Mooney Factory Service Center

[Brandt]

Just a quick report that I got my Acclaim Ultra back from annual yesterday from the Factory Service Center.  

My observations:

The work was outstanding and reasonably priced.

They kept me informed along the way.

They found things that other shops had missed.

They test flew the aircraft when they finished.

I flew a 1400 mile trip yesterday with no squawks.

Kerrville is a nice town.

Mooney is very much in business.

[alextstone]

Just a quick report that I got my Acclaim Ultra back from annual yesterday from the Factory Service Center.  
My observations:
The work was outstanding and reasonably priced.
They kept me informed along the way.
They found things that other shops had missed.
They test flew the aircraft when they finished.
I flew a 1400 mile trip yesterday with no squawks.
Kerrville is a nice town.
Mooney is very much in business.

Thank you for the PIREP!

Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

[Rocket 305]

36 minutes ago, Brandt said:

Just a quick report that I got my Acclaim Ultra back from annual yesterday from the Factory Service Center.  

My observations:

The work was outstanding and reasonably priced.

They kept me informed along the way.

They found things that other shops had missed.

They test flew the aircraft when they finished.

I flew a 1400 mile trip yesterday with no squawks.

Kerrville is a nice town.

Mooney is very much in business.

Amazing that you even got a return phone call, it seems that "very much in business", is somewhat, to be polite, random.

[PT20J]

41 minutes ago, Brandt said:

Just a quick report that I got my Acclaim Ultra back from annual yesterday from the Factory Service Center.  

My observations:

The work was outstanding and reasonably priced.

They kept me informed along the way.

They found things that other shops had missed.

They test flew the aircraft when they finished.

I flew a 1400 mile trip yesterday with no squawks.

Kerrville is a nice town.

Mooney is very much in business.

How long did they have your airplane?

[Brandt]

4 hours ago, PT20J said:

How long did they have your airplane?

They had it for about 8 weeks, but that was due to no fault of their own. Parts related issue with Continental delayed things. The annual itself was just a couple of weeks. 

[LANCECASPER]

21 hours ago, Rocket 305 said:

Amazing that you even got a return phone call, it seems that "very much in business", is somewhat, to be polite, random.

Let's see, who are we going to listen to? Someone who has used the Factory Service Center and picked up his airplane this week? Or someone that likes to make a negative jab at Mooney?

They have a lean crew doing an excellent job. Leave a message and they will get back to you. Send an e-mail and they will return it. This comes from my own recent experience with them over the last year and a half.  The people there are doing an excellent job of keeping the fleet flying by making parts. Also the Factory Service Center is doing a great job of servicing airplanes. If you don't want to use the Factory Service Center, don't. But if you haven't been there personally like @Brandt has, why make those negative comments? How is that constructive?

[Rocket 305]

I love Mooney, I am absolutely a supporter. My plane's very existence depends on them being around. Even with the precarious situation, I generally recommend the Mooney brand to people looking to buy a plane.

I called them to get my annual done there because I wanted to support the company. I wanted various upgrades done. I had a conversation with someone there but didn't get a call back after. Good for Brandt, I am glad he had that experience; however, I was disappointed by Mooney and I'll accept my comment was too snarky, but it's not negative when you put out your personal experience. Social media shouldn't be all unicorns and rainbows. And, yes, it is constructive to hold people accountable.

Your experience is your experience... this was mine.

[Fly Boomer]

On 5/9/2023 at 9:26 AM, Rocket 305 said:

Amazing that you even got a return phone call, it seems that "very much in business", is somewhat, to be polite, random.

I take it you had a bad experience with your Rocket?

EDIT:  After reading to the bottom, it sounds like you didn't end up going to the factory?

[Rocket 305]

1 hour ago, Fly Boomer said:

I take it you had a bad experience with your Rocket?

EDIT:  After reading to the bottom, it sounds like you didn't end up going to the factory?

No, sadly, I didn't hear back from the Mooney factory to get a price or schedule the annual. So it didn't go there.

