Oil Temperature/Winterization Kit

[epsalant]

I have a 1989 M20J and fly mostly around the New York/New Jersey area.  I'm not sure if I should be flying with a winterization kit when the cold weather comes.  Unfortunately the oil temperature gauge is not calibrated, it only shows 150 and 245 degrees F with no marks in between.  So I can't tell if the oil is getting hot enough (say 180F) in the winter (or the summer for that matter).  I understand the readings are not linear, so no way to tell the actual temperatures. 

I have a JPI, so as one option, I could pay for the upgrade so the JPI would read oil temp.  As a cheaper option, when I had my  oil changed last week, I asked the mechanic to stick the factory oil temp probe into a pan of 180 F water so that I could put a grease pencil mark on the glass of the oil temp gauge, so I'd know if the oil was reaching 180F.  Unfortunately, and for unclear reasons, the mechanic could not get the oil gauge to read anything when he did this (he had the master on and I trust he also had the radio/avionics switch on).  He put the temp probe back when he was done and it worked fine in flight.  So not clear why it didn't read in the pan of hot water.

Any thoughts ?

1)  Do I need a winterization kit ?

2) Should I get the JPI probe ? (this involves sending unit back to factory for oil temp upgrade)

3) Should I try a Mooney Service Center and have them get the probe to work in a pan of 180 F water ?

Evan

[Piloto]

You don't need a winterization kit for the engine but you will need a means of preheat before engine start if tempertures falls below 30F.

José

 

[epsalant]

No problem to preheat.  The engine has electric preheat and I'm in a hangar.  I just have no way to tell if the engine oil is getting hot enough to boil the water off.  So I'm just wondering best way to tell if oil getting hot enough.

[Ron McBride]

Get the JPI probe installed. Worries are over, you will know.   I have one in my F.  You will also know during the summer if you are running to hot.  Last month at altitude was very hot, I had to open the cowl flaps accasionally to cool the oil. Without the JPI, I would not have known this.

Ron

[danb35]

Does your oil analysis show water in the oil?  If not, you're good.  But yes, you'd want to keep track of oil temp on your engine monitor, I'd think.  Shame JPI makes you send the unit back to the factory for that--for EI, all you have to do is connect the probe and you can reconfigure the monitor in place.

[epsalant]

Quote: danb35

Does your oil analysis show water in the oil?  If not, you're good.  But yes, you'd want to keep track of oil temp on your engine monitor, I'd think.  Shame JPI makes you send the unit back to the factory for that--for EI, all you have to do is connect the probe and you can reconfigure the monitor in place.

[fantom]

I added a JPI oil temp probe after my JPI-700 was installed, and it didn't have to go back to JPI. Just purchase an oil probe and have your friendly A&P install it.

[fantom]

I added a JPI oil temp probe after my JPI-700 was installed, and it didn't have to go back to JPI. Just purchase an oil probe and have your friendly A&P install it.

[Magnum]

The oiltemp probe has only one wire attached, your mechanic should make a connection between the probe (e.g. at the thread) and the ground of your Mooney (I'd use the engine), then it should work. Don't put it completly into water, as this will create a short circuit.

He doesn't know much about electricity? :-)

[jlunseth]

At the recent Mooney PPP Bruce Yeager suggested that Mooneys in "our climate" (he was speaking of Minnesota) can use a winterization kit on the oil cooler, because the cooler is very efficient and in cold temperatures does not allow the oil to get hot enough to "boil off" any water.  I am going to guess that "your climate" is not as cold as ours (below zero F a good part of the winter), and you may not need one.

For what its worth, I also heard a story from an instructor the same weekend about flying into a temperature inversion not realizing he had a winterization kits on, and seeing high temps in the engine at upper altitudes. 

[epsalant]

Quote: Magnum

The oiltemp probe has only one wire attached, your mechanic should make a connection between the probe (e.g. at the thread) and the ground of your Mooney (I'd use the engine), then it should work. Don't put it completly into water, as this will create a short circuit.

He doesn't know much about electricity? :-)

[N9937c]

I am amazed that the A &P didnt try to sell you a new oil temp guage. Hard to imagine how some of these guys got their ticket.

What is even more amazing is that some of them will chastize an aircraft owner for doing some of his own maintenance.

larry

[Beard]

I have a 1984 J model with a stock temp gauge. As the stock temp gauge does not have a detailed calibration, and I understand that it is not linear, has anyone out there with the stock gauge somehow discovered what position is 180F? If so could you please post a picture so I too can mark 180F on mine with a grease pencil.

