Chocks Poll

[201er]

What do you do when you've fired up, warmed up, configured all your avionics, briefed your passengers, got the weather and the ok to taxi, add power, not moving, add more power, and then realize you did it again! Forgot to remove the chocks. 

How often has this happened to you?

I tried to be more inclusive with the poll options 

Edited Wednesday at 11:02 PM by 201er

[MikeOH]

41 minutes ago, 201er said:

I tried to be more inclusive with the poll options 

Sorry, FAIL!

The one time I forgot to pull chocks was in a Cessna, over 30 years ago.  I shut down, disembarked, and personally retrieved them in shame  Everyone else stayed in the plane.  NOT one of your choices.

[Ibra]

This poll is NOT intended for those hand-starting?  (vintage Cubs not Mooneys) 

Edited Wednesday at 11:12 PM by Ibra

[Andy95W]

I forgot on my Instrument check ride in 1992.  The examiner said we could probably just go over them.  I shutdown, got out, and removed them.  Might’ve been why I passed.

[toto]

I don’t think I’ve ever actually turned the key with chocks in place, but I’ve made a passenger get out so I could verify chocks removed several times in my flying career. 

[laytonl]

I’ve done this several times.  Usually short stops.  I shut down, disembark passenger, remove the chock.

Also, one time I took off with a tie-down rope still attached.  The rope was in such a bad condition I didn’t even notice it until I landed a couple hours later.

 

lee

[takair]

I haven’t done it in years, but as I recall it always happened when a line guy put it in place and not me…..run in to get a pax and hop in plane….and can’t move.  All the more reason to do a walk around.   

[GeeBee]

Better to forget to remove them than forget to insert them and have the airplane roll. 

[Ragsf15e]

5 hours ago, GeeBee said:

Better to forget to remove them than forget to insert them and have the airplane roll. 

I have a funny/terrifying story about a ~60,000lb airplane rolling down the ramp in a strong wind while I chased it and attempted (eventually successfully) to stop it.  Wasn’t good.

[GeeBee]

7 hours ago, Ragsf15e said:

I have a funny/terrifying story about a ~60,000lb airplane rolling down the ramp in a strong wind while I chased it and attempted (eventually successfully) to stop it.  Wasn’t good.

Oh yeah, I got a chocks in signal from the ramp guy once, but they chocked only the nose wheel. When it jumped the chock, 300,000 pound wide body went rolling downhill towards another wide body behind it. Thank God I was able to jump into the seat and stop it with accumulator brake pressure.

Even a Mooney size airplane once it starts rolling is difficult to stop with anything other than brakes. 

[FlyingDude]

3 hours ago, GeeBee said:

When it jumped the chock

How is that even possible? Sounds scary. 

[47U]

16 hours ago, GeeBee said:

Better to forget to remove them than forget to insert them and have the airplane roll. 

Or, have ‘FBO guy’ at MSP remove the nose chocks prematurely during engine start, crew chief doesn’t notice, and by the time 3 of the 4 engines are running the -135 moves forward far enough to smack the start cart with #3 engine nose cowl.  It wasn’t me, but the crew chief who trained me… great guy, great cockpit crew, except on that day they didn’t set the brakes before engine start.  Offutt had to send a crew from the jet shop to MSP with a nose cowl.  After that incident, crew chiefs started visually checking to see that the brakes springs were recessed before calling engine start, including engine runs for mx.  

[Ragsf15e]

5 hours ago, GeeBee said:

Oh yeah, I got a chocks in signal from the ramp guy once, but they chocked only the nose wheel. When it jumped the chock, 300,000 pound wide body went rolling downhill towards another wide body behind it. Thank God I was able to jump into the seat and stop it with accumulator brake pressure.

Even a Mooney size airplane once it starts rolling is difficult to stop with anything other than brakes. 

I had hopped out so brakes weren’t an option (for me at least …). It was flat ground, but there was a strong wind and the rear hinged canopy was up like a sail (F-15).  It was on a run up area in Kuwait.  The plane was rolling backwards towards the dirt.  My whole piloting life flashed through my mind and I pictured my impending death at my commanders hands when his jet ended up in the sand.  I would have thrown my body under a tire to stop it if I thought it would work.  Thank god we bombed the crap out of that place in the Gulf War and the concrete debris was still there 15 years later.  I ran off the ramp, grabbed a huge piece of 3” thick concrete debris with the Herculean strength of desperation and got it under a rear tire just before it would have gone off the pavement.  I braced it with my whole body.  The tire partially rolled up, then settled back down. Most of the back of the jet was hanging over the edge as if I had backed it in.  My wso was still in his seat the whole time yelling that it was rolling.  It wasn’t until after that we both remembered he has an emergency accumulator brake handle right in front of him.

There but for the grace of god go I…

[GeeBee]

4 hours ago, FlyingDude said:

How is that even possible? Sounds scary. 

