Instrument Currency Requirements

[MooneyBob]

Here is a scenario:

January 1st - 1 approach

February 1st - 1 approach

March 1 st - 1 approach

April 1st - 1 approach

May 1st - 1 approach

June 1st - 1 approach

July - no approach

I am current since I have 6 approaches in last 6 months.

But by August 1st I have only 5 approaches within last 6 months. So I am not current anymore even of I flew the approaches on regular basis?

Is better to wait until last minute and then do 6 approaches in one day to be current for next 6 months?

I am probably missing something because it doesn't make any sense.

[Marauder]

You're only current if you have the holds and tracking in as well... I find it easier to do an IPC than track everything...

[MooneyBob]

You're only current if you have the holds and tracking in as well... I find it easier to do an IPC than track everything...

Of course you need holds and tracking. My point is that you miss one beat and you are grounded when you need it the most.

Also I believe that if you fly approaches on regular basis you stay sharper than one day 6 approaches kind of stuff. And you are so tired after few hours of different approaches that you probably don't remember too much of that.

I don't know. I am fresh IR that's why I am asking.

Thanks

[rbridges]

Of course you need holds and tracking. My point is that you miss one beat and you are grounded when you need it the most.

Also I believe that if you fly approaches on regular basis you stay sharper than one day 6 approaches kind of stuff. And you are so tired after few hours of different approaches that you probably don't remember too much of that.

I don't know. I am fresh IR that's why I am asking.

Thanks

 

I don't like doing big clumps because then you need to do a bunch all at once.  I like to spread them out a little.  I usually do 2 at a time.  Since you're already up there, it's not too hard to get a second one finished.

[pinerunner]

I'm studying for my written now so I'll chime in and take a chance on getting flamed.

 

Only 5 in the last 5 months; you're not current to file IFR and fly in IMC.

 

But..you have 6 more months in which you only need to go under the hood with a check pilot and fly the needed procedures (under VFR conditions of course) and become current again. 

 

Let that second six months pass.. now you have to take a check ride again and I think it takes more than just an instructor to sign you off. You need the same guy you did your check ride with to get your rating (is that an inspector?).

 

So the anti is higher than for plain old VFR flight but its not too bad. IFR is a big deal after all.

 

That would mean that if you let it go getting a biannual would not bring your instrument currency back. A check ride with an inspector would count as a BFR I suppose.

 

If you're working at it to keep 6 approachs, and 1 holding pattern each year so you don't have to take the check ride again that's a bit marginal I guess. If you're doing it every 6 months that's better but you'll be pretty busy for a weekend warrior. 

[mooniac15u]

I'm studying for my written now so I'll chime in and take a chance on getting flamed.

 

Only 5 in the last 5 months; you're not current to file IFR and fly in IMC.

 

But..you have 6 more months in which you only need to go under the hood with a check pilot and fly the needed procedures (under VFR conditions of course) and become current again. 

 

Let that second six months pass.. now you have to take a check ride again and I think it takes more than just an instructor to sign you off. You need the same guy you did your check ride with to get your rating (is that an inspector?).

 

So the anti is higher than for plain old VFR flight but its not too bad. IFR is a big deal after all.

 

That would mean that if you let it go getting a biannual would not bring your instrument currency back. A check ride with an inspector would count as a BFR I suppose.

 

If you're working at it to keep 6 approachs, and 1 holding pattern each year so you don't have to take the check ride again that's a bit marginal I guess. If you're doing it every 6 months that's better but you'll be pretty busy for a weekend warrior. 

 

Once you have your IR you always have your IR and you don't need to fly another check ride (unless you bust a reg).  If you let your currency lapse for six months you just need an IPC (instrument proficiency check) with a CFII.

[Amelia]

I believe, if you've let your instrument currency lapse, and your six months' grace period has elapsed, you need to do a real IPC, but your CFII can take care of that. No need to take another check ride. I agree, keeping up with it is a great idea, but hard to do if you're home, home on the range, where the skies are not cloudy all day, or if you too often break out at 1200, so your approach, which has been IFR up until the last three minutes, is no longer loggable as an Instrument Approach. So, if you can find a friend to ride shotgun, it's useful to go out and do some foggling every so often, so that your sixth approach doesn't fall off the end of the queue.

[cliffy]

Do 6 and a hold on Jan 1 you're good for IFR until last day of June. If you do no more than the 6 on Jan 1 then on July 1 until last day of December, no IFR until you do 6 and a hold with a safety pilot/Inst or self certify 6 and a hold in a Redbird Sim (yes you can do that in a Redbird, they have an authorization letter from the Feds to do just that). After last day of December you need a new IPC from a CFII. At least that's the way I've always taught it. Corrections graciously accepted.

