Basic Annual Costs

[bucko]

What are people typically paying for a basic annual (Mechanic time)? 

I have a 1965 "E" Model, and am trying to get a handle on it.  I've had one shop tell me 24 hours of mechanic time for a regular annual, one said 20 to 24 hours, and the 3rd tell me 40 hours.   Obviously, if they find something, then that raises the time and cost.  I get that.  But how much time really needed for just a good annual inspection, swing the gear, check torques and tolerances, lubricate everything that needs attention, and change oil and filters.

I've had 3 different shops in the past 3 years.  All did OK to good work, but big cost differences.

Shop A:  Good and usually fast, but changed 3 years ago because they were not fast that time.  Actually had annual take 3 weeks longer than it should have taken because they messed up muffler rework order. So plane sat around for that time when everything else was done.  Very frustrating.  (Price: $)

Shop B:  Long turn around time, and several things needed to be redone.  (Oil leak on the way home.)    (Price $$)

Shop C:  Most $$$, but most work.  Time not quick, but work relatively good. Still had several things that needed to be redone, but they handled it.  (Most expensive, by far.)

 

To be clear: I am willing to pay whatever I need to for a good job, but I'm tired of having more problems after an annual than I did before I took it in.  Read "Mechanics Manifesto" and agree with much that author says.

 

Thanks,

Bucko

 

 

[Oscar Avalle]

My shop quotes me 20 hours at their shop rate. I think that this is realistic as long as there are no squawks. 

[KLRDMD]

At my shop it is $2,380.00 flat rate for the 231. It figures out to 28 hours. My airplane goes in for annual on Wednesday.

[Bob_Belville]

18 minutes ago, bucko said:

What are people typically paying for a basic annual (Mechanic time)? 

I have a 1965 "E" Model, and am trying to get a handle on it.  I've had one shop tell me 24 hours of mechanic time for a regular annual, one said 20 to 24 hours, and the 3rd tell me 40 hours.   Obviously, if they find something, then that raises the time and cost.  I get that.  But how much time really needed for just a good annual inspection, swing the gear, check torques and tolerances, lubricate everything that needs attention, and change oil and filters.

I've had 3 different shops in the past 3 years.  All did OK to good work, but big cost differences.

Shop A:  Good and usually fast, but changed 3 years ago because they were not fast that time.  Actually had annual take 3 weeks longer than it should have taken because they messed up muffler rework order. So plane sat around for that time when everything else was done.  Very frustrating.  (Price: $)

Shop B:  Long turn around time, and several things needed to be redone.  (Oil leak on the way home.)    (Price $$)

Shop C:  Most $$$, but most work.  Time not quick, but work relatively good. Still had several things that needed to be redone, but they handled it.  (Most expensive, by far.)

 

To be clear: I am willing to pay whatever I need to for a good job, but I'm tired of having more problems after an annual than I did before I took it in.  Read "Mechanics Manifesto" and agree with much that author says.

 

Thanks,

Bucko

 

 

AGL Aviation Service is a Mooney Service Center in Western NC. An E model takes 23 hours @ $70. Their flat rate annual charges are available on their web site. They are thorough and very customer oriented.

https://www.aglaviation.com/

[Yetti]

The first time it is more hours.  I spent about 8 hours just on the logs checking out the ADs.  4 with the homework the professional assigned me.  and 4 hours finishing AD things up and doing sign offs.

With a continuous maintenance program.  There should always be something you upgrade.

Last annual my upgrades were:

[kortopates]

For me, a basic annual is one that accomplishes the Mooney 100hr/Annual Checklist: http://www.mooney.com/en/pdf/100_Hour_Annual2007.pdf 

[TTaylor]

Fast, cheap, or good. Pick any two.

1. Should be about 24 hours for basics.  Any repairs extra.

2. It is best to stay with one mechanic so you don't have to pay for re-checking the history each year.  Paperwork time can add up significantly.

3. I prefer to work with mechanics that allow owner assist. Reduces the cost but also allows the owner to see all the details of the plane.  No one cares about your plane like you do.   

[N6758N]

22-24 hours is a realistic number, keep in mind if its the shops first time seeing the airplane they will need a little more time to dig into the logs, check AD history, etc..

[zaitcev]

I just finished taking 35 inspection covers off my E yesterday. It was my first time and it took me 10 hours. Had to cut slots in a couple of screws etc. Laying on my back does a number of my sinuses, too. Obviously a professional is going to waste less time, but it's a 300 dollars right there, with prevalent labour rate.

Edited April 24, 2017 by zaitcev

[Jim Peace]

If ya gotta ask...............................

[aviatoreb]

Another philosophy from "you should always stay with one mechanic because over time its cheaper as they are familiar with your plane", is to switch between maybe two reputable shops, so that fresh eyes me see things that the other shop missed - no matter how good they are.  After having stuck with the wrong one-shop for several years and then they missed SEVERAL big things, one of which was very expensive, I will be using philosophy two for now on.  I will be switching and forth between the two best regional msc's, airmods and weber.

