Oil quick drain

[redbaron1982]

Yesterday I removed the oil quick drain from my M20J, because I was going to do the oil control ring flush procedure and didn't want to get the o-ring damaged.

To my surprise, after having drained all the oil (like overnight draining) through the quick drain, when I removed it, another quart (or maybe a pint) of oil came out.

Inspecting the oil quick drain (picture attached), it's easy to see that several threads were submerged in the oil, so whenever the oil is drained through the quick drain there is 1/2 inch or a bit less of oil that is not drained. 

I don't like very much the idea of having a relatively significant amount of old oil getting mixed with the new one.

So, my question is, do I have the wrong oil quick drain? I've checked and for the IO-360 this seems to be the right model: https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/curtis_05-22973.php which surely doesn't look like the one I have. But anyway, it seems that the thread length is the same as the one I currently have, so I'm not sure if it would make a difference.

[N201MKTurbo]

Use an AN911 nipple

https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/hapages/an911.php?clickkey=5344

and an AN910 coupling

https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/hapages/an910.php

to extend the quick drain.

Trim one end of the nipple so it is flush with the inside of the sump when screwed in.

[Greg Ellis]

I have this oil quick drain.  A bit different than the OP's. But I have never thought if it left old oil in the bottom of the sump.  Never thought to remove it.

Saf-Air Oil Drain Valve P5000 | Aircraft Spruce

[N201MKTurbo]

If you think you still got it all with the quick drain pulled, put the airplane on jacks with no tail tie down and jack it a little so the nose points down, You will get about another quart. Or pull the suction screen with the nose up.

[DXB]

1 hour ago, redbaron1982 said:

Yesterday I removed the oil quick drain from my M20J, because I was going to do the oil control ring flush procedure and didn't want to get the o-ring damaged.

To my surprise, after having drained all the oil (like overnight draining) through the quick drain, when I removed it, another quart (or maybe a pint) of oil came out.

Inspecting the oil quick drain (picture attached), it's easy to see that several threads were submerged in the oil, so whenever the oil is drained through the quick drain there is 1/2 inch or a bit less of oil that is not drained. 

I don't like very much the idea of having a relatively significant amount of old oil getting mixed with the new one.

So, my question is, do I have the wrong oil quick drain? I've checked and for the IO-360 this seems to be the right model: https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/curtis_05-22973.php which surely doesn't look like the one I have. But anyway, it seems that the thread length is the same as the one I currently have, so I'm not sure if it would make a difference.

 

17 minutes ago, Greg Ellis said:

I have this oil quick drain.  A bit different than the OP's. But I have never thought if it left old oil in the bottom of the sump.  Never thought to remove it.

Saf-Air Oil Drain Valve P5000 | Aircraft Spruce

Huh. Interesting post.  Seems like the original brass color portion of the thread on the OP’s version allows one to measure the ideal depth of the thread.  I wonder how that compares to the depth of the thread in the P5000, which is on my plane. I couldn’t find these measurements anywhere- could someone post them?

[Bartman]

You can’t see all of it in the picture, but mine has a 90 out of the bottom of the sump, and the quick drain coming out of that. 

[Skates97]

3 hours ago, Greg Ellis said:

I have this oil quick drain.  A bit different than the OP's. But I have never thought if it left old oil in the bottom of the sump.  Never thought to remove it.

Saf-Air Oil Drain Valve P5000 | Aircraft Spruce

I had that same one when I got the plane. A few years later it began to leak a little. I replaced it with this one. It has a cap that screws on and stops any possible leaks. The only disadvantage is that you don't want to lose the adapter to be able to drain it.

https://www.aircraftspruce.com/pages/ep/oilsystems_oildrain/saf_airF62.php

[redbaron1982]

I kind of like the idea of @N201MKTurbo and @Bartman having a nipple and then the quick drain, but I'm not super thrilled to add 2 more "leaking" points.

