Florida Property Search

[helitim]

Good Day all you Florida Flyers,

This is my first post on your tab as. I live in California presently.  It is your advice I seek on possibly locating a retirement airpark property somewhere in Florida.  The wife (and possibly mother in law) are considering a property in Florida.  Probably prefer something a bit inland to minimize the hurricane issues.  Somehow the chance of an earthquake doesn't seem to bother the ladies but a hurricane does.  We have been performing online searches for the last few weeks and have located several nice properties.  The options in Florida seem to dwarf most other states.  We have looked at the usual suspects, Spruce Creek, Cannon Creek, Jumbolair, etc.  What I was hoping the forum could offer is first hand information on what it's like to live at "your" location ?  If you had it to do all over again, what would you do different, if anything? Do you know of a really nice place you would highly recommend, and why?  Other caveats?

We have a trip scheduled for December 9-13th to view several properties we are interested in but would welcome other opportunities to see something off the beaten path, so to speak.  We will be flying in to Orlando and staying close by.  This seemed like a good central location for driving any given direction in our search.  Our budget is roughly a million dollars.  I don't really want to spend it all unless there is something that just makes me.  Having something on a large inland body of water with direct runway access and large, nice hangar is really high on our list of desirables (OK maybe just my list). 

What say you Mooniacs?

Thank you,

Tim 

[N601RX]

If your interested in northern Fl, check out SkyRanch in Baker Fl. Its just outside of Pensacola. I think most of the places there are about 1/3 of your budget.

[Raptor05121]

Cannon Creek is a very nice quiet place. Not nearly as upscale as Spruce Creek, but its great if you are looking for a more "rural" feel. 2000x25 paved, 3000x100 turf. Weekend fly-outs for breakfast with 10-20 planes. EAA meetings, very close to local shopping. Spruce Creek is very uppity. I've driven around the place and at taxi speeds (~10mph) it takes forever to reach the runway. You'll probably be close to your budget there.

[flyboy0681]

Sure you want to do this? As a person who lived in the bay area for many years and currently lives in FLA, I prefer the bay area.

[helitim]

"Sure you want to do this? As a person who lived in the bay area for many years and currently lives in FLA, I prefer the bay area."

This is exactly why I'm asking for suggestions here.  Why do you say this?  I am genuinely interested.

Tim

[flyboy0681]

10 hours ago, helitim said:

"Sure you want to do this? As a person who lived in the bay area for many years and currently lives in FLA, I prefer the bay area."

This is exactly why I'm asking for suggestions here.  Why do you say this?  I am genuinely interested.

Tim

I was just teasing. While we loved living in Marin (San Rafael) and the city of San Francisco, it was hardly affordable to us back then in the 90's and would be entirely out of reach now. We have a 3200 sqft house just outside of Ft Lauderdale, which by today's standards we bought for peanuts, and enjoy no state income taxes. The summers are brutal, but the winters make it worth it. 

The natural beauty of the bay area along with an endless supply of activities is what we miss the most. Flying there was also a lot different than here because of the diversity of destinations. A couple of hours north found us along the Mendocino coast while pointing the nose south was Big Sur, and to the east the Sierras. In Florida it takes two hours in the Mooney just to get out of the state and there's not much to see.

[Hector]

10 hours ago, helitim said:

"Sure you want to do this? As a person who lived in the bay area for many years and currently lives in FLA, I prefer the bay area."

This is exactly why I'm asking for suggestions here.  Why do you say this?  I am genuinely interested.

Tim

I was just teasing. While we loved living in Marin (San Rafael) and the city of San Francisco, it was hardly affordable to us back then in the 90's and would be entirely out of reach now. We have a 3200 sqft house just outside of Ft Lauderdale, which by today's standards we bought for peanuts, and enjoy no state income taxes. The summers are brutal, but the winters make it worth it. 

The natural beauty of the bay area along with an endless supply of activities is what we miss the most. Flying there was also a lot different than here because of the diversity of destinations. A couple of hours north found us along the Mendocino coast while pointing the nose south was Big Sur, and to the east the Sierras. In Florida it takes two hours in the Mooney just to get out of the state and there's not much to see.

Other than the Keys and the entire Bahamas chain. Alright, just teasing but agree Florida is not endowed with beautiful geography but there are still lots of places to fly and in a year or two we can probably add Cuba to the list and then it will really open up lots of options!

