Thoughts on this 20C?

[wayneferguson]

Hey all, I'm a long time lurker and post more actively on POA.  I'm an IR PPL, live in Atlanta, GA and am moving to Knoxville, TN soon.  I'm currently a part of a flying club with a 180hp 172N and a 150.  My dream plane is an M20J (or A36 or PC12 or King Air), but realistically 80% of my flights are 2 people or less.  I'm married with a 2 year old and would like the capability to be able to fly 2 adults and 2 kids.

do you all think an M20C could be a good fit?  I love the mooney from an efficiency standpoint, but haven't really seen how much room there is in a short body.  I'm 6' am wondering if a child (up to 10 years old) could fit in the back easily.

Also, what are your thoughts on this C model?  It seems like it could work for what I want (GPS, AP, J mods).  I think a J model would be at least twice the price.

http://www.trade-a-plane.com/search?category_level1=Single+Engine+Piston&make=MOONEY&model=M20C&listing_id=2161065&s-type=aircraft

Anyone around Atlanta have a short body I could look at one day?  I fly out of LZU, but could easily go to any other Atlanta airports.

-Wayne

[rbridges]

A C model could handle a 10 year old unless he or she is unusually tall.  If you can swing a J model, I'd get that, but a C model is a great plane.  The back seat is pretty cramped in a C, so adults will sit back there, but they won't mistake it for a Cadillac.  The F and J give an extra 5 inches for the rear passengers.

 

Price seems pretty fair for the C model IMO.  Some may think the airframe TT is a little high.  Is the GPS IFR approach certified?  If so, it looks like a fairly decent cross country plane.  Look out for leaking tanks and double check for corrosion, especially if it's been based in Destin for a while.  

[Bob_Belville]

Pics are from my M20E, the same size as a M20C. The first flight was KGGG-KERV-KGGG 4 hours; The second was KHKY-KMKL-KHKY 6+ hours. I did not card them, but I'm pretty sure all the folks in the back seat are over 10. (All Mooneys are the same width.)

[KLRDMD]

22 minutes ago, wayneferguson said:

Also, what are your thoughts on this C model? 

The owner, Brian Boe is a long time and well respected member of the Mooney list - the E-Mail list that existed many years before MooneySpace. I would imagine it has been well cared for. The asking price in the original ad was $50k, as an FYI. He's owned the airplane 12 years.

[rbridges]

I live in central GA.  Mooneymite lives in Locust Grove.  There is also a guy named Dave in Toccoa.  We all have short bodies.  I'm sure something could be worked out for you to meet up to check out the planes. 

[Browncbr1]

Hi Wayne,

good luck in your move to Knoxville.  You had better get on a hangar list first.  there is a long list going.  

I too liked the J's, but found that for my mission, the F is a better way to go.   The extra back seat room is not the only difference from a C.  You get more gross weight, fuel injection, and some say better pitch stability than short bodies.  They seem to go for just a little more than a C or E, but much less than a J and you can find them with Johnson bar.  Many have been modded with J cowls and windshields.  

[wayneferguson]

17 minutes ago, Browncbr1 said:

Hi Wayne,

good luck in your move to Knoxville.  You had better get on a hangar list first.  there is a long list going.  

I too liked the J's, but found that for my mission, the F is a better way to go.   The extra back seat room is not the only difference from a C.  You get more gross weight, fuel injection, and some say better pitch stability than short bodies.  They seem to go for just a little more than a C or E, but much less than a J and you can find them with Johnson bar.  Many have been modded with J cowls and windshields.  

I have considered an F as well.  My thinking is I can get a good C for 35k, F for 50, or a J for a little more than 80.  This particular C stood out as a good deal.

Ive heard the T hangars at DKX are pretty tough to come by.  Are you aware of any gang hangar availability at DKX or TYS?  I'd definitely want to hangar the bird.

[eman1200]

go back to PoA and ask Dave T.  he's located either at LZU or close to it and has access to a C, also early 60's model.  should be a good comparison.

[DXB]

I'd say this is a good deal if engine and airframe are in good shape.  Problem for you may be that small kids tend to turn into big kids...

 

[Marauder]

31 minutes ago, DXB said:

I'd say this is a good deal if engine and airframe are in good shape.  Problem for you may be that small kids tend to turn into big kids...

 

They do, but after a while they have no interest in flying with "Mom & Dad" (especially in the teenage years). I rented Piper Saratogas and Cessna 182 during those years. It only amounted to a few trips a year.

[glafaille]

Probably a great deal at his asking price.  I was looking for a "C" hot and heavy a year ago and looked hard at this one.  It was overpriced at $50,000 so I let it pass.  I would have bought it at his price today.  I ended up with something different after having poor luck finding a nice "C" for less than $55,000.