[1964-M20E]

I believe, if you've let your instrument currency lapse, and your six months' grace period has elapsed, you need to do a real IPC, but your CFII can take care of that. No need to take another check ride. I agree, keeping up with it is a great idea, but hard to do if you're home, home on the range, where the skies are not cloudy all day, or if you too often break out at 1200, so your approach, which has been IFR up until the last three minutes, is no longer loggable as an Instrument Approach. So, if you can find a friend to ride shotgun, it's useful to go out and do some foggling every so often, so that your sixth approach doesn't fall off the end of the queue.

I disagree if you are flying the approach in IMC and you break out at 1200 that still counts as an approach.

[WardHolbrook]

Here is a scenario:

January 1st - 1 approach

February 1st - 1 approach

March 1 st - 1 approach

April 1st - 1 approach

May 1st - 1 approach

June 1st - 1 approach

July - no approach

I am current since I have 6 approaches in last 6 months.

But by August 1st I have only 5 approaches within last 6 months. So I am not current anymore even of I flew the approaches on regular basis?

Is better to wait until last minute and then do 6 approaches in one day to be current for next 6 months?

I am probably missing something because it doesn't make any sense.

The better question is are you proficient? The mistake many pilots make is equating currency with proficiency. They are not mutually inclusive terms. You can have one without the other, you can have both and you can have neither. Currency makes you legal, proficiency makes you safe. You need both. My answer is if you are planning on doing any flying IFR or VFR, you need to do get as much recurrent training as it takes to insure that you are BOTH current and proficient. Remember that the pros who do this every day go through a recurrent of some sort every 6 months. My suggestion is to budget the time and money to grab a CFII and go find those areas where you might be a bit rusty and work on them. A couple hours of dual twice a year isn't going to bust airplane anybody's budget. 

[Danb]

john I agree if you started the approach in IFR conditions then the approach counts as IFR approach, if that was not true then only approaches to DH would count  DAH

[WardHolbrook]

john I agree if you started the approach in IFR conditions then the approach counts as IFR approach, if that was not true then only approaches to DH would count  DAH

Here in California, it's quite common to start an approach in VMC and descend into a marine layer. 

[Robert C.]

I too am prepping for the IR written and have this one fresh in my mind....the rule is:

 

 

If you break out of the clouds and meet visibility requirements before the FAF it does NOT count as an instrument approach for the currency rule. If you break out after the FAF it does count regardless of how close to DH or MDA you are.

[mooniac15u]

I too am prepping for the IR written and have this one fresh in my mind....the rule is:

 

 

If you break out of the clouds and meet visibility requirements before the FAF it does NOT count as an instrument approach for the currency rule. If you break out after the FAF it does count regardless of how close to DH or MDA you are.

 

Do you have a link to FAA guidance on that?  The FARs have been intentionally vague on what counts as an approach.

[ToddDPT]

The better question is are you proficient? The mistake many pilots make is equating currency with proficiency. They are not mutually inclusive terms. You can have one without the other, you can have both and you can have neither. Currency makes you legal, proficiency makes you safe. You need both. My answer is if you are planning on doing any flying IFR or VFR, you need to do get as much recurrent training as it takes to insure that you are BOTH current and proficient. Remember that the pros who do this every day go through a recurrent of some sort every 6 months. My suggestion is to budget the time and money to grab a CFII and go find those areas where you might be a bit rusty and work on them. A couple hours of dual twice a year isn't going to bust airplane anybody's budget. 

 

+1 on this.  Obviously you need to have the currency, but doesn't mean you are proficient.  I had a Navy pilot friend out of Lemoore, CA tell me that IFR skills are "perishable" so go out and practice and practice a lot.  I try to practice multiple approaches/holds/tracking per month.  I would argue that one a month will not keep you proficient (I understand it was just a scenario).

[DonMuncy]

I think there are two aspects to the discussion. To be safe, you need ongoing approach training or practice, and spreading them out probably is better than flying six in one day.

As to the strict legality of the rule, I have not seen a definition of what constitutes an "approach", as far as how low you have to go. I can see a valid argument that if you make the last defined point (FAF) in actual or simulated conditions, you have flown the approach.

[Robert C.]

Do you have a link to FAA guidance on that?  The FARs have been intentionally vague on what counts as an approach.

 

I'll try and find it at home tonight. Am quite sure that it showed up in a test quiz in my King School course, hopefully they'll have a reference. You are quite right about the FARs being vague and the various rulings by the FAA's council don't seem to have helped much.

[201er]

Ideally what I try to do is go up every 3 months in IMC and practice 3 approaches and then fly real approaches on trips in between. That keeps me proficient and current. And the biggest reason you need to have a practice session at least every six months is for the hold. Even if I fly enough approaches, I'd never stay current without practicing holds.

[1964-M20E]

As many have said it is proficiency vs currency. At the end of the day it is your log book write anything you feel comfortable putting down as long as you can make some reasonable attempt to justify it.

 

Currency will cover your ass with the Feds.

 

Proficiency will save your ass in the real world.

