Another ADSB box announced Oct 28.

[Mooneymite]

Here's another one from Garmin, starts at about $4000:

 

http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20141028005398/en/Garmin%C2%AE-Introduces-Cost-Effective-ADS-B-Solution-General-Aviation

 

..............................................................

 

Industry-First Dual-Link Solution for Certified Aircraft

The GDL 84 provides a rule-compliant ADS-B Out solution for aircraft operating below 18,000 feet in the U.S., while offering access to traffic information and subscription-free weather. Innovative dual-link capability allows the GDL 84 to receive on both the 978 MHz UAT and 1090 MHz frequency bands to provide the most comprehensive display of traffic information available in the industry.

All-In-One System

Installation is quick and easy because the GDL 84 is a straightforward solution that wirelessly transmits weather and traffic information via Flight Stream 110/210 to a mobile device, instead of an installed multifunction display in the cockpit. Additionally, for aircraft owners who do not already have a compatible WAAS GPS position source on board their aircraft, the GDL 84 offers a built-in WAAS GPS receiver. The GDL 84 is an all-inclusive solution, which meets regulatory requirements and gives pilots the added benefits without the cost associated with a large installation.

 

 

....The GDL 84 is expected to receive the FAA’s Approved Model List Supplemental Type Certification (AML STC) in Q1 2015.

[FloridaMan]

What a bargain...

[ArtVandelay]

It looks to me the main difference between 88 & 84 is the 84 doesn't interface with existing stack (650, 430, etc), if I read it correctly

[Robert C.]

What we really need is a WAAS GPS version that does ADS-B out on 1090 so you can use it when flying in Canada. This UAT stuff is all good and well but just like with electricity and measurement systems we're the only country in the world using it. Just a tad myopic if you ask me. 

 

/rant off

[Danb]

Robert agreed..I flew across Lake Erie last week and just as you enter Canada all you see are windmills..and now there are lots of Solar Farms dotting the landscape..I think air and sun is free..oh well need to keep the oil manufacturing cos. happy..who needs that pipeline anyway

 

//rant on......why not

[Marauder]

It looks to me the main difference between 88 & 84 is the 84 doesn't interface with existing stack (650, 430, etc), if I read it correctly

It will, it was in the fine print:

"Customers may also upgrade the GDL 84 to display traffic and weather on some Garmin avionics, including the GTN 650/750/GNS 430W/530W, G500/G600, and more, for $1,995."

Doesn't that price make it more expensive than the 88?

[Bill Dunn]

don't forget you still have to buy the flightstream as well....

[KSMooniac]

This one is a real head-scratcher for me.  It is the opposite of the 88, but not noticeably cheaper.  I'm already -OUT compliant, and I'd really like to have the Flight Stream 210 + a GDL 39R, but I'm not allowed to install the 39R!!! Dammit.  I don't want to pay for all these add-on boxes with WAAS and ADS-B OUT capability... I just want a clean, integrated solution for ADS-B IN with displays on my tablet and possibly GNS boxes.

[PTK]

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but the way I read this it will cost 4500$ to display on Garmin Pilot or 6500$ on GTN. (These include the 210.)

The only thing saved over the 88 is installation.

Hardly a bargain but it does save time and spares the plane from an install.

I have in my inbox a quote for GDL88 at 4500$ installed. 5500$ roughly if I include a 210. So for 1000$ more I can save install hassle and display on GTN and G pilot if I wanted to.

Would I do it. I'd need a very good reason not to.

[KSMooniac]

That is what is confusing, PTK.  I cannot see any reason to install the GDL 84 + Flight Stream + mystery box to connect it to a panel mount for $6500 when $5500 presumably gets you the GDL 88 + Flight Stream for the same functionality.  In your case with a 750 (right?), you have a great screen to display the ADS-B Data.  In my case with a 530W, I have a LOUSY screen for that data, hence my desire to just view it on the tablet.  I see no value in this product unless one doesn't have a WAAS source installed and/or ADS-B OUT already.

 

I wish the GDL 39R was legal to install today in certified planes.  Instead I'm going to quasi-permanently install a GDL 39 3D for the same functionality, and likely add a Flight Stream 210 later.

[PTK]

Yes, I hear you Scott!

This looks like it's targeting VFR folks without a WAAS GPS but it does leave a window open for the rest as well. A costly window at that!

The GNS display is not that lousy!

[KSMooniac]

Oh, it's lousy.  It is perfectly sufficient for what *I* use it for, though, and doesn't make me want to shell out big bucks for upgrades that really only yield a prettier screen and different interface.  It has 8 colors (I think) and pretty low resolution.  Sufficient to play Ms. Pacman, but not really display detailed weather products.  I just use it for flight plan waypoints, airports, and traffic from my 330ES transponder.  And I'm OK with that.

 

I want to see charts, plates, and Wx on my tablet, not on the panel.  I'd be happy with the GDL-39R in my plane for <1 AMU as that is all I need or want.

[PTK]

What's preventing you from getting a 39R as a portable system Scott?

It will display on the iPad.

[KSMooniac]

The 39R is their "remote mount" version of the 39.  You can hard-wire it into the ship's power, use remote & permanently installed antennas, and I believe install some remote switches if needed for syncing or whatever.  Only available to the experimental world.  The regular 39 and 39 3D are supposed to use a battery or 12V plug, and not be "permanently" installed.  Really silly rules.

 

I also want to install a G3 or G3X PFD, but I cannot do that either.      Somehow the clouds that I fly through must be different than the ones the RV's and Lancairs fly through, right???

[PTK]

A...ha... I see now! It has to be hard wired. There's no way to use it as a portable.

Not sure who makes these rules. Probably FAA mostly but I'm sure Garmin has a lot of input.

Silly rules for sure.