[Yetti]

It sounds like your question is how can I pay my hard earned cash to the right person to get the job done right the first time.  For me that ends up with me doing the work.  For IA inspection time it took the professional 4 hours to do the "inspection"  The rest of it was on me.  2 annuals so far and only 1 inspection cover was found not all the way tightened.

Edited April 24, 2017 by Yetti

[StevenL757]

Hey Bucko,

Here's a summary of what my IA does for his $2200 flat fee.  This is a fully-user-assisted annual.  The time spent is really open-ended...we take as long as we need, as this piece is a flat cost, so we don't hurry through anything.  Typically, we finish this work in ~3 days.  I couldn't be happier.

Perform Annual Inspection & Service: Owner will open and close aircraft, disassemble systems as requested, and reassemble under my direct supervision, grease gear and clean aircraft inside & out.  Amount can be adjusted based on expertise and time savings.

* Perform compression test

* Check magneto to engine timing

* Inspect oil filter

* Inspect air filter

* Inspect & clean fuel injectors

* Inspect, clean, rotate spark plugs as needed

* Check flight controls for correct rigging

* Check landing gear retraction, extension, emergency extension & preload

* Weigh Fire Extinguisher

* Inspect Artex ME406 ELT per FAR 91.207d

* Inspect fuel system

* Inspect propeller blades - dressing included

* Inspect muffler & exhaust system

* Inspect both batteries + capacity check (if needed)

Additionally, I usually perform other items such as changing induction gaskets, fuel injector O-rings, fuel cap O-rings which saves additional cost.  Let me know if this is helpful as a point of reference.

Regards, Steve

[Guest]

What about review and comply with AD's, S/B's, S/I's, review STC ICA's,  fill out log books, inspect airframe?

Clarence

[Yooper Rocketman]

I've done a lot of Mooney annuals, mine (F model and Rocket) and assisted with my A&P's E model and we have always used the 100 hour inspection in the manual.  It is several pages long!  You would be hard pressed to get an E model "inspection only" ( no squawks) done in 20 hours and actually have done a good job.  My Rocket annuals typically run 30-40 hours with some (or a LOT of squawks). A few have run closer to 50 hours.  I pride myself in the amount of squawks I can actually FIND.  This is NOT a time to be looking at how "few hours" you can get through an annual.  If price is a factor, put some owner sweat into it!

Tom

[Yetti]

Ya I would say 40 hours would be the best number.  Realizing a couple of the jobs are two people jobs.    For both annuals, I have offered my IA more money than his quote. One time he took it next time he did not.  They are the ones keeping you safe and their ticket is on the line.

[StevenL757]

3 hours ago, M20Doc said:

What about review and comply with AD's, S/B's, S/I's, review STC ICA's,  fill out log books, inspect airframe?

Clarence

Included, not explicitly-stated until the final logbook entries are made.

[luv737s]

Go to the Dugosh website and they give a pretty good breakdown for Mooney annuals.

http://www.dugosh.com/aircraft-maintenance-repairs

 

MD

[SantosDumont]

My IA charges a flat rate of $1750 for retract annual.  Also charged me 8 hours labor to replace my shock biscuits, and now I actually have a little spring when I touch down.  I also went all LED navs/strobes/beacons so this year's annual was a bit expensive at around $7k for all the parts and labor.

I did owner assisted and it took me probably 2 days to get all the inspection panels off.  I also had to replace the switch for the speedbrakes so that took a couple days to figure out how to disassemble my panel and get to the switch / replace it.

In all my annual took 2 weeks to complete this year.

[MooneyNate]

I just got my C back from annual which is similar to your E and he charged me 22 at $75. I did the owner assisted and it took forever for me to get all those off too. He gave me about 6 hours of the bill for the owner assisted. My plane was local when I bought it and it had been through three reputable shops but each had their own opinion on squawks. I added a 406 ELT, repaired an altimeter and replaced a VOR/ILS and total bill ran $5k. 

I'll probably take it to the same shop next year but I wish I had more options in the midwest for shops that know how to work on manual gear.

[Hank]

16 minutes ago, MooneyNate said:

. . . but I wish I had more options in the midwest for shops that know how to work on manual gear.

Put your location  or at least your state, in your avatar and you may get some recommendations. "Midwest" covers a lot of ground, Ohio to Minnesota / Wisconsin down through Nebraska and Oklahoma. 

[MooneyNate]

3 minutes ago, Hank said:

Put your location  or at least your state, in your avatar and you may get some recommendations. "Midwest" covers a lot of ground, Ohio to Minnesota / Wisconsin down through Nebraska and Oklahoma. 

Iowa, you bet. Thanks for the recommendation.