL-88 does open the correct protocol, be prepared to pay Aspen for an unlock code for the PFD to use the ADS-B data. Nothing will display on it unless it is unlocked. And there are different unlocks. The MFD is unlocked by Aspen.

As for the PFD, the installers who told you that only VOR 1 and GPS signals were only available were trying to get out of work. If you had a dual GPS, the Aspen can display 4 signals.

Any reason you went with a 330ES? The GDL-88 can support a non-squitter version. And since your plane is a C, it is unlikely you will be doing much flying above 18,000.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Oh yes....there were a few that made that exact "You spent WHAT!!" comment!  Totally worth it.

For what it's worth, I have it on paper from the installer that the GDL-88 WILL provide traffic/weather to the Aspen, so with a bit of luck, and given their reputation I hope that even if it does require another unlock it will not cost me extra to make it happen.  (Granted it could be a pipe dream that it is really true...but I'll live in wonder for a bit yet.)

The crazy part about the VOR1 & GPS only signal stuff....two of the shops I talked to first both made that comment....and then the shop I went with started out with "It will be awesome as you can have it all run through."  Pretty much won the deal before I even saw the price.

If I recall correctly, the reason for the 330ES was to ensure that with the combination of it & the GDL-88 I get the full benefit of ADS-B by not requiring someone else to ping the ground station so that I can receive the full notifications.  (Don't quote me on that, I'd need to go find my notes from before.)  It was a very interesting discussion, as yes the C will not get much past 10K really.  (At least from my one time trying!)

The 330ES isn't required with a GDL-88. The 88 will shoot UAT 978 out and can receive both 1090 and 978 in.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[MitchS]

15 minutes ago, Marauder said:

Did you ask about the unlock code price?

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Yup, waiting for a reply!

Looks to be $795 for the unlock card!

Edited February 19, 2016 by MitchS
Got info from Aspen on price

[steingar]

In one way it makes no sense to upgrade a panel in this fashion.  Speaking strictly financially, it is unlikely that one would recover the money put into a M20C for such an utterly gorgeous panel.  Seriously, color me jealous.

In another, it makes perfect sense.  The financial input to acquire an aircraft with a similar panel would likely outstrip what the OP paid handily.  And, the short body Mooneys are pretty unique aircraft.  Between the efficiency and J-bar gear there aren't so many aircraft like them.  And one certainly can't purchase an airplane exactly outfitted as one likes.

We're all going to be in this boat before 2020, that's for certain.

[MitchS]

20 minutes ago, steingar said:

In one way it makes no sense to upgrade a panel in this fashion.  Speaking strictly financially, it is unlikely that one would recover the money put into a M20C for such an utterly gorgeous panel.  Seriously, color me jealous.

In another, it makes perfect sense.  The financial input to acquire an aircraft with a similar panel would likely outstrip what the OP paid handily.  And, the short body Mooneys are pretty unique aircraft.  Between the efficiency and J-bar gear there aren't so many aircraft like them.  And one certainly can't purchase an airplane exactly outfitted as one likes.

We're all going to be in this boat before 2020, that's for certain.

You actually bring up a very valid point....your thought process was EXACTLY what I went through in my mind!  Something that could be very important to add to this discussion.

A bit of a back story, my Mooney is a 1968 with just under 3,800 TTAF, and 510 SMOH and 510 SNEW on the 3 Blade Prop.  She flies like a champ and burns about 9.5 Gal/hour as we all know.  I picked it up for a decent price just under 2 year ago, and so far *knock on wood* it hasn't been too bad.  Worst expense so far was a failed DG that needed replaced and the poor Vaccum regulator from 1968 gave out on me last summer.  (Less than $1600 combined)

As I started working on my IFR training a few thoughts crossed my mind.  I loved the Mooney, from the first day I flew it.  But the long-haul trips got hard to manage without auto-pilot.  No heading bug etc also made it fun to remember proper paths.  (Granted I learned a LOT doing my IFR training BEFORE the panel upgrades.)  But I started to look at options and there were two decisions.  1.) Upgrade my Mooney, make it mine, and know that I'm never going to get it back.  2.) Find something new and ditch the mooney.

So I set out, looking at #2 first.

