300hp Missile Conversion of M20J - Pros and Cons

[Hank]

3 minutes ago, Hank said:

185 down to 159 is a healthy headwind, but hardly 'Holy Cow!' status . . . .

One evening going home to WV around some low level icing (emergency PIREPS on the lowest MEA in WV get my attention], we were motoring along at 10,000msl between KGSP and KTYS, clearing terrain and minimizing dodging below-freezing cloudtops, I was indicating 140 mph [TAS = 140 + 28 = 168 mph ~ 146 KTAS, while my faithful 430W showed groundspeed of 68 knots. No photo, it was too depressing . . . . .

My wife said she was glad we weren't in a Cessna, we'd never get home. I was wishing I had upgraded to a Missile! 

 

[1980Mooney]

Converted my J to a Missile 20 years ago.  It is a 1980 model so it required wing tips per mod.  Added one piece belly for speed and convenience.  Twin Aspens, 530W/430W stack, WX500, GDL88, Flightstream 210, Century 41.  Added Monroy long-range tanks due to thirst.  Never needed speed brakes.  

Missile vs. J:

The mod (with long range tanks) gives great range and load.  I usually fly max 3200 lb. GW on long trips.  Fully loaded feels a bit mushy on takeoff compared to lightweight J (more noticeable in high DA airport) but power provides confident climb.  In cruise no noticeable difference in feel/handling.  CG is farther forward but OK.  I don't need any weight in back when flying alone (maybe because I still have a standby vac in the tail).  I typically fly trips between Houston area and Albuquerque nonstop.  The Missile mod cut one hour off typical trips - real world trips are now usually about 4 hours either direction (oddly). I find the sweet spot for long trips is 10-12 K.  I typically get 170-175 kts at 13+ gph.  If I stay closer to 12 K and it is colder in winter i can get 12+.

As said by others the Missile is tightly cowled without cowl flaps.  On hot Texas or NM summer days, esp. if at large/busy towered airport, have a long taxi or extended hold for IFR  release I might experience high oil temp on ground and high cylinder temps on take off. I used to fret about it while holding but there isn't a lot you can do other than aggressive leaning on the ground.  I simply expedite TO as much as quickly as possible and once airborne I just lower the nose a bit, gain speed and sometimes reduce power a tad to get oil and cylinder temps under control.  In 20 years I have replaced one cylinder due to a valve and one due to compression/oil consumption.   

The IO550A is simple, rugged and thirsty.  I like the Altitude Compensating Fuel Pump (some here don't).  As long as temperatures are in line I take off and climb wide open firewall forward Throttle/Prop/Mixture all the way to assigned altitude (KISS -Keep It Simple Stupid "Set and Forget").  At altitude I typically cruise at 2,400 RPM and then lean 75 degrees ROP.  The standard Cont. injectors are well balanced w/ temps even.  The starter adapter on the IO550 can be a problem but that is a Continental problem (not Missile specific).

As I said previously I haven't found the need for speed brakes on the Missile although I am often in Bravo and Charlie.  I can dirty up the Missile quickly, chopping power, pitching up, dropping gear and partial flaps.  The gear mechanism is stout and for over 2 decades has always been reliable for the task.  The IO550 is just fine if I pull throttle quickly.- Twenty years is a pretty good indicator although i am sure some here will disagree.

You will not want to land on grass, gravel or dirt.  The prop clearance is a weak point.  The 3 blade Hartzell Scimitar is 75 inches vs the stock McCauley at 74 inches.  You may think one (1) inch is immaterial but with the added weight of the IO550 and prop hanging farther out on the same 3 Lord Discs you get greater oscillation on rough surfaces or a poor landing.   If you are on soft ground the nose gear will sink in due to the additional weight of the 550 and 3 blade prop.  I can tell you from experience that one person cannot move the plane if that happens.  There are several threads on MS of Missile owners refusing to park on grass or wrecking a prop on dirt/grass-Seth, Aug '19 destroyed prop in mud at OSK, FloridaMan, Apr '19 refused to park in grass at Sun n Fun.  The full feathering Hartzell PHC-C3YF-2UF is great but rare.  If you need parts, Hartzell may need to manufacture.  This year I needed the lower half of the spinner (essentially a glorified aluminum salad bowl with a hole in the middle).  It cost $2,000 and I had to wait 6 weeks for it to be manufactured.  The full spinner 2 piece cone with brackets is $4,000 (none were available nationwide either at the time).

The Rocket Eng exhaust is a weak point.  It suffers from corrosion.  I know one owner from Houston who lost the tail pipe in flight.  My A&P found one shop that can repair/fab the exhaust and the product is better than Rocket.  

The greater weight and flex can lead to more fuel tank leakage.  I fight that issue from time to time.

Missile vs Ovation (R)

I have no facts but looking at profiles it appears to me that Mooney changed the nose gear geometry on the TLS, Bravo, Ovation, Eagle and Acclaim to provide more prop clearance with the heavy big bores.  Those planes, while sitting on their gear, look like they are at a greater angle of attack vs the J/K.  Maybe someone can refute or confirm.

Of course the Ovation has more space behind the back seats.

--------------------------------------------------------------

All things considered I am happy with the Missile and am keeping as long as I can fly. I did the Missile conversion as a stepwise investment.  Back in 1999-2000 I could not afford (or maybe more appropriately should say "could not justify") a 5-6 year old (1994) Ovation.  If I were buying today I think I would buy a pre-2004 Ovation rather than a Missile - Long body supported by factory, more refined, better, CG, more space and I think better prop clearance and maybe air conditioning!!  - and without the expensive disaster of the G1000 post 2004 (which may get fixed some day soon most likely for lots of $$$).