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[helitim]

We live in Pleasanton now and would probably keep the house here and become bi-coastal. (Living in the Bay Area, I got to make sure I spelled that correctly).  Summers here and Winters in Florida. As you say it would be difficult, if not impossible, to find much better year round weather and activities.  If you are bored in California, it's really your own fault.  What I would like to get away from is the egregious cost of living, taxation and density of population.  Having grown up in Alabama, this has been a difficult transition to the California lifestyle and associated costs.  In Alabama I owned 70 acres of land with a private 2000 grass strip and a hangar beside my house.  In California that would cost many millions of dollars.  In Florida, there appear to be numerous very nice airparks scattered over the state and we are coming down to at least explore some of the options available.  The idea of an amphibious plane is very enticing to me and Florida has literally thousands of landing spots available from what I can see.  Are there any particular caveats other than the maintenance and flying issues associated to landing on the many lakes in Florida?

Tim

[flyboy0681]

4 minutes ago, helitim said:

We live in Pleasanton now and would probably keep the house here and become bi-coastal. (Living in the Bay Area, I got to make sure I spelled that correctly).  Summers here and Winters in Florida. As you say it would be difficult, if not impossible, to find much better year round weather and activities.  If you are bored in California, it's really your own fault.  What I would like to get away from is the egregious cost of living, taxation and density of population.  Having grown up in Alabama, this has been a difficult transition to the California lifestyle and associated costs.  In Alabama I owned 70 acres of land with a private 2000 grass strip and a hangar beside my house.  In California that would cost many millions of dollars.  In Florida, there appear to be numerous very nice airparks scattered over the state and we are coming down to at least explore some of the options available.  The idea of an amphibious plane is very enticing to me and Florida has literally thousands of landing spots available from what I can see.  Are there any particular caveats other than the maintenance and flying issues associated to landing on the many lakes in Florida?

Tim

While the cost of living is generally better down here, it's a trade-off. Insurance costs are among the highest in the country, but electricity is among the lowest. Sales tax is 6% and 100LL can be had for less than $3.50 (for the time being). We have plenty of toll roads, but they are in excellent condition. 

If you find yourself down in the Ft Lauderdale area, I'll be happy to take you up for a look around.

 

[bonal]

Understand you wanting to get away from the high state tax but there are lots of places within the state that get you away from crowded living at less than 1/3 of the property values in Pleasanton. As I get closer to retirement I think if I were to leave the state where would I like to live. Nothing comes to mind. Other than taxes the only thing I don't like is fire season.

[helitim]

Bonal,

What you are suggesting is really the crux of my question.  If not here, then where?  My wife has never visited Florida but is very interested.  This trip is to familiarize her to a very small degree with what somewhere other than California has to offer.  I am fairly familiar with Florida having visited many times over the years but, I have never lived there.  Local knowledge is definitely invaluable to help maximize our time during this trip which is why I am very grateful for all of the postings and suggestions the forum has offered.  Please keep the information flowing.

Tim

[bonal]

Not really suggesting anything I can't imagine the crazy weather back east but to each their own. IMHO geography speaking Calif has more diversity than any where else on earth. The taxes do drive me nuts for sure.

[carusoam]

Where is Parker lately?

For all things Mooney, Sea plane, and aviation insurance, with TX and FL experience, Parker is our go to guy.

Best regards,

-a-

[ArtVandelay]

Not really suggesting anything I can't imagine the crazy weather back east but to each their own. IMHO geography speaking Calif has more diversity than any where else on earth. The taxes do drive me nuts for sure.

Us crazy weather ? We don't have mud slides, droughts so bad restaurants can't serve water, etc.

They don't call it the sunshine state for nothing.

The downsides: thunderstorms pretty common, it can get hot ( you can avoid both by flying in the AM, humidity is high

The closer to the ocean, the more moderate your temps, Orlando runs 5-10 degrees warmer than Daytona in general.

Occasional hurricane, you'll have plenty of warning.