The used market, for a M20C, without auto-pilot etc was horrible.  I don't necessarily have the resources to "keep it" while I buy a new plane.  So I talked with a few people that take trades and DAMN did they low-ball me.  Then I started to compile the list of what I wanted.  At a minimum I set myself to need, Auto Pilot, Glass Panel, ADS-In/Out with Traffic/Weather displays, XM Radio/Weather. (Love it from my 496), and less than 750 SMOH.  I didn't want to jump up huge in fuel consumption either as then my per-hour costs go through the roof as all of my local places are quite high with 100LL.  The SMOH limit was to help "plan" for an overhaul of the engine if needed.

All of this put me into the $145,000+ range, with "trade" offers of less than $36k for my Mooney.  That's a lot of Money. I do fly about 100 hours a year or so, but not much more.  I then turned to insurance, and some of the birds I was looking at would have doubled or tripled my insurance due to the costs etc.  I also started to look at the annual costs.  My M20C with the Johnson Bar Gear and Hydraulic flaps gets the job done, and my annual was a very tidy little process.  Looking at a new plane that would have gone up.

Compare that to option #1

Well, if I do the upgrades, I know the history of my plane.  I've learned its quirks, I know what it likes and what sounds normal.  I also know the history of it and how much the prior owner cared for it.  With a low time Engine I'm already well on my way of saving for the future overhauls etc.  Putting in the panel, was ~ $50K out the door, putting my total "buy price" for the Mooney to around $100k.  Is it worth 100k?  Nope, never will be.  But every aircraft is going to have to get ADS-B eventually and if you take care of your plane it will still go there.  For me, financially it was easier to swing an add to the current plane in cash, rather than making a sizable increase in airplane payment.  I know the upcoming things, the AD's that have been complied with, etc. 

In the end, yup, I have more money into my Mooney than I ever will get back out of it.  But, just like boats and other things its the other value that you get out of it.  

Now...seriously this weather needs to cooperate so I can fly it!  (50+ kts winds today ) 

[steingar]

Yup.  Comparing your airplane with every Mooney out there isn't the right comparison.  Comparing it to similarly equipped aircraft is.  Personally, i think the best deal one can get on an aircraft is to take the most awful example one can find, and redo everything.  One will spend far more than the aircraft is worth, but one will get an essentially new aircraft configured to one's liking for a fraction of the price of a factory model.  Yes, one will see huge depreciation, but you get that with a new airplane as well.

At the end of the day is a philosophical consideration.  What is money for?  To me it's to make you happy.  If having the nice panel in the airplane makes you happy, its money well spent.  All I can says just don't loose your medical!  And of course, what a gorgeous panel!  Well done!

[Oscar Avalle]

Let me chip in guys. I agree it does not make any financial sense to invest so much money in upgrading a M20C panel. But then, does it make financial sense to own an airplane... many would say no. I personally believe that every cent we invest in our planes has an emotional return that goes way beyond what we spend on our planes.

As Mitch says, the M20C gets the job done and we know our birds. I have owned mine since 2002. I have flown her for about 1000 hours. I know how reliable and unreliable she is. I know what maintenance has been done (or deferred).  I flew her from the US to Guatemala and back. My insurance costs are reasonable... 

I did invest a lot or money in my M20C panel, Aspen, GTN750 and 650, stec 55x, GDL 88, etc. Now that I have been using the new set up for a while I love it! It makes long cross country trips easier by taking away a lot of your workload. 

On the other hand let's asume for a moment that we decided to upgrade to a more expensive bird... would it come equipped with all the goodies that we want? most certainly not and we would start spending (may a little less) money above the purchase price to get the plane ready to do what we want to do... 

Oscar

[Marauder]

20 minutes ago, steingar said: In one way it makes no sense to upgrade a panel in this fashion.  Speaking strictly financially, it is unlikely that one would recover the money put into a M20C for such an utterly gorgeous panel.  Seriously, color me jealous.

In another, it makes perfect sense.  The financial input to acquire an aircraft with a similar panel would likely outstrip what the OP paid handily.  And, the short body Mooneys are pretty unique aircraft.  Between the efficiency and J-bar gear there aren't so many aircraft like them.  And one certainly can't purchase an airplane exactly outfitted as one likes.

We're all going to be in this boat before 2020, that's for certain.

You actually bring up a very valid point....your thought process was EXACTLY what I went through in my mind!  Something that could be very important to add to this discussion.