My plane is now in Willmar for that annual, now three weeks short of a year. A new engine accounts for three months of that, and the Continental crankshaft AD did cost what should have been another week or so. And since it was down waiting for the engine, I took advantage of time and had them install a new AOA, O2 hydro, shock discs, landing height system, and a few others, but that's all stuff installed while waiting for the engine, presumably not adding to the calendar time.  Since they were going to have to transfer the accessories, I had them install a  Garmin EIS with CiES fuel senders, and replace the 2nd mag with another ElectroAir ignition system (yes, there were issues, nothing is easy), perhaps another couple of weeks, maybe a month?

Owning an old (38 years) plane is not easy, and with the Rocket STC, a few more wrinkles. And I realize there are supply chain and labor issues, but the rest of six or more months are still unexplained. I thought that "annual" meant a yearly inspection, not a year in the shop.   Since December, I have been told nearly every week that I'll probably get it back "next week".

Thankfully, instructing in Mooneys and other planes has kept me flying a lot or I'd be a basket case.

I hoped the factory could do this work, and I had interior upgrades on my shopping list. 

I will give the Mooney factory a call next year. As I said, I would like to support them.

[DCarlton]

4 hours ago, LANCECASPER said:

Let's see, who are we going to listen to? Someone who has used the Factory Service Center and picked up his airplane this week? Or someone that likes to make a negative jab at Mooney?

They have a lean crew doing an excellent job. Leave a message and they will get back to you. Send an e-mail and they will return it. This comes from my own recent experience with them over the last year and a half.  The people there are doing an excellent job of keeping the fleet flying by making parts. Also the Factory Service Center is doing a great job of servicing airplanes. If you don't want to use the Factory Service Center, don't. But if you haven't been there personally like @Brandt has, why make those negative comments? How is that constructive?

Are they willing to work on the older Mooney's or just the long bodies?  I'd like to have at least one annual inspection or airframe focused inspection performed by an MSC.  

[Fly Boomer]

1 hour ago, Rocket 305 said:

A new engine accounts for three months of that, and the Continental crankshaft AD did cost what should have been another week or so.

I just looked at MSB23–01A and only saw a single serial number for the TSIO-520-NB.  How did you get hit for that?

[Fly Boomer]

57 minutes ago, DCarlton said:

Are they willing to work on the older Mooney's or just the long bodies?  I'd like to have at least one annual inspection or airframe focused inspection performed by an MSC.  

I'm interested in the answer to this.  I could see why they might not want to dig into some of the older airplanes.

[1980Mooney]

7 hours ago, LANCECASPER said:

They have a lean crew doing an excellent job. ....

 

7 hours ago, Rocket 305 said:

I love Mooney, I am absolutely a supporter. My plane's very existence depends on them being around. Even with the precarious situation, I generally recommend the Mooney brand to people looking to buy a plane.

I called them to get my annual done there because I wanted to support the company. I wanted various upgrades done. I had a conversation with someone there but didn't get a call back after. Good for Brandt, I am glad he had that experience; however, I was disappointed by Mooney and I'll accept my comment was too snarky, but it's not negative when you put out your personal experience. Social media shouldn't be all unicorns and rainbows. And, yes, it is constructive to hold people accountable.

 

4 hours ago, Fly Boomer said:

I take it you had a bad experience with your Rocket?

EDIT:  After reading to the bottom, it sounds like you didn't end up going to the factory?

 

3 hours ago, Rocket 305 said:

No, sadly, I didn't hear back from the Mooney factory to get a price or schedule the annual. So it didn't go there.

My plane is now in Willmar for that annual, now three weeks short of a year. A new engine accounts for three months of that, and the Continental crankshaft AD did cost what should have been another week or so. And since it was down waiting for the engine, I took advantage of time and had them install a new AOA, O2 hydro, shock discs, landing height system, and a few others, but that's all stuff installed while waiting for the engine, presumably not adding to the calendar time.  Since they were going to have to transfer the accessories, I had them install a  Garmin EIS with CiES fuel senders, and replace the 2nd mag with another ElectroAir ignition system (yes, there were issues, nothing is easy), perhaps another couple of weeks, maybe a month? 

Owning an old (38 years) plane is not easy, and with the Rocket STC, a few more wrinkles. And I realize there are supply chain and labor issues, but the rest of six or more months are still unexplained. I thought that "annual" meant a yearly inspection, not a year in the shop.   Since December, I have been told nearly every week that I'll probably get it back "next week".