It does seem that Curtis CCB-5000 is shorter than the one I have. I wonder if I could add a copper gasket to pull it a little bit out and make it flush so no oil is left when draining.

[N201MKTurbo]

16 minutes ago, redbaron1982 said:

I kind of like the idea of @N201MKTurbo and @Bartman having a nipple and then the quick drain, but I'm not super thrilled to add 2 more "leaking" points.

It does seem that Curtis CCB-5000 is shorter than the one I have. I wonder if I could add a copper gasket to pull it a little bit out and make it flush so no oil is left when draining.

They are pipe threads. The tapered threads need to be tightened against the thread taper, there is no gasket. You need pipe dope or Teflon tape to seal the connection.

[ArtVandelay]

If you think you still got it all with the quick drain pulled, put the airplane on jacks with no tail tie down and jack it a little so the nose points down, You will get about another quart.

Or just deflate the nose tire.

[redbaron1982]

@M20Doc Now I'm a bit confused. I was looking at the IPC for the engine and there is no indication of an elbow or nipple. I assume the airframe manuals supersedes the engine's. But is a bit confusing this gray line between the scope of the engine and airframe manuals.

[PT20J]

5 hours ago, M20Doc said:

The J model is supposed to have a nipple and elbow before the quick drain

And, it’s a different valve.

[RLCarter]

Draining overnight has never made any sense to me, you can let it drain for weeks after it’s just a drip and there will still be oil in the hoses, cooler and engine. I plan oil changes after a flight (eliminates running for just an oil change), once back in the hangar the cowling(s) are removed and the oil drained, while it’s draining the filter is removed and cut open for inspection, if all looks good a new filter is primed, installed and safety wired. By this time the oil has stopped flowing and just a few drips every now and then. Close off the drain and fill it with oil, drag it back out for a test run and check for leaks, back in the hangar and reinstall the cowling(s) and I’m good for another 50 hours…. The Mooney takes less time (30 minutes) than 172, but either one I’m done in less than 3 hours

[Hank]

1 hour ago, RLCarter said:

Draining overnight has never made any sense to me, you can let it drain for weeks after it’s just a drip and there will still be oil in the hoses, cooler and engine. I plan oil changes after a flight (eliminates running for just an oil change), once back in the hangar the cowling(s) are removed and the oil drained, while it’s draining the filter is removed and cut open for inspection, if all looks good a new filter is primed, installed and safety wired. By this time the oil has stopped flowing and just a few drips every now and then. Close off the drain and fill it with oil, drag it back out for a test run and check for leaks, back in the hangar and reinstall the cowling(s) and I’m good for another 50 hours…. The Mooney takes less time (30 minutes) than 172, but either one I’m done in less than 3 hours

That's how I prefer to do it, but I also allow a cooling-off period so I don't burn my hands while reaching between the engine and firewall to swap out the filter.

[redbaron1982]

10 minutes ago, Hank said:

That's how I prefer to do it, but I also allow a cooling-off period so I don't burn my hands while reaching between the engine and firewall to swap out the filter.

If you are concerned about burning your hands while changing the filter, try removing the suction screen when the engine is hot...

[Hank]

1 minute ago, redbaron1982 said:

If you are concerned about burning your hands while changing the filter, try removing the suction screen when the engine is hot...

Nah, I just pull both cheeks and start the drain, then go have a cup of coffee or hangar fly with a neighbor for a little bit.

With a dedicated "warm up the oil flight," oil change with wait, after-change "return to service" flight and drip inspection, I'm still done in two hours or less. Ain't no reason to hurry, right?

[RLCarter]

7 hours ago, Hank said:

That's how I prefer to do it, but I also allow a cooling-off period so I don't burn my hands while reaching between the engine and firewall to swap out the filter.