A bit of a back story, my Mooney is a 1968 with just under 3,800 TTAF, and 510 SMOH and 510 SNEW on the 3 Blade Prop.  She flies like a champ and burns about 9.5 Gal/hour as we all know.  I picked it up for a decent price just under 2 year ago, and so far *knock on wood* it hasn't been too bad.  Worst expense so far was a failed DG that needed replaced and the poor Vaccum regulator from 1968 gave out on me last summer.  (Less than $1600 combined)

As I started working on my IFR training a few thoughts crossed my mind.  I loved the Mooney, from the first day I flew it.  But the long-haul trips got hard to manage without auto-pilot.  No heading bug etc also made it fun to remember proper paths.  (Granted I learned a LOT doing my IFR training BEFORE the panel upgrades.)  But I started to look at options and there were two decisions.  1.) Upgrade my Mooney, make it mine, and know that I'm never going to get it back.  2.) Find something new and ditch the mooney.

So I set out, looking at #2 first.

The used market, for a M20C, without auto-pilot etc was horrible.  I don't necessarily have the resources to "keep it" while I buy a new plane.  So I talked with a few people that take trades and DAMN did they low-ball me.  Then I started to compile the list of what I wanted.  At a minimum I set myself to need, Auto Pilot, Glass Panel, ADS-In/Out with Traffic/Weather displays, XM Radio/Weather. (Love it from my 496), and less than 750 SMOH.  I didn't want to jump up huge in fuel consumption either as then my per-hour costs go through the roof as all of my local places are quite high with 100LL.  The SMOH limit was to help "plan" for an overhaul of the engine if needed.

All of this put me into the $145,000+ range, with "trade" offers of less than $36k for my Mooney.  That's a lot of Money. I do fly about 100 hours a year or so, but not much more.  I then turned to insurance, and some of the birds I was looking at would have doubled or tripled my insurance due to the costs etc.  I also started to look at the annual costs.  My M20C with the Johnson Bar Gear and Hydraulic flaps gets the job done, and my annual was a very tidy little process.  Looking at a new plane that would have gone up.

Compare that to option #1

Well, if I do the upgrades, I know the history of my plane.  I've learned its quirks, I know what it likes and what sounds normal.  I also know the history of it and how much the prior owner cared for it.  With a low time Engine I'm already well on my way of saving for the future overhauls etc.  Putting in the panel, was ~ $50K out the door, putting my total "buy price" for the Mooney to around $100k.  Is it worth 100k?  Nope, never will be.  But every aircraft is going to have to get ADS-B eventually and if you take care of your plane it will still go there.  For me, financially it was easier to swing an add to the current plane in cash, rather than making a sizable increase in airplane payment.  I know the upcoming things, the AD's that have been complied with, etc. 

In the end, yup, I have more money into my Mooney than I ever will get back out of it.  But, just like boats and other things its the other value that you get out of it.  

Now...seriously this weather needs to cooperate so I can fly it!  (50+ kts winds today ) 

I hear ya brother...

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[carusoam]

If I have this right....

Urs has flown his C accross the pond.

Oscar's C just came back from Central America.

Mitch, any plans for some  X-long X-countries?

Best regards,

-a-

[DXB]

Mitch- Congrats on the panel upgrade- looks very nice!  Just thought I'd jump in as a fellow member of the "obscene panel upgrade in a '68C model"  club.  I did mine last year.  Your details are a bit different- I went with the KT74 (Bendix's low cost transponder ads-b out solution) and decided to forgo the GDL88 to instead get ads-b in from a Stratus into the ipad only- so far I'm happy with it.  Your central panel wound up configured identically to mine.  I suspect you ran into the same problem putting your STEC 30/turn coordinator in the traditional lower left position that I did-  there's a tube in the roll cage that is a just few millimeters too close for the big connector on the back.  Looking at your night pic reminded me that there's only one thing that I can't dim adequately at night- the LEDs on the STEC.  They are obnoxiously bright despite being regulated by the same dimmer as my nulites on the other round gauges.

Also like you, I'm left with the vacuum system driving a solitary backup AI. Tearing it out, adding a digital backup with additional features yet to be determined, and maybe a stormscope/ strikefinder, are the only upgrades that remain for some point in the future after I finish my IR.

[kris_adams]

Mitch, congrats on a great looking panel (yours too DXB).  I'm amazed at the panels nowadays!