Different Garmin 430 question

[DonMuncy]

I have had my Garmin 430 for a long time. Lately it has started having trouble with accepting inputs from various buttons. Originally, the flip-flop between the active and stand-by com would not work unless I pushed it multiple times. Someone (perhaps here on MS) suggested that I should "exercise" the button by pushing it many times. I finally went out to the hangar and must have pushed it 200 times or more, and it seemed to fix it. Now it is acting up with a bunch of the buttons, Proc., Flight plan, etc. It is my understanding that Garmin will not allow avionic shops to open up the box to clean the contacts. That you are supposed to send it back to them, and let them do a flat-rate tune-up for about 1AMU. 

Has anyone ever worked on this problem? Will anyone ever open up a 430. Since the warranty is long gone, Garmin couldn't threaten to void the warranty if you did. 

Do I need to spend an afternoon pushing each button on the box a zillion times. Any other ideas? 

[carusoam]

Let’s ask @Alan Fox…. 

He probably has a button exerciser…

Best regards,

-a-

[Ragsf15e]

2 minutes ago, DonMuncy said:

I have had my Garmin 430 for a long time. Lately it has started having trouble with accepting inputs from various buttons. Originally, the flip-flop between the active and stand-by com would not work unless I pushed it multiple times. Someone (perhaps here on MS) suggested that I should "exercise" the button by pushing it many times. I finally went out to the hangar and must have pushed it 200 times or more, and it seemed to fix it. Now it is acting up with a bunch of the buttons, Proc., Flight plan, etc. It is my understanding that Garmin will not allow avionic shops to open up the box to clean the contacts. That you are supposed to send it back to them, and let them do a flat-rate tune-up for about 1AMU. 

Has anyone ever worked on this problem? Will anyone ever open up a 430. Since the warranty is long gone, Garmin couldn't threaten to void the warranty if you did. 

Do I need to spend an afternoon pushing each button on the box a zillion times. Any other ideas? 

You’ll probably get a lot of opinions, but sending it in for the $1500ish flat rate isn’t terrible in my opinion.  You end up with essentially a new unit and they tend to last for a long time.  When you look at that vs a new one, I would probably just send it in and expect it to be great for another 15 years.

[DonMuncy]

21 minutes ago, Ragsf15e said:

You’ll probably get a lot of opinions, but sending it in for the $1500ish flat rate isn’t terrible in my opinion.  You end up with essentially a new unit and they tend to last for a long time.  When you look at that vs a new one, I would probably just send it in and expect it to be great for another 15 years.

I just hate it when someone uses logic when I just want to save a buck

Another question that would follow that is that the screen is not quite pristine. Does anyone know if Garmin still has those re[placement parts. Last I heard, they really intended to only support the 430s as long as their parts last.

[Ragsf15e]

49 minutes ago, DonMuncy said:

I just hate it when someone uses logic when I just want to save a buck

Another question that would follow that is that the screen is not quite pristine. Does anyone know if Garmin still has those re[placement parts. Last I heard, they really intended to only support the 430s as long as their parts last.

Interesting to hear what people say, but the way I understand it, they only support it until they run out of parts.  You should expect that they still have everything now, but probably not much longer.  Have your shop write up the buttons and the screen issues so there’s no doubt.

[0TreeLemur]

In the past year I read somewhere that big G expects to support the 430 series until at least 2024.   Sorry I can't provide a source.

[midlifeflyer]

Curious and I have not done it, so it's "grain of salt" time

Have you (or anyone else with the issue) tried cleaning? Over the years, oil and dirt from fingers (not to mention crumbs and those "grains of salt" from snacks) can get inside and make the contact more difficult. It happens to keyboards all the time. Perhaps a little compressed air gently applied might help? 

[LANCECASPER]

1 hour ago, midlifeflyer said:

Curious and I have not done it, so it's "grain of salt" time

Have you (or anyone else with the issue) tried cleaning? Over the years, oil and dirt from fingers (not to mention crumbs and those "grains of salt" from snacks) can get inside and make the contact more difficult. It happens to keyboards all the time. Perhaps a little compressed air gently applied might help? 

No way really to get compressed air in that membrane between the button and the switch. I had a sticky 430 years ago and what Don described, exercising the switch repeatedly, took care of it. I would sure try that before sending it in for a flat rate repair if that's the only issue with it.

[PT20J]

Contact cleaner is only a temporary fix. Once the contacts wear down to base metal, they will oxidize again. Same with exercising the switch. 

If it were me, and I didn’t plan to replace the unit with something newer, I would send it back to Garmin while they still have the parts to repair it. I seem to recall my dealer mentioning a few months ago that the display is no longer manufactured and when the current stock is gone, that’s it.

Check with your dealer, but it looks like the flat rate repair is now $1735.

https://sarasotaavionics.com/gns-430-repair

Skip

[TheAv8r]

It was $1850 as of November, 2021. I had the exact same issue with my 430W only they were almost impossible when cold to get it to connect. Plus a screen issue, so it was worth sending it over. It came back brand new, every button was replaced with softkey buttons, they worked on the screen which is now crystal clear.

