Piotrekpdx Posted January 23, 2015 Report Posted January 23, 2015 Hello, I'm new to this forum, but not entirely new to aviation. I started flying about 10 years ago, amassed about 500 hours, most in my old Piper Cherokee and recently acquired an instrument rating. I moved to Atlanta from Oregon a few years ago and decided to ditch the good old Cherokee and now I'm finally ready to upgrade to a Mooney. I have read everything that I have been able to find about the M20C,E,F and J and based on the type of flying I like to do, which is mostly 2-3 hour cross country flights on weekends to places like Savannah and Charleston, as well as financial constraints, I have ranked them as following: E, F, C, J with E being the most desirable. Obviously the J would top my chart, but I'd have to sacrifice a lot in terms of avionics, engine time, paint and interior quality before it would be competitive with the other three, money wise. I often fly alone, but my wife does enjoy to ride along from time to time and whenever I have friends in town, I like to take them flying as well, so the backseat will get some moderate use. So here come my questions. Is the backseat in an E and C really as uncomfortable as most reviews claim? Would it make more sense to go with the F for added passenger comfort? It won't get a ton of useage, but I don't want to put off my non aviation friends from flying by treating them to an uncomfortable flying experience. Is there a marked difference in speed between an E and an F? Coming from a Cherokee, both seem fast to me. Finally, since the last time I flew in a Mooney was before I had my pilot license, I was wondering if there were any Mooney C,E,F or even J owners in the Atlanta area, who'd be willing to take me for a short hamburger hop somewhere. I'd be happy to share the fuel costs, and lunch is on me. Thanks, Piotr Quote
Openwheeler3 Posted January 23, 2015 Report Posted January 23, 2015 Piotr, Welcome to the forum. I took 3 other people in my C model from Alabama to New Orleans a couple of months ago. The airplane performed great, but that would probably be the high time limit (1.5 hrs) for four full seats before everyone gets uncomfortable. Our group was on the smaller size with respect to height/weight. I had to sit quite close to the panel to give enough room to the person behind me. If most of your flying is just you and your wife as you stated, the C and E are great and the longer bodied aircraft are not necessary, but still nice. On another note, I'm currently based in Enterprise, Al and my C is listed for sale in the sales forum on this site. -Derek 1 Quote
Culver LFA Posted January 23, 2015 Report Posted January 23, 2015 Hello, I'm new to this forum, but not entirely new to aviation. I started flying about 10 years ago, amassed about 500 hours, most in my old Piper Cherokee and recently acquired an instrument rating. I moved to Atlanta from Oregon a few years ago and decided to ditch the good old Cherokee and now I'm finally ready to upgrade to a Mooney. I have read everything that I have been able to find about the M20C,E,F and J and based on the type of flying I like to do, which is mostly 2-3 hour cross country flights on weekends to places like Savannah and Charleston, as well as financial constraints, I have ranked them as following: E, F, C, J with E being the most desirable. Obviously the J would top my chart, but I'd have to sacrifice a lot in terms of avionics, engine time, paint and interior quality before it would be competitive with the other three, money wise. I often fly alone, but my wife does enjoy to ride along from time to time and whenever I have friends in town, I like to take them flying as well, so the backseat will get some moderate use. So here come my questions. Is the backseat in an E and C really as uncomfortable as most reviews claim? Would it make more sense to go with the F for added passenger comfort? It won't get a ton of useage, but I don't want to put off my non aviation friends from flying by treating them to an uncomfortable flying experience. Is there a marked difference in speed between an E and an F? Coming from a Cherokee, both seem fast to me. Finally, since the last time I flew in a Mooney was before I had my pilot license, I was wondering if there were any Mooney C,E,F or even J owners in the Atlanta area, who'd be willing to take me for a short hamburger hop somewhere. I'd be happy to share the fuel costs, and lunch is on me. Thanks, Piotr Hi Piotr, I'm in the Atlanta area, should be flying this Saturday AM from 8GA9 down to PeachState Aerodrome (GA2) for an EAA 468 meeting. Not sure if you're interested, or maybe we could meet another time, I have a '67 F. It would be approximately 9:00AM to 1:00 PM. If your time is tight, you could meet me down at Peachstate around noon and we'll go for a quick flight from there? Message me your phone number if interested. Best regards, Joe 1 Quote