[KSMooniac]

It is most certainly the FAA.  The rules are so far out of date it is maddening, both for engineers like me on the development side of the fence, and consumers like us wanting to update for safety/convenience/efficiency reasons.  The Part 23 re-write needs to happen 10 years ago.

[M016576]

It is most certainly the FAA. The rules are so far out of date it is maddening, both for engineers like me on the development side of the fence, and consumers like us wanting to update for safety/convenience/efficiency reasons. The Part 23 re-write needs to happen 10 years ago.

Ok... Scott: here's my solution... Call it legal or not, but this is what I've done:

A). I bought the GDL-39 (regular 39) about a year and a half ago on eBay for 500 bucks

I bought the "bare wires kit" for the gdl-39 (cost: ~$65.00) and had that installed through the cigarette lighter circuit breaker

C) I'm in the process of having a remote UAT antenna (RAMI AV-74.. It's TSO'ed and costs about $100.00) installed with a connector that works with the gdl-39. Total cost~ $145.00.

D). I haven't done this part yet, but, I'm going to zip tie the tray under the dash. It should still get a GPS signal there, and once attached to the external UAT antenna receive an even stronger ADSB signal than with just the stock antenna. It will also be out of site, and still able to transmit data via Bluetooth.

So, for about $200.00 you can set up a "dock" for your gdl-39.

I know some of you are going to say this isn't legal, but everyone I've talked to says otherwise- the premise being that It's just the same as wiring in a dock for a portable GPS. So long as you pick a tso'd antenna, which isn't a problem, since most transponder/dme blade antennas are UAT signal compatable, you're good to go.

Does that fit the bill for you Scott? Hope that helps...

[KSMooniac]

You're reading my mind.    I just bought a used 39 3D and am planning to softly mount it on the top of my hat rack area with a wired connection to my Battery MINDer cable that is already in the baggage compartment for now.  I have a 12V socket that plugs into that harness already, so I'll use it for now and use the remote antennas with suction cup mounts on the rear window.  I'll hide the wires in the plastic interior panels as much as possible.

 

Eventually I want to put an ADS-B antenna on the belly and a cleaner installation, but that will probably wait until my next big round of changes in 2015.

[M016576]

Sounds good Scott-

I'll post some pictures of the antenna and my setup once the antenna is mounted.

The garmin bare-wires kits have a fuse located inline with the hot lead. I opted to connect them to the 10a Cig lighter CB anyway... Just in case.

My gdl-39 is actually bare wire connected to my Aera560 bare wire kit- so I get the ADSB on the aera560, but also on my iPhone via Bluetooth. I have the serial in on the gdl39 bare wire kit (orange&white wire) connected to my "aviation out" rs232 output on the G430W, so my direct to and flight plans auto populate on my 560. Some of the Vans World guys have talked about adding a switch between the 430W and the Gdl39, so you can disconnect it from the aviation stream- I'm going to play with it this way for a while and maybe I'll see if I can get that done later (although that might be pushing the limits of legality).

[cliffy]

As far as Canada goes-

After reading all their government agency has to say, they are ADS-B in the Hudson Bay area only above FL290

AND     right now,  

they have no plans to expand it to other airspace. 

If anyone can find anything else from their government, I'm listening. 

[Piloto]

As far as Canada goes-

After reading all their government agency has to say, they are ADS-B in the Hudson Bay area only above FL290

AND     right now,  

they have no plans to expand it to other airspace. 

If anyone can find anything else from their government, I'm listening. 

 

Canada government is smarter. Instead of spending 1 billion dollar on ADS-B/UAT they gives pilots a tax deduction for XM subscription. With the money saved on ADS-B they can buy a bunch of snow plows to keep the airports open.

 

'O Canada'

 

José

[ryoder]

Way too expensive.

[Bill Dunn]

KS what app do you use in flight?

 

just a heads up guys most of the ADS-B boxes come in different variations like "in" only, "out" only, and "in/out". so if you have a WAAS 430 and GTX330ES you could get a GDL88 that is "in" only and with that and the flightstream I believe you could display traffic and weather on the 430 as well as the iPad.

 

although I just looked on Garmins site and I don't see the "in" only version of the GDL88 I could double check with our install manager to be sure. I know that freeflights box has all 3 versions (it makes it a PITA to quote haha!).

[drapo]

As far as Canada goes-

After reading all their government agency has to say, they are ADS-B in the Hudson Bay area only above FL290

AND     right now,  

they have no plans to expand it to other airspace. 

If anyone can find anything else from their government, I'm listening. 

 

Just correcting your post, NavCanada is not a government agency, but a not for profit organization, a private company, that manages the air traffic control system on the north side of your border, .

 

As far as our ADS-B system goes, it is not meant to replace our radar system, which has been overhauled and expanded in the last few decades, but to give controllers coverage for ADS-B equiped traffic, low and high level, operating in the northern airspace. It doesn't have the WX and traffic capabilities of the American system, but it's goal was mainly to offer better service to Oceanic trafic and reduce separation minima in that airspace, increasing the effeciency of the system.

 

Hope that helps!

[M016576]

KS what app do you use in flight?

just a heads up guys most of the ADS-B boxes come in different variations like "in" only, "out" only, and "in/out". so if you have a WAAS 430 and GTX330ES you could get a GDL88 that is "in" only and with that and the flightstream I believe you could display traffic and weather on the 430 as well as the iPad.

although I just looked on Garmins site and I don't see the "in" only version of the GDL88 I could double check with our install manager to be sure. I know that freeflights box has all 3 versions (it makes it a PITA to quote haha!).

From a strictly price point perspective, Bill: if we have a 430W and say a KT76A already, and we want to be ADSB compliant and don't care about displaying anything (because we have a GDl39 already), what's the cheapest route?

KT-74?