 

I tell contactors here at the plant all the time.  The safety check lists and paper work make my boss happy, make your boss happy and protect their respective companies.  What you do when you are out there will protect and save your ass.

[N201MKTurbo]

I too am prepping for the IR written and have this one fresh in my mind....the rule is:

 

 

If you break out of the clouds and meet visibility requirements before the FAF it does NOT count as an instrument approach for the currency rule. If you break out after the FAF it does count regardless of how close to DH or MDA you are.

 

I just finished my ATP written and there were quite a few questions in the study guides about this and there was one question on the test I took. The guidance was as stated above. They did say you can throw the hood or foggles on as soon as you break out and still count it.

 

So the real question is, would you need a safety pilot to do this? In the airline world you always have a safety pilot.

 

From a practical standpoint, who's to know when you broke out?

[ArtVandelay]

I too am prepping for the IR written and have this one fresh in my mind....the rule is:

 

 

If you break out of the clouds and meet visibility requirements before the FAF it does NOT count as an instrument approach for the currency rule. If you break out after the FAF it does count regardless of how close to DH or MDA you are.

Text of a letter from FAA from 1992 published on the internet:.

...

For currency purposes, an instrument approach under Section 61.57(e)(1)(i) may be flown in either actual or simulated IFR conditions. Further, unless the instrument approach procedure must be abandoned for safety reasons, we believe the pilot must follow the instrument approach procedure to minimum descent altitude or decision height.

....

Donald P. Byrne

Assistant Chief Counsel

 

It really doesn't say the entire approach must be in IFR conditions, but you can't log it if you break it off early. At least that's how I interpret it.

[ToddDPT]

 

Currency will cover your ass with the Feds.

 

Proficiency will save your ass in the real world.

 

Well said!

[midlifeflyer]

Of course you need holds and tracking. My point is that you miss one beat and you are grounded when you need it the most.

Also I believe that if you fly approaches on regular basis you stay sharper than one day 6 approaches kind of stuff. And you are so tired after few hours of different approaches that you probably don't remember too much of that.

I don't know. I am fresh IR that's why I am asking.

Thanks

 

You're probably right. The problem is there's no way for the FAA to gauge proficiency, so you are stuck with a minimum of legal currency.  And there's no way for the FAA to establish a minimum that will satisfy everyone. 

 

Think of it this way: are you flying these under the hood or in actual to within a few hundred feet of minimums? Are they at the home area or places you rarely go? I'd bet we can agree that a pilot who flies them in actual to near-minimums 3 times in 6 months to airports he rarely goes to is more proficient than the one who flies 6 under the hood at the home base. But he still needs to meet FAA legal currency. 

 

Point is that FAA currency does NOT equate to practical proficiency. It's a minimum and minimal baseline. That's all.

 

If you're doing these flight specifically for currency purpose why not add an extra every other month? Seems it would increase both your proficiency and extend you currency?  I just did an approach last weekend that increased my currency by 2 months. I'm current through November right now although I won't make the mistake thinking that if I do nothing between now and then I would be proficient for anything other than pretty light conditions.

[midlifeflyer]

Text of a letter from FAA from 1992 published on the internet:.

...

For currency purposes, an instrument approach under Section 61.57(e)(1)(i) may be flown in either actual or simulated IFR conditions. Further, unless the instrument approach procedure must be abandoned for safety reasons, we believe the pilot must follow the instrument approach procedure to minimum descent altitude or decision height.

....

Donald P. Byrne

Assistant Chief Counsel

 

It really doesn't say the entire approach must be in IFR conditions, but you can't log it if you break it off early. At least that's how I interpret it.

 

There's more to the discussion than that. I do a roundup of what's out there  in my "How much actual" FAQ: http://midlifeflight.com/flying-faq/faq-instrument-procedures-currency/

[Cruiser]

This has been debated as long as there has been the requirement. 

 

Commercial pilots must fly with "check airman" every six months. Essentially getting a complete Flight Review. So that narrows the focus of this rule to us private, instrument rated (IR) pilots that want to stay current (and legal). The chief counsel has stated the approach must be flown to minimums. This disqualifies almost all actual approaches since it is extremely rare to find weather conditions that are exactly at minimum (or below if you go missed)  so the only way to meet the requirement is with a safety pilot using a view limiting device to simulate the flight to minimums. 

 

Many of the "old school" (i.e. before the chief counsel interpretation) believe an actual time on the approach can be logged. There are all kinds of variants to this such as "in the clouds at the FAF. etc. The bottom line is ............ do what you want. You could sit at your desk and pencil whip the log to meet the requirement, you can count any approach that has clouds in it, you can get a safety pilot and do them all at once...............

Unless you have a problem that gets the attention of the FAA and they want to review your log, being safe and comfortable flying your plane on an instrument approach is the most important requirement. The FAA says you must prove this six times every six months, your mileage may vary.