Upgrade cabin lights to LED?

[JoeM]

I am redoing my headliner and wondering if anyone has upgraded the OEM cabin lighting to modern LEDs? Does it require an IA to sign off or 337? Any suggested LEDs that would be legal?

Joe

[N201MKTurbo]

10 minutes ago, JoeM said:

I am redoing my headliner and wondering if anyone has upgraded the OEM cabin lighting to modern LEDs? Does it require an IA to sign off or 337? Any suggested LEDs that would be legal?

Joe

Lets talk technical, not legal, If they are on a dimmer, they won't dim properly unless you change out your dimmer for a PWM dimmer, and that may have other issues. If you are talking about the dome light, it has two brightness settings, that probably won't work right any more.

It amazes me the money people will spend to save the cost of a $5 bulb every 20 years.

What's wrong with the current lights?

I will admit the panel lights on my J were crap, but it wasn't the bulbs as much as the design.

[DCarlton]

42 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

Lets talk technical, not legal, If they are on a dimmer, they won't dim properly unless you change out your dimmer for a PWM dimmer, and that may have other issues. If you are talking about the dome light, it has two brightness settings, that probably won't work right any more.

It amazes me the money people will spend to save the cost of a $5 bulb every 20 years.

What's wrong with the current lights?

I will admit the panel lights on my J were crap, but it wasn't the bulbs as much as the design.

Don't those old dimmers run really hot?  I believe you can see the toll of the heat on the surrounding wiring.  I'd like to refresh and simplify the wiring and do the same thing if anyone has a recommendation.  

[TheAv8r]

50 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

Lets talk technical, not legal, If they are on a dimmer, they won't dim properly unless you change out your dimmer for a PWM dimmer, and that may have other issues. If you are talking about the dome light, it has two brightness settings, that probably won't work right any more.

It amazes me the money people will spend to save the cost of a $5 bulb every 20 years.

What's wrong with the current lights?

I will admit the panel lights on my J were crap, but it wasn't the bulbs as much as the design.

Rich, do you happen to know the P/N for the $5 bulb that went in those old vintage torpedo lights? My newly acquired E model's ones are INOP, but when I started tinkering on them, looks like the previous owner tried to put in LEDs that didn't work so I can't reference the original bulb. Digging through the parts manual hasn't been helpful so far.

[N201MKTurbo]

47 minutes ago, jacenbourne said:

Rich, do you happen to know the P/N for the $5 bulb that went in those old vintage torpedo lights? My newly acquired E model's ones are INOP, but when I started tinkering on them, looks like the previous owner tried to put in LEDs that didn't work so I can't reference the original bulb. Digging through the parts manual hasn't been helpful so far.

I’ll find it for you.

[MisfitSELF]

Maybe you have a Hangar Elf that will install these for you...

Amazon.com: Shuyee Super Bright BA9S LED Car Bulbs, BA9 53 57 1895 64111 LED Lamp for Instrument Cluster Door Courtesy Map License Plate Light on RV Camper Trailer, Pack of 10 : Automotive

[Skates97]

This might be of some help. Alex, @Raptor05121 did this some time back. I did the same thing following his instructions before putting an led strip below the glareshield and Nulite's on my instruments.

 

[Bob E]

Earlier thread on this same topic (scroll down for the part regarding LEDs):

https://mooneyspace.com/topic/39008-changing-overhead-map-light-bulbs/

 

[N201MKTurbo]

I found the part number from the Cessna IPC. The bulb is an MS15570-5. Can't find them anywhere. The mil spec doesn't even list it. I'm sure there is a cross, but I haven't found it yet.

[EricJ]

When sourcing standard-base LEDs from Amazon or wherever to replace incandescents, be sure to check the maximum input voltage and whether they're dimmable.   I've gotten a few different ones and always test them on my bench first, and most of the ones that claim they're dimmable work pretty well, but not all, and if you get them from different sources they may have different illumination curves, i.e., not generate the same amount of light for the same input voltage.   That said, most of the ones I've tested work quite well.    Just make sure it says "dimmable" and test it before using it in an application where it is subject to dimming via voltage adjustment.   Part of the test should be to make sure it doesn't get hot anywhere in the input voltage range.

I've tested a few sets that work fine from 28V down to nearly nothing, and are bright enough at 12V that they could be used easily in a 12V application as well.

[Ragsf15e]

9 hours ago, JoeM said:

I am redoing my headliner and wondering if anyone has upgraded the OEM cabin lighting to modern LEDs? Does it require an IA to sign off or 337? Any suggested LEDs that would be legal?

Joe

The guys gave you some good reading about “upgrading” with interior LED lights, but I’d agree with @N201MKTurbo… proceed with caution.  If you were talking exterior lights I’d be all for it.  They last forever, you can just leave them on all the time and they draw much less power.  Some are expensive, some not.  LED landing lights are pretty awesome now and you can just leave them on for increased visibility.

Interior lighting is more a mixed bag… my airplane has all led exterior and it’s great.  Interior I have some of each.  The old dimmers don’t work, the torpedo lights are a little difficult to modify vs just getting a new bulb, etc.  I will say that I have led rings around my round instruments set into the panel and I like them.  The led light string @Skates97 mentioned is pretty good too.  I don’t think there’s as much bang for the buck on most of the interior lights, and led can cause issues with dimmers.

[TheAv8r]

17 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

I found the part number from the Cessna IPC. The bulb is an MS15570-5. Can't find them anywhere. The mil spec doesn't even list it. I'm sure there is a cross, but I haven't found it yet.

Thanks for the research Rich, appreciate it. My plane has nulites on the instruments and is partial glass so the visibility on the panel is pretty good, this might not be worth messing with then. 

 

[N201MKTurbo]

4 minutes ago, jacenbourne said:

Thanks for the research Rich, appreciate it. My plane has nulites on the instruments and is partial glass so the visibility on the panel is pretty good, this might not be worth messing with then. 

 

I will be out at the airport this afternoon working on the old Cessna. It has those spot lights, I will pull a bulb and see what it has.

[PT20J]

On my M20J there is are fore and aft rocker switches with Bright, Dim and Off positions. The Dim position reconnects the bulbs in series.

[PeteMc]

So now the question is....   Red or Green LED lights?

There's a lot of talk about how Red may be slightly better for retaining your night vision.  But Green is much better for reading instruments, charts, etc. 

And then there's the issue of all of our iPads, an panel displays....  Do we really think we're maintaining our night vision like we did back in the day with the orange radio displays and the panel lights dimmed down to almost nothing and also in a orange/reddish glow.  

[N201MKTurbo]

9 hours ago, jacenbourne said:

Thanks for the research Rich, appreciate it. My plane has nulites on the instruments and is partial glass so the visibility on the panel is pretty good, this might not be worth messing with then. 

 

All three in the 12v Cessna had GE67 bulbs.