[DCarlton]

Same as above post.  I sent my non WAAS 430 to Garmin a few months back with multiple issues (memory battery, flip flop button issues, screen wash out) and it came back like new.  Works great.  Much cheaper than a new or used NAV/COM.  

Edited March 5, 2022 by DCarlton

[JohnB]

My 430W had display outages and flip flop issues when I purchased the plane, and i paid for the $1,500 overhaul, and it has worked perfectly now for well over 8 years. They do a great job on the overhaul. Highly worth it. Keeping my fingers crossed that they will keep the overhaul option going for quite some time., but once the overhaul option goes away or it has any other issues, that will be the time i might want to upgrade to a GTN 650.

[laytonl]

I sent my 530W in last year for sticky buttons and fading screen.  It came back looking, and working like a new unit.  I believe the 530 repair was around $2k.  Lee

[MikeOH]

Just another data point: my 430W bricked a few years ago. Pulled it myself and sent to Garmin. $1600 IIRC. Has worked great ever since.

My advice is to bite the bullet....before you don't have the option. I agree with a previous poster that 'exercising' the buttons is a temporary fix. The precious metal plating (that does not oxidize) is long gone.

[DonMuncy]

42 minutes ago, MikeOH said:

Just another data point: my 430W bricked a few years ago. Pulled it myself and sent to Garmin. $1600 IIRC. Has worked great ever since.

 

Did you send it directly to Garmin yourself; rather than going through a dealer. What is you thoughts on that aspect; $, service, freight, turnaround time, etc.

[LANCECASPER]

Garmin only accepts units sent in by dealers

[PT20J]

It is specifically permitted under preventive maintenance regulations to remove and replace a panel mount unit yourself. You might discuss it with a Garmin dealer, but they shouldn’t feel the need need to mark up the repair if you do the removal and installation and perhaps supply the packing.

Skip

[kortopates]

i would expect a markup for labor to save off the entire configuration before it goes back to Garmin and then to re-configure it when it comes back. that’s not considered owner maintenance. the unit will come back with all the original factory defaults as if nothing is connected to it.
Secondly, most assuredly the unit will come back with firmware updates necessitating newer AFMS.

there is actually quite a bit more involved than merely pulling it out and sending it in. But not out of the question though for some capable owners to do - but probably beyond the typical pilot.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[DonMuncy]

25 minutes ago, kortopates said:

there is actually quite a bit more involved than merely pulling it out and sending it in. But not out of the question though for some capable owners to do - but probably beyond the typical pilot.

Just out of curiosity, what else is there?

[MikeOH]

14 hours ago, DonMuncy said:

Did you send it directly to Garmin yourself; rather than going through a dealer. What is you thoughts on that aspect; $, service, freight, turnaround time, etc.

No. I pulled and reinstalled myself, but went through a local Garmin shop. The $1600, at the time, was all-in; reconfigure, tax, and shipping both ways. Waaay cheaper than any other option.

[PT20J]

1 hour ago, kortopates said:

i would expect a markup for labor to save off the entire configuration before it goes back to Garmin and then to re-configure it when it comes back. that’s not considered owner maintenance. the unit will come back with all the original factory defaults as if nothing is connected to it.
Secondly, most assuredly the unit will come back with firmware updates necessitating newer AFMS.

there is actually quite a bit more involved than merely pulling it out and sending it in. But not out of the question though for some capable owners to do - but probably beyond the typical pilot.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Good point, Paul. I forgot about that!

 

[kortopates]

1 hour ago, DonMuncy said:

Just out of curiosity, what else is there?

If your as comfortable navigating your 430 setup screen as you are around a lathe I'd expect you'll be fine.

But this topic has come up at least a half dozen times and I responded like I did because I recall an interesting story from one of the much earlier threads. Like all the past threads on this topic, the OP was encouraged to just pull it and send it in to Garmin. Other pilots were insistent enough that there was nothing to it except to R&R it. Well the pilot took that too seriously and didn't want the shop to do anything but send it in for him. So when it came back from the factory virtually all new he installed it except that nothing connected to it worked  and he didn't understand why till folks here asked him if he reconfigured it - something that wasn't discussed till after it didn't work. I think whatever the pilot saved in refusing the shops services to help whhen he sent it in must have only been a fraction of what it cost him to have someone else figure out how to recofingure with out the benefit of the saved off configuration. So I'd hate to see anyone else repeat the same mistake.  

Edited March 6, 2022 by kortopates

[DCarlton]

I removed and reinstalled mine.  My dealer showed me how to configure the overhauled 430 in about two minutes on the bench.  Told them I would call if I had any trouble.  No need to call.  Worked fine.  My installation is simple though; it's only interfaced to a CDI.  

Edited March 6, 2022 by DCarlton

[PT20J]

Depending on what the unit is interfaced to, there can be several items to configure. Mostly RS-232 and ARINC 429 interfaces that have to be set up properly. But there are other parameters that may have customized also. You can always enter config mode and step through every entry and write them down (assuming you don't already have a copy made during installation). Then you can have the shop put everything back that way it was before returning it to you. 

Skip

[DonMuncy]

I pulled the 430, brought it home and spent a hour pushing each button 200 times or more. When I reinstalled it, it seems to work fine. It may be only temporary, but I will give it some time and see how it goes.