Why I don’t regret going from the Mooney to the Glasair

[chriscalandro]

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N540TM/history/20230624/1937Z/KPOC/KPTV/tracklog

[philiplane]

raw speed isn't everything. Be careful.

Edited June 24, 2023 by philiplane

[chriscalandro]

Just now, philiplane said:

raw speed isn't everything. 

You’re right, I did this between 12/14gph running rather ROP

 

for a cross country machine, those 2 things are everything. 

[1980Mooney]

13 minutes ago, philiplane said:

raw speed isn't everything. Be careful.

Low altitude maneuvering looks rather unforgiving.  I suspect that is reflected in the insurance rates.

[Schllc]

47 minutes ago, chriscalandro said:

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N540TM/history/20230624/1937Z/KPOC/KPTV/tracklog

Lol. Good for you!

[toto]

I’m not really familiar with the Glasair line. From the website it looks like they just have one model today - which ac do you have?

[A64Pilot]

 Glasair 3 surely and I’d assume the retract.

https://www.globalair.com/aircraft-for-sale/specifications?specid=1249

How many people can you carry with you, how much luggage space?

I’ve been told by a turbine Lancair builder /owner that if you fly it like a Lear you won’t have any problem. I assume the same with the Glasair, meaning shoot your approaches hot and don’t try to slow down much for landing, land hot. It’s when you try to shoot approaches like a Certified airplane it will kill you.

Edited June 25, 2023 by A64Pilot

[Jim Peace]

I may go the glasair route as well. Initial stages of thinking about it. 
 

but….all the glasair guys I know always have their planes on jacks. Why is this?  

Can it fly 100 hours a year without being taken apart all the time?

[GeeBee]

I am sure if Mooney were allowed to build an airplane without the FAR 23 limits on stall speed, theirs would go fast too. 

[toto]

There’s a nice (albeit somewhat dated) Kitplanes article about the Glasair line safety record. I think this is the source of the charts that @philiplane posted above. 

https://www.kitplanes.com/safety-is-no-accident-4/

[chriscalandro]

38 minutes ago, GeeBee said:

I am sure if Mooney were allowed to build an airplane without the FAR 23 limits on stall speed, theirs would go fast too. 

My airplane stalls at 63/64 kts. About the same as a J

[chriscalandro]

42 minutes ago, Jim Peace said:

I may go the glasair route as well. Initial stages of thinking about it. 
 

but….all the glasair guys I know always have their planes on jacks. Why is this?  

Can it fly 100 hours a year without being taken apart all the time?

So the gear is absolutely a thing that requires a lot of maintenance. It’s metal hose to the wheel wells, and flex hose from there to the actuators. 
 

the lines and the actuators are prone to leaks. 
 

it’s an airplane you want to own jacks for, but it’s really not that complicated to keep going. Do all the preventive work and you will be fine. 

[chriscalandro]

11 minutes ago, toto said:

There’s a nice (albeit somewhat dated) Kitplanes article about the Glasair line safety record. I think this is the source of the charts that @philiplane posted above. 

https://www.kitplanes.com/safety-is-no-accident-4/

If you don’t fly it like a dingus it’s not unsafe at all. 
 

if you do a bunch of cowboy BS in it, it will get you. 

[chriscalandro]

1 hour ago, A64Pilot said:

 Glasair 3 surely and I’d assume the retract.

https://www.globalair.com/aircraft-for-sale/specifications?specid=1249

How many people can you carry with you, how much luggage space?

I’ve been told by a turbine Lancair builder /owner that if you fly it like a Lear you won’t have any problem. I assume the same with the Glasair, meaning shoot your approaches hot and don’t try to slow down much for landing, land hot. It’s when you try to shoot approaches like a Certified airplane it will kill you.

Yes

its 2 seats and luggage space depends on how it was built. I have a ton of storage space in mine and it’s nearly impossible to get it out of CG. 
 

the stall speed is quite low. No worse than the J. But, the AOA at 65-70 kts is a bit extreme. You can land it that way, but not happily. 
 

come in fast, level it out, let the power out and it sets right down. It’s NOT a short field airplane. 

[Jim Peace]

5 minutes ago, chriscalandro said:

It’s NOT a short field airplane. 

Would it be safe to land on a 4000 foot strip if it’s wet?

[chriscalandro]

12 minutes ago, Jim Peace said:

Would it be safe to land on a 4000 foot strip if it’s wet?

I’d think so. 

[kortopates]

How can one compare a 2 seater experimental to a 4 seater certified aircraft? They’re worlds apart.


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[Jim Peace]

2 minutes ago, kortopates said:

How can one compare a 2 seater experimental to a 4 seater certified aircraft? They’re worlds apart.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If you are speaking about avionics purchase for them then you are correct. 

[chriscalandro]

3 minutes ago, Jim Peace said:

If you are speaking about avionics purchase for them then you are correct. 

And availability. 

[kortopates]

everything but the engine except when an aircraft engine is used. Fundamental things including crash worthiness are worlds apart.

If you’re considering a fast experimental for turf, i’d suggest checking the Lancair. The Legacy is more recent, and 360 is older and comparable to the glasair. But Lancair offered a beefier gear for dirt in Australia using same size wheels as the Mooneys.