Culver LFA Posted January 23, 2015 Report Posted January 23, 2015 What airport are you flying out of, Paulding or Brown? If the weather is decent I may be able to come up your way for a quick stop. Quote
Marauder Posted January 23, 2015 Report Posted January 23, 2015 The speed difference between an F and an E is probably 5 or so knots. Quote
Piotrekpdx Posted January 23, 2015 Author Report Posted January 23, 2015 What airport are you flying out of, Paulding or Brown? If the weather is decent I may be able to come up your way for a quick stop. Hi Joe, that sounds great! Paulding is closest to my house. I'll PM you my number. 1 Quote
Culver LFA Posted January 23, 2015 Report Posted January 23, 2015 The speed difference between an F and an E is probably 5 or so knots. The F being faster, right ;-) Quote
Marauder Posted January 23, 2015 Report Posted January 23, 2015 The F being faster, right ;-) I wish... 1 Quote
pirate Posted January 23, 2015 Report Posted January 23, 2015 I recently flew my short body from Tampa back to Dekalb IL, my father and my self up front and my wife in the back all were comfortable. Locally If I fill all four seats for 2-3 hours no complaints from any one. Quote
Culver LFA Posted January 23, 2015 Report Posted January 23, 2015 Here's an example if what the F will hold, there was still a bag or two in the plane when this photo was taken. This was returning from our first trip in the Mooney, Atlanta (KFFC) to Plum Island (2B2). 2 Quote
rbridges Posted January 23, 2015 Report Posted January 23, 2015 My c can hold people in the back but I would highly recommend an f if you're wanting to fly more than one other passenger for any length of time. Btw I'm in central ga if you're ever in the neighborhood. 1 Quote
1964-M20E Posted January 23, 2015 Report Posted January 23, 2015 When I had my E model I had 3 people in it a number of times and some flights were 3.45 to 4 hours. Not as nice as my current F but doable. The other two were shorter than me I’m 6’2”so a short body is a 3 place plane for me. Anything a C to a J would work. It is nice have the extra room in the F but not necessary I fly solo most of the time. Quote
DrBill Posted January 23, 2015 Report Posted January 23, 2015 I have an E and I love it.. I mostly fly with one other passenger but went to OSH with a guy and his 12 yr old son. He was OK in the back with all the gear (they camped) stuffed in there for the 6.5 hrs each way. I flew to Lynchburg VA once(abt 1 hr) with an adult in the back (sits sideways, with feet or butt behind pilot). If I had a family that flew I would have looked only for an F but in my situation I looked for E or F within 100 miles and it took about 6 months to find the E I bought. I was very specific on what I wanted in avionics so it took a while to find (430W+autopilot). We got 20mpg going to/from OSH.. A great trip. Bill Quote
DrBill Posted January 23, 2015 Report Posted January 23, 2015 Here's an example if what the F will hold, there was still a bag or two in the plane when this photo was taken. This was returning from our first trip in the Mooney, Atlanta (KFFC) to Plum Island (2B2). I went to Plum Island for the first time in 1971 (April 1st). I took 2 other guys from school in a Cessna 172. We walked over the dune to the beach and went skinny dipping in the ocean.. I think the water temp was 43 deg. What college kids will do for fun. Quote
DrBill Posted January 23, 2015 Report Posted January 23, 2015 I recently flew my short body from Tampa back to Dekalb IL, my father and my self up front and my wife in the back all were comfortable. Locally If I fill all four seats for 2-3 hours no complaints from any one. If anyone complained he'd tell them to get out now and "Walk the plank!) 1 Quote
22 others Posted January 23, 2015 Report Posted January 23, 2015 I tend to feel that the comfort of F back seats is overstated. ...And the tightness of C backseats is overstated too. I've sat in both. You'll find that others felt similarly that they preferred an E because of its higher speed than the C or F, so the asking prices are higher. In the end, select the best airframe, engine, and avionics package you can find whether C,E, or F (or even J is your budget stretches an extra $20k for 20k.) 2 Quote
