Steering horn rod end, earlier design better?

[Hradec]

I'm trying to resurrect my 64 m20e serial #311. Hasn't flown in 4 yrs. Lots of play in the nose wheel, logs show a fairly recent  overhauled lasar steering horn installed. That part is ok. However it was parked outside tail into the wind with no rudder lock. The rod ends took a beating.

Examining the steering horn assy, looks like most of the play was in the upper center rod end. Looked pretty cheesy, hollow rod end with a hole drilled in it. Appears that that hole double or tripples the price of that rod end. IPC 203   part number 720014,  IPC 205 part number 914012-013.  IPC 202 shows it, but no part number.

While doing a google search, I found a part at texas salvage that looked like a better older style part, today being substituted  with a lesser part with a hole drilled in it.

The "better" part is also worn, but I would like to find a new part like this.

This part on the ball bushing has written heim F31-14a Mooney 914030. Has flat spots machined to the sides and 2 washers brazed. Looks like it would wear better than the part number used today, the new one just flops around orcwill shortly after installation.

Any thoughts opinions?

Get a regular rod end an modify? 

Is this an original part before cost savings were implemented?

Thanks

Glenn

 

[carusoam]

The rudder doesn’t usually get locked because it is attached to the nose wheel...

The nose wheel doesn’t move very much when in contact with the ground...

So if you see a really narrow wear pattern there is plenty of wear in the system, allowing some motion...

If it is full motion wear, that would be unusual of wearing while at the tie down area...

 

We could ask @M20Doc what he has seen in his travels... regarding rod end bearings and wear...

Best regards,

-a-

[Hradec]

It's an old plane, lots of rod ends with wear that adds up. Couple of spots had a lot of wear causing slop in the nose wheel steering. Just trying to replace parts with the most wear. Seems that through my research a better part may have been used before that was more resistant to wear. The rod end being sold today as the replacement part is not as good as what I suspect was an earlier design. Or did someone see this as a poor design and improved on it?

 

[Guest]

I’ve never seen one with the brazed washers, they’ve been like the one in the LASAR picture.

Clarence

[Andy95W]

My suggestion- send it back to LASAR for IRAN. They’ll do it right at a reasonable price. 

[Hradec]

4 minutes ago, Andy95W said:

My suggestion- send it back to LASAR for IRAN. They’ll do it right at a reasonable price. 

It's just the rod end that got worn, very low time on the steering horn, the horn is fine

[Hradec]

1 hour ago, pmccand said:

I replaced my old style rod ends with the brazed on versions with the newfangled washerless versions several years ago. You will be adding a couple regular washers to the new unit when you put the bolt back through the holes. 
 

 Funny thing is that after I spent a gazillion dollars on the overhaul, the unit had just about as much slop when I finished as it did before I tore it down.  yet it takes off and lands just fine even with all the the slop.

So the brazed one is an actual Mooney part!  Seems like you could get a lot more life out of the brazed one. The current replacement is a joke, it's a $45 rod end with a $100 hole drilled in it. No support, drilled hole shortly goes oblong.

Imagine a solid rod end with machined flats with washers brazed on. Has to last a bit longer  than what is offered today.

What year and type of mooney did you remove the brazed rod end?

[MB65E]

I went through my steering horn. Replaced it with one I thought would be better too. Same slop, but now I know how it all works, and everything is fresh. 
I found a vendor for bushing stock and machined then for a better fit than what the factory could supply.

-Matt

[takair]

After various rebuilds over the years, I went for the LASAR STC upgrade kit a few years ago.  So far it is holding up better than the original design.  That said, I am convinced some of the slop is exaggerated by the less than optimal geometry in the linkage, even with the upgrade.  It seems to be off from ideal by a few degrees and seems to input some angular movement at the steering arm.  Anyway, before the LASAR kit, I seemed to be changing something every couple of years.  I haven’t touched it in a few years now.  Not cheap, but...

[Hradec]

1 hour ago, MB65E said:

I went through my steering horn. Replaced it with one I thought would be better too. Same slop, but now I know how it all works, and everything is fresh. 
I found a vendor for bushing stock and machined then for a better fit than what the factory could supply.

-Matt

I would love to know who your bushing vendor is.

Thanks

Glenn

[Yetti]

17 hours ago, Hradec said:

So the brazed one is an actual Mooney part!  Seems like you could get a lot more life out of the brazed one. The current replacement is a joke, it's a $45 rod end with a $100 hole drilled in it. No support, drilled hole shortly goes oblong.

Imagine a solid rod end with machined flats with washers brazed on. Has to last a bit longer  than what is offered today.

What year and type of mooney did you remove the brazed rod end?

Y'all keep saying brazed.   It looks like the part is cast that way.

But would not be hard to braze washers on.   put a rod through to center the washers and clamp in vice and get to brazing.

[Hradec]

7 hours ago, Yetti said:

Y'all keep saying brazed.   It looks like the part is cast that way.

But would not be hard to braze washers on.   put a rod through to center the washers and clamp in vice and get to brazing.

Looks like newer mooney part has teflon in the rod end. Probably not a good idea to braze.

[Yetti]

7 hours ago, Hradec said:

Looks like newer mooney part has teflon in the rod end. Probably not a good idea to braze.

Looks like rolling your own hemi joint is a thing.   Weldable, rebuildable, greaseable

https://www.emfrodends.com/collections/emf-heim-joints

[Ragsf15e]

On 1/5/2020 at 3:47 PM, Hradec said:

I'm trying to resurrect my 64 m20e serial #311. Hasn't flown in 4 yrs. Lots of play in the nose wheel, logs show a fairly recent  overhauled lasar steering horn installed. That part is ok. However it was parked outside tail into the wind with no rudder lock. The rod ends took a beating.

Examining the steering horn assy, looks like most of the play was in the upper center rod end. Looked pretty cheesy, hollow rod end with a hole drilled in it. Appears that that hole double or tripples the price of that rod end. IPC 203   part number 720014,  IPC 205 part number 914012-013.  IPC 202 shows it, but no part number.

While doing a google search, I found a part at texas salvage that looked like a better older style part, today being substituted  with a lesser part with a hole drilled in it.

The "better" part is also worn, but I would like to find a new part like this.

This part on the ball bushing has written heim F31-14a Mooney 914030. Has flat spots machined to the sides and 2 washers brazed. Looks like it would wear better than the part number used today, the new one just flops around orcwill shortly after installation.

Any thoughts opinions?

Get a regular rod end an modify? 

Is this an original part before cost savings were implemented?

Thanks

Glenn

 

Did you ever find a new 914012-013?

mine is developing some slop too and I haven’t found one yet.  Call is in to Lasar, but doesn’t look good from their website…