Thankfully, instructing in Mooneys and other planes has kept me flying a lot or I'd be a basket case.

I hoped the factory could do this work, and I had interior upgrades on my shopping list. 

I will give the Mooney factory a call next year. As I said, I would like to support them.

I suspect the fact that it is a Rocket Engineering conversion may have influenced the situation.  Let's face it, if you are running a lean operation, have more calls and emails than you can answer, I can see that there would be less interest in working on a plane that is "foreign" from the firewall forward (perhaps no interest?).  The Factory Service Center would have no drawings and few common parts from the Factory suppliers (certainly no matching factory part numbers) firewall forward for the Rocket 305 or Missile 300.  The engines are different from the Acclaims and Ovations.  The engine mounts are unique to Rocket Engineering and have nothing in common with Mooney Factory design. Cowlings are different, Etc.

@DCarlton raises a good point - are there any PIREPs from owners of older short or mid bodies?  Also what is the Factory appetite to work on all the other modified Mooneys? - Liquid Rocket, Turbo Bullet, M20-Turbos, Rayjay, and the defunct Mod Works, Mod Squad and Mooney Mart flavors of conversions that have no drawings or support - Trophy 262, Thunderbird 261, Trophy 211, Trophy 212, PFM/M20L Conversion, etc.  as well as all the STC speed mods, gear doors, cowlings, from Mod Works, LASAR, Lo Presti etc, etc.?  Also @Rocket 305 wanted to convert the ignition.  

All these bespoke modifications, with few exactly alike create a lot of extra work, many with poor or little documentation.  The current crew at the Mooney Factory never had anything to do with and never turned a wrench building a short body or a mid body ( i.e. anything with a 4 cylinder Lycoming).  I can understand if they prefer to work on unmodified Mooneys and especially Long bodies.

 

Edited May 10, 2023 by 1980Mooney

[LANCECASPER]

4 hours ago, 1980Mooney said:

 

 

 

I suspect the fact that it is a Rocket Engineering conversion may have influenced the situation.  Let's face it, if you are running a lean operation, have more calls and emails than you can answer, I can see that there would be less interest in working on a plane that is "foreign" from the firewall forward (perhaps no interest?).  The Factory Service Center would have no drawings and few common parts from the Factory suppliers (certainly no matching factory part numbers) firewall forward for the Rocket 305 or Missile 300.  The engines are different from the Acclaims and Ovations.  The engine mounts are unique to Rocket Engineering and have nothing in common with Mooney Factory design. Cowlings are different, Etc.

@DCarlton raises a good point - are there any PIREPs from owners of older short or mid bodies?  Also what is the Factory appetite to work on all the other modified Mooneys? - Liquid Rocket, Turbo Bullet, M20-Turbos, Rayjay, and the defunct Mod Works, Mod Squad and Mooney Mart flavors of conversions that have no drawings or support - Trophy 262, Thunderbird 261, Trophy 211, Trophy 212, PFM/M20L Conversion, etc.  as well as all the STC speed mods, gear doors, cowlings, from Mod Works, LASAR, Lo Presti etc, etc.?  Also @Rocket 305 wanted to convert the ignition.  

All these bespoke modifications, with few exactly alike create a lot of extra work, many with poor or little documentation.  The current crew at the Mooney Factory never had anything to do with and never turned a wrench building a short body or a mid body ( i.e. anything with a 4 cylinder Lycoming).  I can understand if they prefer to work on unmodified Mooneys and especially Long bodies.

 

No question, the knowledge base there right now leans heavily toward Ovations and Acclaims, but Mike Kneese goes all that way back 30+ years so J & K for sure are not foreign to him. It's going to be thorough, so probably more than some mid body owners might be willing to pay. Their hourly rate is very fair, but if an owner hasn't had an MSC full checklist annual in awhile it's going to be a catch-up annual. 

[Rocket 305]

On 5/10/2023 at 12:23 PM, Fly Boomer said:

I just looked at MSB23–01A and only saw a single serial number for the TSIO-520-NB.  How did you get hit for that?

The engine had a lot of hours but was running tip-top, barely burning a quart between changes. I thought it was going to be a relatively benign annual. Then I got the call, I had a bad lifter that took out the whole engine. I was getting quotes of 6 months and more wait list at Poplar Grove and other tier-one shops. However, I was able to get an exchange at RAM. However, the engine they sent had a new crankshaft.  