jkhirsch Posted January 27, 2015 Report Posted January 27, 2015 I'll still chime in here and say that I was leaning towards an E because of what was available and the added performance...and then Jimmy Garrison stopped through Lexington and I sat in an E. That made my decision clear. Quote
chrisk Posted January 27, 2015 Report Posted January 27, 2015 For me, range was important. F's (compared to E or C) come with larger fuel tanks, a higher gross, and higher yellow arc. My cost adjusted preference in order was F, K, J, E, C, D, and finally G. I know a few folks here have a G, but it would have had to be a super deal for me to consider one. It's the slowest of all the Mooneys. Anyway, I ended up with a K and I love it. Be sure to consider fuel tank maintenance, auto pilot, and avionics into the decision making process. 1 Quote
rbridges Posted January 27, 2015 Report Posted January 27, 2015 For me, range was important. F's (compared to E or C) come with larger fuel tanks, a higher gross, and higher yellow arc. My cost adjusted preference in order was F, K, J, E, C, D, and finally G. I know a few folks here have a G, but it would have had to be a super deal for me to consider one. It's the slowest of all the Mooneys. Anyway, I ended up with a K and I love it. Be sure to consider fuel tank maintenance, auto pilot, and avionics into the decision making process. that's interesting. I'm surprised a K model would be included in your list. I wouldn't consider it in the same group as someone that would get a C. Quote
garytex Posted January 28, 2015 Report Posted January 28, 2015 For me the higher gross weight and room makes an F win over an E. The angle valve 200 hp injected engine in the E and F is maybe the most efficient engine in aviation. So you run 10 to 15 miles an hour faster burning one to 1 1/2 gallons an hour less than the C. It adds up if you fly a lot as I do. That extra power allows me to get in and out of my 1600 foot strip at the ranch, and carry my son and enough firearms and ammunition to go hunting 800 miles away in Colorado with no stops on 54 gal tanks. I really like my F Gary 1 Quote
Bob_Belville Posted January 28, 2015 Report Posted January 28, 2015 As my signature might suggest, I favor the E model. The back seat is about as comfortable as an airline seat. It the past year or so I've taken 4 to the beach for a weekend. ~2 hours. More often I'll fill it up for an "airplane ride" ~1 hour. But most of the time it's Nancy and me and luggage for a week or more for which an E is the fastest vintage model with the best short field performance. However these 3 models are not all that different and I would be open minded until I found a specific plane with engine condition, panel upgrades, maintenance history, and over all appearance that fit my standards and budget. Quote
Jsavage3 Posted January 28, 2015 Report Posted January 28, 2015 The older J models are selling pretty reasonable these days and I can't say enough about how comfortable my back-seat passengers are....they seem happier in the back actually. 157 KTAS at 9.5 GPH with 64 gallons available equals a nice & cost effective cross country machine at 19 sm per gallon. Yes, I love my J. Quote
Bob_Belville Posted January 28, 2015 Report Posted January 28, 2015 The older J models are selling pretty reasonable these days and I can't say enough about how comfortable my back-seat passengers are....they seem happier in the back actually. 157 KTAS at 9.5 GPH with 64 gallons available equals a nice & cost effective cross country machine at 19 sm per gallon. Yes, I love my J. Mooney at PMH Jan 2015_ 004.jpg That's almost exactly what my E does. And with your J you get more room, higher gross, and greater range. But I suspect an E is going to cost quite a bit less than a J, everything being equal. 1 Quote
Piotrekpdx Posted January 28, 2015 Author Report Posted January 28, 2015 Hi had the pleasure to fly in an F with Culver LFA last weekend and really enjoyed the ride. I sat in the back seat while still on the ground and it seemed very roomy and comfortable. I'm definitely leaning towards buying an F. I'm trying to find one with a 430W and an autopilot in the 40-50k range. If anybody knows of one for sale, especially in the southeast, please let me know. Thanks! 1 Quote
TWinter Posted January 28, 2015 Report Posted January 28, 2015 The proper way to pack an E model.. Everything, but the kitchen sink. Headed to Oshkosh last year. It was just the two of us, but well packed. This is the back seat and hat rack. 1 Quote
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