On some airplanes, airliners in particular if you just chock the nose wheel, the weight on the nose wheel becomes very light during disembarkation, because the airplane unloads front to back.  Eventually the airplane can jump the nose wheel chock. King Airs, especially the 200 series and up can also do it very easily. 

[Jackk]

Once back in my PPL days 

 

 One operator I flew for we did what could be called critical flying, even that being said the pilot was ALWAYS to do a quick one around before shutting the door, also kinda a last boots up first boots down type deal. 
 

If you’re feel yourself in a rush, STOP, regroup and continue 

 That’s how most of these mistakes happen 

 

[dkkim73]

8 hours ago, Ragsf15e said:

My wso was still in his seat the whole time yelling that it was rolling.  It wasn’t until after that we both remembered he has an emergency accumulator brake handle right in front of him.

Wait... The -E doesn't have regular pedal brakes in the rear?

[Jackk]

The Boeing and other swept wing I flew both needed engine power or electric to pressurize the brakes (amongst other things)

 

 I’d be surprised if any transport category as normal toe brakes 

[Ragsf15e]

37 minutes ago, dkkim73 said:

Wait... The -E doesn't have regular pedal brakes in the rear?

As @Jackk said, there are normal pedals in both seats, but they completely stop working as soon as you shut down both engines as you lose hydraulic pressure.  There is an emergency hydraulic accumulator that nobody ever uses (or probably practices) that can give you some pressure for a short time.  Loss of brakes and the dumping of unburned fuel already at the engine is why chocks are always in and the crew chief is back out front before he/she signals to shutdown.  Unfortunately, we had been flying all over the persian gulf for like 6.5 hours of vul time and then ended up diverting (twice) due to a massive sandstorm.  By the time we landed, we were at a marine base with no fixed wing planes and no crew chiefs.  I was the 6 ship lead, so I parked first and (being an idiot, and exhausted) shutdown.  I got out, stretched, took off my g suit and reached up to hang in on the ladder as I realized the ladder was moving backwards and picking up speed!  So at least my entire 6 ship was there to see my buffunery.  Not one of them ever mentioned it to anyone after dinner that night in the marine chow hall.

[Andy95W]

1 hour ago, Jackk said:

The Boeing and other swept wing I flew both needed engine power or electric to pressurize the brakes (amongst other things)

 

 I’d be surprised if any transport category as normal toe brakes 

You should re-read what GeeBee wrote.  He said he stopped the airplane using accumulator brake pressure.

The transport category airplanes I’ve flown had hydraulic accumulators which were good for at least a few applications, and certainly enough to engage the parking brake.

[Jackk]

28 minutes ago, Andy95W said:

You should re-read what GeeBee wrote.  He said he stopped the airplane using accumulator brake pressure.

The transport category airplanes I’ve flown had hydraulic accumulators which were good for at least a few applications, and certainly enough to engage the parking brake.

 After the system has been pressurized 

 

 For the bigger plane we’d ask for permission from our ground guys to pressurize, otherwise you could kill someone on the ground, we only pressurized shortly before engine start 

[47U]

1 hour ago, Jackk said:

 After the system has been pressurized 

 

Of course, the hydraulic system needs pressure.

In my ancient history… the -135 left hydraulic system has an aux pump that runs off the battery.  That will charge the brake accumulator giving you about 3 (no more) brake applications.  When we had to tow an airplane, the brake rider switched the battery to emergency and ran the left aux pump to charge the brake accumulator (in the left wheel well) to 1,000 psi minimum.  It was a pretty weak pump, only 0.7 gph.  If it wouldn’t pressurize, you had to drag chocks to tow the jet.  Nobody wanted to do that.  I had 17 years on the -135, Offutt, Mather, and Beale.  It’s a good jet.  Inefficient by today’s standards, but those were some of the best years of my tenure. 

[Fly Boomer]

18 hours ago, Ragsf15e said:

There but for the grace of god go I…

Great story!

[GeeBee]

9 hours ago, Jackk said:

 After the system has been pressurized 

 

 For the bigger plane we’d ask for permission from our ground guys to pressurize, otherwise you could kill someone on the ground, we only pressurized shortly before engine start 

First of all it was an Airbus A330.

Second, I had just blocked in from crossing the North Atlantic soooooo, the accumulator was charged, really charged.

[dkkim73]

13 hours ago, Ragsf15e said:

So at least my entire 6 ship was there to see my buffunery.  Not one of them ever mentioned it to anyone after dinner that night in the marine chow hall.

Well I guess it's ragsf15e and not rollerf15e, so you got a pass...

[dkkim73]

13 hours ago, Ragsf15e said:

they completely stop working as soon as you shut down both engines as you lose hydraulic pressure

Doh, of course both engines would have been shut down.