201er Posted October 5, 2015 Report Posted October 5, 2015 Driving on the turnpike, just watched a 737 come into Newark without landing light. Nav lights and strobes on but no landing or taxi lights. How does that happen? He was short final over the turnpike already. Noticed the oddity when planes ahead and behind in the conga line had theirs on. Byron, did you have a little whoopsie tonight? Quote
gsengle Posted October 5, 2015 Report Posted October 5, 2015 They do have brighter runway lights than most of us have at home... Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote
Hank Posted October 5, 2015 Report Posted October 5, 2015 I was waiting to depart Panama City after lunch today. First a Piper came in, and I was expecting clearance next. Nope. Saw about 8 landing lights coming in, some on wig wag and some steady. Decided it had to be one of the airliners that the runway was stretched to 150' x 10,000' to handle. When it went by, it was a very dark (black? navy?) TBM. Once he turned off a taxiway sooner than the Piper, I was cleared to depart. Absolutely amazing airplane! Now I'm feeling the need to add wigwag strobes halfway out each wing, and lights on each gear leg. Maybe some wingtip strobes, too. 1 Quote
Bob - S50 Posted October 5, 2015 Report Posted October 5, 2015 I can think of four reasons why the lights might not be on. Don't know which would apply in this case: 1. Whoever did the walk around didn't or couldn't check the filaments on the landing lights and they were both burned out. 2. He wasn't cleared to land yet. Most airline pilots use the landing light switch as a memory aid. If the landing lights are on, we are cleared to land. If they are off, we need to check. I had to go around once for lack of landing clearance at DTW. 3. Flying an approach to near minimums. I would often leave the landing light off until we broke out. Having them on in the clouds makes it more difficult to see the approach/runway lights. I've had one time when all we saw at minimums were the approach lights. That let us continue down to 100' where we saw the runway and landed. With the landing lights on we might not be able to find the approach lights and have to go missed approach. 4. Distraction. The pilots got distracted at some point and just forgot. 4 Quote
Mooneymite Posted October 5, 2015 Report Posted October 5, 2015 Nav lights and strobes on but no landing or taxi lights. Was the gear down? Everything else is a detail. 1 Quote
Seth Posted October 5, 2015 Report Posted October 5, 2015 I thought the rule was landing lights on below 10,000 for many major airlines. -Seth Quote
N201MKTurbo Posted October 5, 2015 Report Posted October 5, 2015 (edited) On a 737 it is a switch just like in our Mooneys. Airline pilots are humans just like us. Even with all the training checklists and a second pilot, Stuff Happens. On short final the tower probably asked to "Check Landing lights". FWIW, you can land at night without landing lights, I do it all the time. Edited October 5, 2015 by N201MKTurbo 1 Quote
jetdriven Posted October 5, 2015 Report Posted October 5, 2015 The actual landing lights are in the wing root. The taxi light is on the nose wheel but the newest versions don't have a light there. Quote
Mooney20 Posted October 5, 2015 Report Posted October 5, 2015 (edited) I thought the rule was landing lights on below 10,000 for many major airlines. -Seth The procedure is 18,000' at my shop. The landing and taxi lights on the nose gear are the "cleared to land" switches. Not a procedure, but widely used technique. This is on 757/767. Edited October 5, 2015 by Mooney20 added aircraft type Quote
201er Posted October 5, 2015 Author Report Posted October 5, 2015 The actual landing lights are in the wing root. The taxi light is on the nose wheel but the newest versions don't have a light there. Well at least we now know who done it Quote
Mooneymite Posted October 5, 2015 Report Posted October 5, 2015 The actual landing lights are in the wing root. The taxi light is on the nose wheel but the newest versions don't have a light there. Lots of versions of the 737....some of the older ones didn't have taxi lights on the nose gear either. Landing lights in the wing roots and outboard landing lights about mid-way out on the wings retract and extend electrically. Landing lights were always an airline captain's technique item. The SOP's/checklist may say "Landing lights......on below 18,000", but believe me, they came on when/if the captain wanted them on. Woe be to the impudent FO who touched THOSE switches. 1 Quote
Marauder Posted October 5, 2015 Report Posted October 5, 2015 Was the gear down?Everything else is a detail. Great question... Have there been many "gear up" accidents in 121 ops? I'm sure the 135 boys may have had a few. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Quote
Mooneymite Posted October 5, 2015 Report Posted October 5, 2015 http://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/AccidentReports/Reports/AAR9701.pdf Quote
Marauder Posted October 6, 2015 Report Posted October 6, 2015 http://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/AccidentReports/Reports/AAR9701.pdf Quite an interesting read. Especially the CRM dynamics. What happens to pilots after incident like this? Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Quote
Hank Posted October 6, 2015 Report Posted October 6, 2015 Landing lights were always an airline captain's technique item. The SOP's/checklist may say "Landing lights......on below 18,000", but believe me, they came on when/if the captain wanted them on. Woe be to the impudent FO who touched THOSE switches. Gus, I just don't see you being that kind of grumpy old captain. This must be a tale of when you were a young shavetail! 1 Quote
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