Compare two Mooneys

[teethdoc]

M20c TT:~3000h Manual Gear.

M20e TT:~5000h Electric Gear.

Both planes are similarly equiped with avionics except the m20e has an Stec 30 with Alt. hold. It's also priced about $10k more. The m20c has about 600more hours since smoh, but both are less than 1000h smoh.

Would you rather have less TT no autopilot, and $10k less price?

[stevesm20b]

The "E" with the Stec30 would be a better buy for 10k more. It has the IO360 with 20 more hp and to have an Stec30 installed in the "C" would cost about 14K.

[Parker_Woodruff]

I would much rather have the M20E, assuming the airframe was found in good, airworthy condition on a pre-buy per my shop of choice.

[Hank]

SMOH tells how much it has been used. Equally important is how much have each been used recently?

300 SMOH ten years ago is sub-optimal, IMHO.

[rbridges]

The "E" with the Stec30 would be a better buy for 10k more. It has the IO360 with 20 more hp and to have an Stec30 installed in the "C" would cost about 14K.

that's true about the AP. They're not cheap. It would be awesome if it has a 430 and linked with GPSS.

also, I would like the lower SMOH than TTAF.

[1964-M20E]

Auto pilot would rule the day if most everything else is the same. Is the E the one in AL?

[teethdoc]

Auto pilot would rule the day if most everything else is the same. Is the E the one in AL?

Yep. I'm just slow to make decisions

[jwilkins]

Everything else being equal, I would favor for the E with the S-Tec.

However, your intended use may influence the decision.

If you intend to do mostly local VMC flights the autopilot may not be as important. Some owners will tell you that the C model with the manual gear and 180HP may require less maintenance; the cylinders tend to last longer and the manual gear has fewer parts.

I loved my 62 C with manual gear. It was fast enough for 300 - 400 mi trips and an absolute joy for local trips. After a couple years I put a G430 and an S-Tec 30 in for the IFR trips. I think the autopilot is a huge benefit for single pilot IFR so you can relax a bit once in a while.

When I bought the 67 F I was flying 90% on business, and the additional fuel and backseat room was a plus. The F was a little faster but the range and radios were a stepup. The F also had an S-Tec.

When I moved to AZ and began to deal with 8000 ft density altitudes I bought a K.

If I were back at low altitudes and buying a plane for mostly personal use I would look for a C, E, or F. Manual gear is, to me, a plus. I really like the S-Tec autopilots. The MAIN decision is condition, not price. You need a good pre-purchase inspection by a Mooney experienced and recommended shop.

[fantom]

Yep. I'm just slow to make decisions

Don't be too slow....good planes can go quickly. For the record, I like the E.

[AndyFromCB]

The S-TEC 30 is a wonderful autopilot, especially when combined with GNS430 and GPSS. The cost to install one of these is around 15K these days without autotrim, closer to 20K with autotrim. In my experience of owning my Arrow for 2 years, it was bullproof. I wish I could say the same thing about my KFC150 ;-) When I sold my Arrow, I too had to explain to the seller why my Arrow was priced over and above the rest. Then I took him for a demo flight and had the autopilot fly a full aproach hands free other than me flying the glideslope and he was sold.

I would never underestimate the utlity of good autopilot. Best things since sliced bread but maybe it's because I use my airplane to go places so majority of the time my hand flying is limited to about 60 seconds per flight when my autopilot works.

Andy

[rbridges]

The S-TEC 30 is a wonderful autopilot, especially when combined with GNS430 and GPSS. The cost to install one of these is around 15K these days without autotrim, closer to 20K with autotrim. In my experience of owning my Arrow for 2 years, it was bullproof. I wish I could say the same thing about my KFC150 ;-) When I sold my Arrow, I too had to explain to the seller why my Arrow was priced over and above the rest. Then I took him for a demo flight and had the autopilot fly a full aproach hands free other than me flying the glideslope and he was sold.

I would never underestimate the utlity of good autopilot. Best things since sliced bread but maybe it's because I use my airplane to go places so majority of the time my hand flying is limited to about 60 seconds per flight when my autopilot works.