[kpaul]

Tim,

Having lived in California, Washington, Montana, Utah, New Mexico, Texas, Georgia and Florida I can tell you that you already live on the correct side of the US to enjoy wide open spaces and GA flying.  I am currently live in the panhandle of Florida (the other LA-Lower Alabama).  If you enjoy hot and humid or cold and humid weather then it's great.  There are probably a solid two weeks in the spring and again in the fall that are pleasant with lower humidity.  Spring through fall you get the daily thunderstorms that build along the I-10 corridor, so yes early morning flights or flying after dark is usually the best time.  Then there is the F.A.R. Part 93 airspace to contend with. You have MOAs and Restricted Use areas along the length of the panhandle. It takes the enjoyment out of flying in that area along with the tourist traffic and sightseeing/banner tows along the beach.  It is a pretty flight down the beach, but if you enjoy terrain then it is a haul to the nearest mountain.  Did I mention the humidity? Yes, well it greatly cuts down on the visibility you generally enjoy out west. 

I know there are many people that disagree with my take on Florida, however this is just one man's opinion.

[flyboy0681]

4 hours ago, kpaul said:

Tim,

Having lived in California, Washington, Montana, Utah, New Mexico, Texas, Georgia and Florida I can tell you that you already live on the correct side of the US to enjoy wide open spaces and GA flying.  I am currently live in the panhandle of Florida (the other LA-Lower Alabama).  If you enjoy hot and humid or cold and humid weather then it's great.  There are probably a solid two weeks in the spring and again in the fall that are pleasant with lower humidity.  Spring through fall you get the daily thunderstorms that build along the I-10 corridor, so yes early morning flights or flying after dark is usually the best time.  Then there is the F.A.R. Part 93 airspace to contend with. You have MOAs and Restricted Use areas along the length of the panhandle. It takes the enjoyment out of flying in that area along with the tourist traffic and sightseeing/banner tows along the beach.  It is a pretty flight down the beach, but if you enjoy terrain then it is a haul to the nearest mountain.  Did I mention the humidity? Yes, well it greatly cuts down on the visibility you generally enjoy out west. 

I know there are many people that disagree with my take on Florida, however this is just one man's opinion.

Like I said, takeoff's. Yes California has incredible topological diversity, but FLA has pristine white beaches and if one decides they don't have to live in an urban area, living on the ocean is affordable. Also as I mentioned before, the summers here can be brutal. but the winters here are divine, this week being one of them. In the southern part of the state we can count on daily highs of 81 from November through April with nights dipping into the mid 60's.  There is no better place to fly during the winter months than down here, whether it's to do a stone crab run on the west coast, funk out in Key West or find a secluded beach in the Bahamas.

 

[bonal]

5 hours ago, teejayevans said:

Us crazy weather ? We don't have mud slides, droughts so bad restaurants can't serve water, etc.

They don't call it the sunshine state for nothing.

The downsides: thunderstorms pretty common, it can get hot ( you can avoid both by flying in the AM, humidity is high

The closer to the ocean, the more moderate your temps, Orlando runs 5-10 degrees warmer than Daytona in general.

Occasional hurricane, you'll have plenty of warning.

Drought is caused by nature a water shortage is caused by man ie regulations preventing water storage the mudslides in SoCal are nothing compared to the every season mid west flooding and a rare occurrence. Want sandy beaches 840 miles of shoreline not as much as Florida but from SoCal to the Oregon border an incredible variety of scenery. Right now we are having a cold spell 25 degrees but perfect weather for flight winter is my favorite time of year to fly. The Sierras are as beautiful as any mountain range want flat the Central Valley is bigger than most mid west states how bout desert the Mohave I believe it's bigger than the Sahara. Like big cities (yuck) got those too. Giant redwoods no where else. Want some really fine wine Napa Sonoma one of the finest regions in the world.

There are lots of great places to live all over this great nation. I just happen to love the one I'm in.

[kpaul]

40 minutes ago, bonal said:

They don't call it the sunshine state for nothing.

We have received over 100 inches of rain, per year, in the "Sunshine" state for the past three years.

[Mooneymite]

This thread has kind of concentrated on the location of the air park rather than a discussion about air-parks.  Almost 20 years ago, my wife and I took the plunge and moved to an airpark and have never regretted it.  If you love airplanes and want to get your money's worth out of owning a plane, the air park is the way to go.  I could write paragraphs about the advantages, but will spare you.

However....it was just dumb, blind luck that we avoided the many "gotcha's" of air parks.  Before you decide on a specific air park, do your research!  Just because a place has a great runway, doesn't mean it's a great air park.  Caveat Emptor.

You have probably already used the resources at  livingwithyourplane.com

That's a great start, but there are a lot more issues you need to be aware of....the basic one of "who owns the runway" can bite you bad if you choose the wrong air park.

Good luck in your search and your research!