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[1980Mooney]

1 hour ago, DCarlton said:

Anybody remember why Stoddard Hamilton stopped Glasair II and III production?  Always thought the entire line was a great design.  Thought the III was too much for me though.  

Stoddard-Hamilton Aircraft,  Arlington, Washington, was formed by Tom Hamilton. In 1979, the Glasair TD (also known as the Glasair 1) was the first pre-molded composite aircraft kit on the general aviation market. The II and III followed.

In May, 2000 Stoddard Hamilton laid off all its employees (75 at the time).  In June, 2000 they filed bankruptcy.  

In 2001, Glasair Aviation was formed when Thomas W. Wathen purchased the Glasair assets from bankrupt Stoddard-Hamilton Aircraft, Inc. and signed an agreement with Arlington Aircraft Development, Inc. (AADI) to buy all rights to and assets of the GlaStar model which Arlington Aircraft Development Inc licensed production to Stoddard Hamilton. (The GlaStar was a high wing designed with aluminum wings, stabilizer and rudder, but a fiberglass fuselage and fin, with a pipe cage around the two-seat cockpit to which the wings and engine are directly mounted).  The new companies New Glasair, LLC and New GlaStar, LLC are marketed under the Glasair Aviation name. More than 3000 Glasair kits were delivered worldwide. 

In July 2012 Glasair Aviation announced that it has been acquired by Jilin Hanxing Group a Chinese company.

In September, 2017 Glasair Aviation sold the Glasair II and III assets to Advanced Aero Components. Glasair continued making high wing models.

Home - Glasair Aviation USA

Advanced Aero Components rebranded the II and III as the G2 and G3.  They sell parts and support the fleet.  It looks like they are trying to relaunch a carbon fiber redesigned kit of the G2 and G3 - brochure says "taking orders".  See the site.

Advanced Aero Components Acquires Glasair II and III Assets - KITPLANES

Advanced Aero Components - Kit Aircraft, Parts and Accessories (advanced-aero.com)

[DCarlton]

48 minutes ago, 1980Mooney said:

Stoddard-Hamilton Aircraft,  Arlington, Washington, was formed by Tom Hamilton. In 1979, the Glasair TD (also known as the Glasair 1) was the first pre-molded composite aircraft kit on the general aviation market. The II and III followed.

In May, 2000 Stoddard Hamilton laid off all its employees (75 at the time).  In June, 2000 they filed bankruptcy.  

In 2001, Glasair Aviation was formed when Thomas W. Wathen purchased the Glasair assets from bankrupt Stoddard-Hamilton Aircraft, Inc. and signed an agreement with Arlington Aircraft Development, Inc. (AADI) to buy all rights to and assets of the GlaStar model which Arlington Aircraft Development Inc licensed production to Stoddard Hamilton. (The GlaStar was a high wing designed with aluminum wings, stabilizer and rudder, but a fiberglass fuselage and fin, with a pipe cage around the two-seat cockpit to which the wings and engine are directly mounted).  The new companies New Glasair, LLC and New GlaStar, LLC are marketed under the Glasair Aviation name. More than 3000 Glasair kits were delivered worldwide. 

In July 2012 Glasair Aviation announced that it has been acquired by Jilin Hanxing Group a Chinese company.

In September, 2017 Glasair Aviation sold the Glasair II and III assets to Advanced Aero Components. Glasair continued making high wing models.

Home - Glasair Aviation USA

Advanced Aero Components rebranded the II and III as the G2 and G3.  They sell parts and support the fleet.  It looks like they are trying to relaunch a carbon fiber redesigned kit of the G2 and G3 - brochure says "taking orders".  See the site.

Advanced Aero Components Acquires Glasair II and III Assets - KITPLANES

Advanced Aero Components - Kit Aircraft, Parts and Accessories (advanced-aero.com)

Yeah I googled right after I posted.  Hope they make a go of it.  Cool to see they're in Chino.  

[1980Mooney]

6 minutes ago, DCarlton said:

Yeah I googled right after I posted.  Hope they make a go of it.  Cool to see they're in Chino.  

The entire history was hard to find in one place.  If you look at Adanced Aero Component's website, news releases and on Facebook, it looks like they were making more announcements back in 2019 about progress on the G2 and G3.  In mid 2019 they announced availability of the carbon fiber G2 and G3 kits.

Advanced Aero G2 and G3 "Heritage" Kits Now Available - Glasair Aircraft Owners Association (glasair-owners.com)

Then in late 2019 some commented "come to find out you can't actually buy a Glasair I, II, or III any more since Advanced Aero bought the line up. In the process of ditching fiberglass for carbon fiber the price has skyrocketed to around 100 thousand dollars for the airframe only."

And in January, 2021 "The new owner of the Glasair II and III designs, Advanced Aero Components, isn't answering phones or email (after the G3 acquisition they shipped two G3 kits with updated tail, gear, and canopy, then disappeared without a trace). The EAA SportAir workshops, which in the past offered a dedicated class on "Composite Construction", don't seem to have a composite class scheduled, although they have pretty much everything else scheduled."

Has Advanced Aero priced themselves out of market | Pilots of America

It seems to have gone pretty quiet.  

[chriscalandro]

I believe someone recently received a carbon heritage kit. 

[Danb]

Beautiful plane, how’s the insurance rates. Specs look awesome. Looks like it’ll run away from my Acclaim 

good luck

d