Andy

I'm installing a GPSS this weekend. I am very excited about it.

[Marauder]

M20c TT:~3000h Manual Gear.

M20e TT:~5000h Electric Gear.

Both planes are similarly equiped with avionics except the m20e has an Stec 30 with Alt. hold. It's also priced about $10k more. The m20c has about 600more hours since smoh, but both are less than 1000h smoh.

Would you rather have less TT no autopilot, and $10k less price?

I would lean towards the E as well (provided the airframes are similar in condition). Autopilots are expensive to retrofit.

[gregwatts]

I would go for the E model........and negotiate!

[triple8s]

I know what you should do, buy BOTH! Then when you have one in for annual you'll have the other to fly and you'll never miss a pretty day of flying. Ya know I am joking but my plane has been in for annual AND an avionics upgrade and I have been looking long and hard at a cheap well worn C model with minimal radios, thinking how much fun it would be to have a second Mooney.

[TTaylor]

A big part of the decision is mission and location.

The C is great at lower altitudes and shorter flights (less than 500 miles). I live in the inter-mountain west and loved my C but it was a little wimpy getting over a few passes in Colorado and Nevada. An E is nice if you are going to spend a lot of time over 10,000 feet or need to get to over 13 to 15K to clear a pass. The extra speed for longer flights is nice with the E but on shorter flights the total time (getting to the airport, pulling the plane out, etc., etc.) is not very different with the C or E. If you are flying now an then for fun the AP is nice but not necessary. For many hours per years or as an IFR platform you will want one.

Define your mission and how much you want to spend. After the money is paid you will not miss it but you might be wishing for the upgrades if you don't get them.

[jetdriven]

Condition is everything.

[jnisley]

The S-Tec 30 w alt hold, GNS430W, GPSS, it's a wonderful combo, flying holds, procedure turns and approaches with this setup is a pleasure.

[Seth]

I'd lean toward the E vs the C. If there were no Autopilot already instealled, than it would be a matter of the extra 20 ponies or not. However, with the 200 HP fuel injected engine and Autopilot, I'd have to side with the E for the price delta.

As mentioend earlier however - condition means a lot. If they E is in bad shape airframe wise and would be expensive to repair, pass.

If they are indeed in similar condition and time on the airframe and few hundred on the engine are the only other difference, go with the E.

An autopilot makes a HUGE difference. I went from my F that did not have one to a Missile that did. I rented an Arrow that did not, and though I do love hand flying, the workload is completely different.

-Seth

[jlunseth]

The S-TEC 30 is a wonderful autopilot, especially when combined with GNS430 and GPSS. The cost to install one of these is around 15K these days without autotrim, closer to 20K with autotrim. In my experience of owning my Arrow for 2 years, it was bullproof. I wish I could say the same thing about my KFC150 ;-) When I sold my Arrow, I too had to explain to the seller why my Arrow was priced over and above the rest. Then I took him for a demo flight and had the autopilot fly a full aproach hands free other than me flying the glideslope and he was sold.

I would never underestimate the utlity of good autopilot. Best things since sliced bread but maybe it's because I use my airplane to go places so majority of the time my hand flying is limited to about 60 seconds per flight when my autopilot works.

Andy

So the STEC does not couple to the glideslope? You have to hand fly the GS? My KFC200 will couple and I believe the 150 does also. I would miss that. I could probably let the 200 put the plane down on the tarmac if I wanted to, it is that accurate.

[Marauder]

So the STEC does not couple to the glideslope? You have to hand fly the GS? My KFC200 will couple and I believe the 150 does also. I would miss that. I could probably let the 200 put the plane down on the tarmac if I wanted to, it is that accurate.

I believe the 30 has an altitude hold only feature. Moving up to the higher versions I think gets you the GS coupling interface.

[Ned Gravel]

I would go for the E model as well. Except for the electric gear, it appears to be the better deal.

[DaV8or]

I believe the 30 has an altitude hold only feature. Moving up to the higher versions I think gets you the GS coupling interface.

This is correct. The 30 will not fly the glideslope. You need to go up to the STEC- 55 or 60 to get that.