[helitim]

Mooneymite, I have driven by your airpark many times and agree that you chose a really nice spot.  Central Georgia is not for everybody but your neck of the woods is much nicer than most folks would ever believe. I did all my gyrocopter training at Herbert Smart airport in Macon.  

A little more about my background that I have not posted here before, I don't think.  I lived for many years in North Alabama so I am acclimated to the humidity and lower visibility than we have here on the left coast.  I built, owned and maintained a 2000' grass strip on 70 acres.  It was nice to be able to walk out your front door to your hangar and pull the plane out for a 15 minute flight before dark when everything was calm and beautiful.  I worked my backside off for two and a half solid years building that place and it was beautiful.  After all the hard work was done and I had lived there with everything for a couple of years, what I realized was that I had this really nice place all to myself.  While that is nice sometimes, I really missed the camaraderie of other pilots and the airport way of life.  Where we live now in California, the airport is a very active and good group of guys.  These types of friends are one of the things I want to maintain wherever we end up.  The airpark/airport lifestyle is a big part what we are looking for.  Cost of living, weather, etc are all very important as well.  Utopia doesn't exist but we are looking for the closest we can find.  Who knows, maybe we are already there and just don't know it. 

Tim

[Mooneymite]

I agree with you on all points!

The community is key.  The size of the community is important; too small, or too large can be problematical.  Regardless of the central interest in aviation, communities are made up of individuals who need to get along for the experience to be fun.

If you ever get by here again, stop by and say hello.

[Marauder]

I agree with you on all points!

The community is key.  The size of the community is important; too small, or too large can be problematical.  Regardless of the central interest in aviation, communities are made up of individuals who need to get along for the experience to be fun.

If you ever get by here again, stop by and say hello.

I began researching air parks a year or so ago when I thought I could pull an early retirement. My biggest concern was living with all those egos

Pilots tend to be a successful opinionated group (just look at some of the threads here). It is one thing to hang out with them on the Internet, how is it to live with them?

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[Parker_Woodruff]

On 11/28/2015, 11:56:31, carusoam said:

Where is Parker lately?

For all things Mooney, Sea plane, and aviation insurance, with TX and FL experience, Parker is our go to guy.

Best regards,

-a-

I lived in Lakeland, FL for two and a half years.  Loved it.

There is a fly-in community north of Tampa...though I can't remember what it's called.

Spruce Creek is nice, but certainly looks expensive.  If you want to check it out for a weekend, call up Chester Lawson at Spruce Creek and get your MES rating (if you've already got the MEL to go with it). h2oflight.com

I certainly miss Lakeland.  Nice, slower-paced city with close proximity to Tampa.  TPA is my favorite commercial airport to fly in and out of.  And Tampa TRACON is probably the best group of controllers I've ever dealt with from the air.  I can't say I'm a fan of Orlando (traffic and perpetual tourism).

Cost of living anywhere in FL is a heck of a lot better than CA.

The DFW area has more (and better) fly-in communities than Florida.  But as I'm looking outside at 2SM visibility, mist, and 45 degrees, I really want to be in Florida right now.

 

[Mooneymite]

28 minutes ago, Marauder said:

It is one thing to hang out with them on the Internet, how is it to live with them?

I don't think living in an aviation community is really any different from any other community neighborhood in that respect.

That's a prime reason to pick one that is big enough, but not too big.   In a community with eight, or ten families, one jerk can make life miserable.  We have about 100 families....that may be bordering on too big now because we don't have the close contact of a small community any more, but it keeps any potential jerks at bay.

However, a small community of pilot-saints would be ideal.  Good luck on that. 

[flyboy0681]

3 minutes ago, Parker_Woodruff said:

  And Tampa TRACON is probably the best group of controllers I've ever dealt with from the air. 

 

I haven't been totally impressed with TPA. Before I got my instrument ticket a couple of years ago I used to fly often to Tallahassee to see my kid in college. When I got my taxi instructions from my home airport I would request flight following and got it every time. So here I am, flying around the state, getting handed off a dozen times. My hand-off to Tampa always went smooth and they were pleasant to deal with, but when I left their sector they never coordinated with Jacksonville Center and always told me that radar service was terminated, squawk VFR. At that point I had to raise Jacksonville Center, wait until they could get back to me and then go through the process to get back into the system again. Eventually I got wise to this and requested continued flight following when I got to a certain point, which they usually accommodated me with, but not always.