[Fly Boomer]

7 hours ago, Rocket 305 said:

The engine had a lot of hours but was running tip-top, barely burning a quart between changes. I thought it was going to be a relatively benign annual. Then I got the call, I had a bad lifter that took out the whole engine. I was getting quotes of 6 months and more wait list at Poplar Grove and other tier-one shops. However, I was able to get an exchange at RAM. However, the engine they sent had a new crankshaft.  

Sorry about that -- what are the odds.  I talked to someone at RAM about an engine more than a year ago, and they said they could do it, but somehow it wasn't an especially confidence-inspiring answer.  Other than the obvious crank issue, are you satisfied with the engine?  Did you have problems with any of the specialized Rocket Engineering parts?  Finally, did someone local pull cylinders to examine the crank?

Apologies for the barrage of questions, but I know that I will eventually follow in your tracks.

[1980Mooney]

5 hours ago, Fly Boomer said:

Sorry about that -- what are the odds.  I talked to someone at RAM about an engine more than a year ago, and they said they could do it, but somehow it wasn't an especially confidence-inspiring answer.  Other than the obvious crank issue, are you satisfied with the engine?  Did you have problems with any of the specialized Rocket Engineering parts?  Finally, did someone local pull cylinders to examine the crank?

Apologies for the barrage of questions, but I know that I will eventually follow in your tracks.

The engine and prop combination used in the Rocket 305 (TSIO-520-N/NB & McCauley) are exactly the same as those used in the Cessna 340 & 414.  RAM specializes in engines for Cessna twins so it is not surprising that they had one on the shelf that @Rocket 305 could use without delay.

Edited May 12, 2023 by 1980Mooney

[redbaron1982]

On 5/10/2023 at 7:08 AM, LANCECASPER said:

Let's see, who are we going to listen to? Someone who has used the Factory Service Center and picked up his airplane this week? Or someone that likes to make a negative jab at Mooney?

They have a lean crew doing an excellent job. Leave a message and they will get back to you. Send an e-mail and they will return it. This comes from my own recent experience with them over the last year and a half.  The people there are doing an excellent job of keeping the fleet flying by making parts. Also the Factory Service Center is doing a great job of servicing airplanes. If you don't want to use the Factory Service Center, don't. But if you haven't been there personally like @Brandt has, why make those negative comments? How is that constructive?

My "recent" experience with them was in the second half of last year. They had to fabricate the wing stub spar for my M20J. It was a long process, but they lady I interact with was very responsive and she actually asked me to keep asking her about the part every other week so she could keep the ball rolling. Again, it took like 6 months, most of the time was waiting on the NDT testing and having a DER go and check the data to make sure the parts were good. I think they had some issues during the manufacturing process and they had to scrap part of the production.

[NewMoon]

thx for the update, looking to take a new to me acclaim to the factory.  Refreshing to see a firm deliver quality service 

[glbtrottr]

The service center has always carried the water for the factory as different owners have come to make their millions with brilliant ideas and repeatedly failed.

Mike has been there forever and he’s a good guy at a factory that sadly appears to be dying. Many people have passed or left - many are missed - but management is always the challenge.

As other manufacturers have hung up their manufacturing and production tickets only to be bought up by owners groups to build parts, Johnny came a f to the best of my knowledge has kind of ghosted this stakeholder board to the best of my knowledge.

The MSC at the factory saved my hide once or twice but it seems the corporate support remains hit and Miss.

[Pinecone]

2 hours ago, glbtrottr said:

As other manufacturers have hung up their manufacturing and production tickets only to be bought up by owners groups to build parts, Johnny came a f to the best of my knowledge has kind of ghosted this stakeholder board to the best of my knowledge.

I got hammered for suggesting that maybe the factory should do a monthly or so update on things here on MS or on their website.  

And now, it seems we have heard nothing for a year.

[chriscalandro]

The good news is that maybe once a year the “the factory” chimes in to give false hopes and provides new opportunities for you to give them money. 

[PT20J]

Well, I know for a fact that the factory just completed a lot of 10 nose gear legs. They were great getting one expedited to me.