There is probably 45 minutes or so before the work actually starts, but still plenty warm to have oil drain……. Being a motorcycle mechanic for 40+ years kinda teaches you to let things cool just a tad before draining the oil, but also get accustom to overly warm things

[A64Pilot]

On 6/22/2023 at 8:53 AM, redbaron1982 said:

Yesterday I removed the oil quick drain from my M20J, because I was going to do the oil control ring flush procedure and didn't want to get the o-ring damaged.

To my surprise, after having drained all the oil (like overnight draining) through the quick drain, when I removed it, another quart (or maybe a pint) of oil came out.

Inspecting the oil quick drain (picture attached), it's easy to see that several threads were submerged in the oil, so whenever the oil is drained through the quick drain there is 1/2 inch or a bit less of oil that is not drained. 

I don't like very much the idea of having a relatively significant amount of old oil getting mixed with the new one.

So, my question is, do I have the wrong oil quick drain? I've checked and for the IO-360 this seems to be the right model: https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/curtis_05-22973.php which surely doesn't look like the one I have. But anyway, it seems that the thread length is the same as the one I currently have, so I'm not sure if it would make a difference.

That is a fuel tank drain, not an oil drain

[A64Pilot]

2 hours ago, M20Doc said:

Curtis Superior makes a wide variety of valves for many applications, oil among them.

I didn’t say it wouldn’t work, but a drain intended for oil has a nipple on it so you can attach a drain tube, this one obviously does not.

‘It does however have a much more positive locking feature, I’ve always been a little leery of the push on, pull off of the average oil drain.

[philiplane]

On 6/22/2023 at 8:53 AM, redbaron1982 said:

Yesterday I removed the oil quick drain from my M20J, because I was going to do the oil control ring flush procedure and didn't want to get the o-ring damaged.

To my surprise, after having drained all the oil (like overnight draining) through the quick drain, when I removed it, another quart (or maybe a pint) of oil came out.

Inspecting the oil quick drain (picture attached), it's easy to see that several threads were submerged in the oil, so whenever the oil is drained through the quick drain there is 1/2 inch or a bit less of oil that is not drained. 

I don't like very much the idea of having a relatively significant amount of old oil getting mixed with the new one.

So, my question is, do I have the wrong oil quick drain? I've checked and for the IO-360 this seems to be the right model: https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/curtis_05-22973.php which surely doesn't look like the one I have. But anyway, it seems that the thread length is the same as the one I currently have, so I'm not sure if it would make a difference.

by the looks of the thread color, this drain is sitting too high in the port. Which can happen if someone used a tap on the port and drove it to the end of the taper. Normally, the threads on the quick drain will never reach the end (the top) of the port in the pan.  

[redbaron1982]

I went ahead and replaced the quick drain with the parts indicated in Mooney IPC. I had a few doubts regarding how to safety wire it. This is how it looks. Any suggestions/feedback?

I did on safety wire that protects the nipple and the elbow-nipple connection, and another one that holds the quick drain in place.

[MB65E]

Looks fine. No need to safety that much but it can’t hurt. I’ve had bad luck with safe air drains of late, recent issue is the pin that holds the valve in the detent backs out and departs. Curtis still makes nice stuff. The big T oil drain is on mine. 
pics below are the ones I prefer. 
-Matt

 

[Bartman]

Good on you for getting the correct hardware. I agree with Clarence @M20Doc above that it should point aft and for a couple of practical reasons.
 

First, with it pointing aft I can easily drain the oil using a piece of clear vinyl hose from your favorite hardware or home store. I change oil around 25-30 hours and filter every other time and it makes it easily done without removing the lower cowl. I don’t do that every time, but it gives the option. The other more important thing is if it’s pointing aft then any drip will fall unimpeded directly to the floor, or the mat I have under that cowl flap. If it’s pointing forward then drips will end up in the cowl and maybe even on the exhaust itself. 

[redbaron1982]

Is now better?

 

[N201MKTurbo]

43 minutes ago, redbaron1982 said:

Is now better?

 

Your oil is safe now…