[jetdriven]

I haven’t seen a winterizarion kit available for a J model but some people tape off half of the oil cooler wirh silver tape in cold weather. 

 

Edited January 5, 2018 by jetdriven

[Guest]

44 minutes ago, Beard said:

I have a 1984 J model with a stock temp gauge. As the stock temp gauge does not have a detailed calibration, and I understand that it is not linear, has anyone out there with the stock gauge somehow discovered what position is 180F? If so could you please post a picture so I too can mark 180F on mine with a grease pencil.

You can place the oil temp probe(still connected)  in a tin can of water with a candy thermometer to test it.

Clarence

[blaine beaven]

I have heard of someone using an oil cooler shutter from Vans with a control knob in the cabin. It’s fitted behind the oil cooler on a J model, and by slowing the air flowing through it (by closing the exit) it will keep the temperature at mid range on the stock gauge in -25C. So I’ve been told.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Ragsf15e]

Don’t all these engines have a vernatherm that bypasses the oil cooler until it’s ~180 anyway?

[DXB]

44 minutes ago, Ragsf15e said:

Don’t all these engines have a vernatherm that bypasses the oil cooler until it’s ~180 anyway?

Great question - once heated, my oil in flight never seems to drop below about 178 even on the coldest day - I'd assumed that was the reason.

[Ragsf15e]

3 hours ago, DXB said:

Great question - once heated, my oil in flight never seems to drop below about 178 even on the coldest day - I'd assumed that was the reason.

Same.  Im in eastern Washington state and it’s chilly in the winter.  Cruise at -10ish F from time to time with oil at 180. (And cool chts!)

[PeteMc]

@epsalant  The first winter I had my plane I asked my mechanic about boiling off the oil and if it helped to take the oil cap off after flights to get whatever moisture I could out while I was tying down the plane.  He said that even if the oil temp didn't get real hot, there were still a LOT of hot parts in the engine the oil was running over.  So if the plane was flown often or on a long trips, there was no issue on getting any water out of the oil. 

On the cap, he wasn't sure.  But figured as I did that any water vapor you could get out was not a bad thing.  But you do not want to leave the cap off or moisture would find it's way back into the engine after it cools.  So for those few minutes while you're putting the plane away and you see vapor coming out of the oil filler, that was fine.  Then close it back up.

[A64Pilot]

23 hours ago, Ragsf15e said:

Don’t all these engines have a vernatherm that bypasses the oil cooler until it’s ~180 anyway?

You would think that’s how they work because that’s how the thermostat in a car works, but it’s not.

The way an aircraft works is in cold temps the oil flows though the cooler and bypasses it too. when the oil temp gets hot enough the bypass is closed off and all oil goes though the cooler

So if it’s really cold, enough oil is still flowing through the cooler so that it never gets hot enough to close off the bypass. The easiest way to get the oil temp up is to remove some of the coolers ability to cool, easiest way to do that of course is to block some of the air flow

I believe it works the way it does because if it kept oil from flowing though the cooler until it got hot enough, when the valve opened you would get a cold slug of oil through the system. but if oil continually flows though the cooler, then all the oil is kept at the same temp, that my theory anyway.

 

Edited October 31, 2021 by A64Pilot

[carusoam]

There are proper ways to block airflow to an oil cooler…

With the IO550… there is a proper winterization kit… supplied by Continental…

So even if you use cardboard and duct tape… cover it the proper way to avoid sending cold slugs of oil to the engine…

The direction of the tubes makes the difference…

There is probably pics and descriptions around here for Mooney engines…

hmmmm…. Got any close up pics of the Vans’ IO360 cooler installation?

This would help to see if they are used the same way as a Mooney…

Best regards,

-a-

[Ragsf15e]

Someone should ask @M20Doc.  If anyone needs a winterization kit it’s those crazy Canadians!  We’re talking about flying in the “cold”, and he’ll probably make fun of us “southerners” for being wusses for even calling it cold at all!

[Guest]

The only models with a winter blocker that I’ve seen are the K and R, all others don’t mention it.  Blocking a portion of the cooler is the only way I know of.  I’ve heard of placing a thick layer of felt in front of the cooler to restrict air flow through the cooler.

Clarence