Light oil mist on cowl and windshield m20f

[takair]

Oh....can you tell me about your I-Phone borescope?

[TonyPynes]

Quote: takair

Oh....can you tell me about your I-Phone borescope?

[carusoam]

Austin,

 

That's a lot of oil on the castellated nut with the cotter pin in place.

 

From some previous experience, I share the following....

 

Consider rechecking the oil return lines from the cylinder heads.  Each one is made of two aluminum tubes connected together by a rubber tube with hose clamps.  They are gravity drains back to the sump.  The aluminum tubes can chafe, the rubber can be old, or the the clamps can be loose.

 

This was a source for oil leaks in my old O360.

 

Good luck, I think you are close to a solution.

 

Best regards,

 

-a-

[TonyPynes]

Will check those lines.

The funny thing is I am losing almost no oil. I have been at 7.5 quarts for the last 10 hours of flying even though I have to clean the cowl and window every time I fly.

[Txbyker]

Tony, just wondering if you every found the source of your oil leak.  

 

[TonyPynes]

Hope to have a mechanic troubleshooter look at it Tuesday. Weather and work have delayed things.

[Shadrach]

Quote: AustinPynes

Will check those lines.

The funny thing is I am losing almost no oil. I have been at 7.5 quarts for the last 10 hours of flying even though I have to clean the cowl and window every time I fly.

[TonyPynes]

I actually read your post, was it here or on AOPA, about your experience with the leak. Sounds brutal.

Reggie who I met online on this site recommended a mechanic who sounds like a good troubleshooter and familiar with different leaks. I plan on being in his shop tomorrow morning and run the engine while he checks for leaks. He has experience with crankcase seals and crankcase cracks and locating them. I cant wait to figure this out once and for all.

I figure it has to be a 1) prop seal, 2)crankshaft seal (even though it has been replaced), 3) crankcase halves seal, 4) crankcase crack (50 hours since machined by Divco -I hope not), 5) prop governor, or 6) some errant hose or connection that I can't fathom right now. But after a couple of thousand dollars I have no idea which one. Which sucks.

I will have to think about your thoughts on the leak occuring even while on the ground. Haven't considered that.

Anyway I am at the point I just want to know what it is so I can start figuring out the damage, fix it, and get on with flying.

I canceled a long promised birthday trip for my wife to visit her family this past weekend because I think the windshield spray is getting worse and I am scheduled to fly her to visit our children in Austin, Texas this coming Saturday.

So unless it is a small issue I am screwed and will be paying her to visit via airlines.

This is not the fun part of ownership. I am ready to move past it.

I will post tomorrow when we find some answers.

[Shadrach]

Quote: AustinPynes

I actually read your post, was it here or on AOPA, about your experience with the leak. Sounds brutal...

[TonyPynes]

I grew up rebuilding engines, transmissions and body work. Then I began rebuilding harleys including splitting cases and stopping leaks on very old and thin crankcase halves. Nothing feels better than overhauling a topend and bottom and putting it altogether again with a wiring harness you made and routed. I can only imagine what it must feel like rebuilding your own plane. I bet it is great. I hope one day to rebuild my own with A&P oversight

It was a lot easier rebuilding in the garage behind the house. Maybe I need to get a hangar home so I can take my time. Heck if I was a little younger I would go get my A&P. I went to Motorcycle repair school after being discharged from the Navy. Was going to work at a friends dealership as a mechanic until I realized they at that time paid less than the guys sweeping up the contruction sites. Roads not taken I guess. Now I am an IT director. Go figure.

This time tomorrow I will know where I stand on the leak. Hopefully with most of my money still in my pocket.

[Shadrach]

I too cut my teeth on old bikes. My flight instructor owned a small FBO and let me turn wrenches, pump gas and sweep the shop in exchange for flight time. He was also kind enough to allow me the use of his 70' Triumph Bonneville when I was short on wheels. This inspired me to buy and restore a few old brit twins as well as undertake some automotive R&R. I too would like to sit for the A&P test, but need to defer until I can afford to devote the time. I currently work with 2 IAs that I've built a relationship with. The more I do, the easier the relationship gets. When I factor in my time, the cost of ownership is about the same, but the comfort that comes from knowing my bird inside and out is invaluable in terms of satisfaction, safety and trouble shooting ability.  I will never unkowingly be taken advantage of again whether at home or away. I hope you find a quick and reasonable solution and I look forward to reading about it!

[TonyPynes]

Update: The leak has been identified.

After spending some troubleshooting time with Lou Pugliese of Flying Lead Aviation in Asheboro, NC (Thanks Reggie for the recommendation) I now am 100% confident that the leak is the crankcase halves seal. With me in the left seat controling the engine and prop and Lou cleaning the engine,  watching and eventually using powder we were able to eliminate the usual suspects and found the lower front leaking seal at the crankcase.

So next steps are to check torque, use some PRC around the bolt in the area leaking and see if we can fix it.

 

But at least now I know. Will know more later this week or early next on the success of our fix.

I can now recommend Lou to anyone in the Piedmont area. A great guy I enjoyed spending a few hours with the identify the leak. He also found a few other areas that needed correcting. Nothing major.

More to follow.

[tony]

So the leak is coming where the two case halves joint together, aft of the crank seal but forward of the sump?

[TonyPynes]

correct

[jetdriven]

Austin, the engine was just overhauled, it is his problem 

[TonyPynes]

It was overhauled by an independent in a small town in Texas. Cases and major work sent out but he assembled. I am in NC. While I plan on pressing for costs I am not sure how successful I will be recooping costs at this point.

[KSMooniac]

Please identify the rebuilder too after you have gotten everything resolved.  Congrats on at least narrowing down the problem!  Hopefully re-torquing will fix it.

[MooneyMitch]

Tony, congratulations on identifying the leak source.   I know you are relieved. 

[TonyPynes]

Scott

 

That is my hope too. The area is pretty difficult to get too without taking the lower cowling off and maybe some baffling so I am wondering if it was an area of neglect from a torque point of view.

And I promise everyone on this and other forums I visit will know the rebuilders name if he doesnt stand behind his work.

 

[Shadrach]

If this is where you say it is, I believe that the alt/gen may need to come out to get a torque wrench on it. I am glad that it was only a leak at the parting flanges as this is often correctable. Do keep us posted.

[ELT]

I have followed this post because I have an E with some leakage at the parting flanges just as Tony does.  The engine is 700 smoh.  2 IAs say the leak is no problem and call it "corrosion control".  No mist on the windshield but some oil drips on the nose wheel when not flown for 2 weeks. Retorque did not fix the leak.  I do not want to split the case or moh a 700 hour good running engine for a minor leak.  Let us know how you resolve the leak.

[TonyPynes]

Ross,

Yep it looks like some stuff has got to be moved.

 

ELT,

I will post how it is fixed. Lets hope it isnt pull and seal. With only 50 hours on this engine I REALLY dont want to do that. But this is hitting the windshield and getting worse so it will have to be fixed either way. I am just glad that we now know for sure. It was very obvious where the leak was. It was great working with a mechanic(Lou Pugliese) who was ready to get to the root of the problem quickly.

Will keep updates coming.

[ReggieM]

Hey Tony, I'm glad that you guys figured it out.  Lou has a tendency to be aggressive in his troubleshooting.  He definitely doesn't like to get beat by the machine

- Reg

 

[TonyPynes]

Quote: ReggieM

Hey Tony, I'm glad that you guys figured it out.  Lou has a tendency to be aggressive in his troubleshooting.  He definitely doesn't like to get beat by the machine

- Reg

 

[ReggieM]

That's the truth!