I would have to do some work to the panel to get the instruments in the standard order ($5,000), and I wanted an autopilot with altitude hold.  You can add it to this one for about $7,000 if my memory serves me right.  So buying it for $50,000 and $12,000 to get it where I needed just put it out of the running.  But $36,000 changes everything.

Don Maxwell is not too far away for a pre-buy.

[Browncbr1]

9 hours ago, wayneferguson said:

I have considered an F as well.  My thinking is I can get a good C for 35k, F for 50, or a J for a little more than 80.  This particular C stood out as a good deal.

Ive heard the T hangars at DKX are pretty tough to come by.  Are you aware of any gang hangar availability at DKX or TYS?  I'd definitely want to hangar the bird.

You have a better chance of getting a shade hangar come spring when the additions are supposed to be complete at DKX.  I have been on the list for 2 years at DKX and still 8th on shade hangar list.  43rd on community hangar list.  TYS has a shorter list..  I'm at a shade hangar there now.  

I was in the DKX FBO yesterday and saw a Flyer on the cork board for a C.  I do t know if you have seen it or if it is even online.  I recall the price was asking $39 and the engine was around 4-500 hrs.  I didn't look too closely. It had a shotgun panel though.  

[mooniac15u]

Something else to consider for rear seat passengers is shoulder harnesses.  Short-body Mooneys do not have attachment points for rear seat shoulder harnesses.  When the kids are little and still in baby seats it's not a problem.  However, once they move up to boosters or out of kid seats entirely it becomes an issue to consider.  The mid-body Mooneys (F, G, J, K) have a different steel cage configuration that allows for rear shoulder harnesses.

[wayneferguson]

50 minutes ago, mooniac15u said:

Something else to consider for rear seat passengers is shoulder harnesses.  Short-body Mooneys do not have attachment points for rear seat shoulder harnesses.  When the kids are little and still in baby seats it's not a problem.  However, once they move up to boosters or out of kid seats entirely it becomes an issue to consider.  The mid-body Mooneys (F, G, J, K) have a different steel cage configuration that allows for rear shoulder harnesses.

Did not realize this.  So there is no way to attach shoulder harnesses in the back of the short body mooneys?

[Aviationinfo]

I would want to know how many years since the engine was overhauled, and how often it has been flown.   Airplanes for sale tend to sit;  405 hours SMOH sounds great and actually would be, as long as it didn't get overhauled 15 years ago or conversely, it was flown enough to keep the moisture out of the oil.    

Otherwise it sounds like a nice airplane.

[carusoam]

Today, I feel like Jim's dad...

My two kids spent a decade growing up in the back seats of an M20C and a FireBird. 

The M20R fits everything better.  Daycare costs took up too much of the aviation budget, early on...

College costs are at the other end of the spectrum.

Pick what fits for you now, and. What will fit a decade from now, if you can...

Best regards,

-a-

[mooniac15u]

3 hours ago, wayneferguson said:

Did not realize this.  So there is no way to attach shoulder harnesses in the back of the short body mooneys?

I actually don't know about the F and G.  I assumed that you could because of their similarity to J's but you would have to ask the F owners if any of them have rear shoulder harnesses.  I owned a short-body Mooney (M20D) for 8 years and I searched for a rear seat shoulder harness solution but never found one.  I even asked the Mooney reps at Oshkosh about it back in 2007 and they told me there weren't attachment points.

Here's an old Mooneyspace thread on should harness retrofitting and Paula from Alpha Aviation says the same thing as the Mooney reps.

 

[gsxrpilot]

It's probably correct and a good thing to consider that most planes for sale, are sitting and not getting flown regularly if at all.

Mine was an exception. I put 42 hours on it during the month that I sold it.

[Danb]

On 11/14/2016 at 9:14 PM, Bob_Belville said:

Pics are from my M20E, the same size as a M20C. The first flight was KGGG-KERV-KGGG 4 hours; The second was KHKY-KMKL-KHKY 6+ hours. I did not card them, but I'm pretty sure all the folks in the back seat are over 10. (All Mooneys are the same width.)

I've seen Bob and his crew transverse the universe in that awesome "E",they look comfy, happy and ready for wine. Hi to Bob,s lovely wife.

[Hank]

Bob, is that a "fast C" or a "short J"? 

[Jerry Pressley]

if you have made it to Knoxville yet there is a very nice  never 65C in Jackson county nc just across the mountain ridge.  $35,000 with 400 smoh.

[mooniac15u]

48 minutes ago, acpartswhse said:

if you have made it to Knoxville yet there is a very nice  never 65C in Jackson county nc just across the mountain ridge.  $35,000 with 400 smoh.

Freshly repaired after the gear collapse?

[Hoeschen]

I fly my C with wife and to kids (2 and 4). Wife sits in back with one kid and the other sits up front with me. And one time we swapped kids in flight. But you won't buy my C for no $35k!


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