[1980Mooney]

On 11/17/2020 at 10:02 PM, Hillndale said:

 Extended tanks can make a J’s legs as long as a Missile.

 

But you may need an extended bladder too.....

[carusoam]

The Long Bodies did get a taller nose gear...

While sitting on the ground they have a couple of degrees extra attitude to account for...

Which may give additional clearance, but it also gives the proper stance for Vr...

Best regards,

-a-

[Hillndale]

10 hours ago, 1980Mooney said:

But you may need an extended bladder too.....

Luckily, those are available

[Hillndale]

10 hours ago, 1980Mooney said:

Converted my J to a Missile 20 years ago.  It is a 1980 model so it required wing tips per mod.  Added one piece belly for speed and convenience.  Twin Aspens, 530W/430W stack, WX500, GDL88, Flightstream 210, Century 41.  Added Monroy long-range tanks due to thirst.  Never needed speed brakes.  

Missile vs. J:

The mod (with long range tanks) gives great range and load.  I usually fly max 3200 lb. GW on long trips.  Fully loaded feels a bit mushy on takeoff compared to lightweight J (more noticeable in high DA airport) but power provides confident climb.  In cruise no noticeable difference in feel/handling.  CG is farther forward but OK.  I don't need any weight in back when flying alone (maybe because I still have a standby vac in the tail).  I typically fly trips between Houston area and Albuquerque nonstop.  The Missile mod cut one hour off typical trips - real world trips are now usually about 4 hours either direction (oddly). I find the sweet spot for long trips is 10-12 K.  I typically get 170-175 kts at 13+ gph.  If I stay closer to 12 K and it is colder in winter i can get 12+.

As said by others the Missile is tightly cowled without cowl flaps.  On hot Texas or NM summer days, esp. if at large/busy towered airport, have a long taxi or extended hold for IFR  release I might experience high oil temp on ground and high cylinder temps on take off. I used to fret about it while holding but there isn't a lot you can do other than aggressive leaning on the ground.  I simply expedite TO as much as quickly as possible and once airborne I just lower the nose a bit, gain speed and sometimes reduce power a tad to get oil and cylinder temps under control.  In 20 years I have replaced one cylinder due to a valve and one due to compression/oil consumption.   

The IO550A is simple, rugged and thirsty.  I like the Altitude Compensating Fuel Pump (some here don't).  As long as temperatures are in line I take off and climb wide open firewall forward Throttle/Prop/Mixture all the way to assigned altitude (KISS -Keep It Simple Stupid "Set and Forget").  At altitude I typically cruise at 2,400 RPM and then lean 75 degrees ROP.  The standard Cont. injectors are well balanced w/ temps even.  The starter adapter on the IO550 can be a problem but that is a Continental problem (not Missile specific).

As I said previously I haven't found the need for speed brakes on the Missile although I am often in Bravo and Charlie.  I can dirty up the Missile quickly, chopping power, pitching up, dropping gear and partial flaps.  The gear mechanism is stout and for over 2 decades has always been reliable for the task.  The IO550 is just fine if I pull throttle quickly.- Twenty years is a pretty good indicator although i am sure some here will disagree.

You will not want to land on grass, gravel or dirt.  The prop clearance is a weak point.  The 3 blade Hartzell Scimitar is 75 inches vs the stock McCauley at 74 inches.  You may think one (1) inch is immaterial but with the added weight of the IO550 and prop hanging farther out on the same 3 Lord Discs you get greater oscillation on rough surfaces or a poor landing.   If you are on soft ground the nose gear will sink in due to the additional weight of the 550 and 3 blade prop.  I can tell you from experience that one person cannot move the plane if that happens.  There are several threads on MS of Missile owners refusing to park on grass or wrecking a prop on dirt/grass-Seth, Aug '19 destroyed prop in mud at OSK, FloridaMan, Apr '19 refused to park in grass at Sun n Fun.  The full feathering Hartzell PHC-C3YF-2UF is great but rare.  If you need parts, Hartzell may need to manufacture.  This year I needed the lower half of the spinner (essentially a glorified aluminum salad bowl with a hole in the middle).  It cost $2,000 and I had to wait 6 weeks for it to be manufactured.  The full spinner 2 piece cone with brackets is $4,000 (none were available nationwide either at the time).

The Rocket Eng exhaust is a weak point.  It suffers from corrosion.  I know one owner from Houston who lost the tail pipe in flight.  My A&P found one shop that can repair/fab the exhaust and the product is better than Rocket.  

The greater weight and flex can lead to more fuel tank leakage.  I fight that issue from time to time.

Missile vs Ovation (R)

I have no facts but looking at profiles it appears to me that Mooney changed the nose gear geometry on the TLS, Bravo, Ovation, Eagle and Acclaim to provide more prop clearance with the heavy big bores.  Those planes, while sitting on their gear, look like they are at a greater angle of attack vs the J/K.  Maybe someone can refute or confirm.

Of course the Ovation has more space behind the back seats.

--------------------------------------------------------------

All things considered I am happy with the Missile and am keeping as long as I can fly. I did the Missile conversion as a stepwise investment.  Back in 1999-2000 I could not afford (or maybe more appropriately should say "could not justify") a 5-6 year old (1994) Ovation.  If I were buying today I think I would buy a pre-2004 Ovation rather than a Missile - Long body supported by factory, more refined, better, CG, more space and I think better prop clearance and maybe air conditioning!!  - and without the expensive disaster of the G1000 post 2004 (which may get fixed some day soon most likely for lots of $$$).

The Ovation is a sweet engine/airframe combination, but I wouldn’t say better or worse...just different. My brother has owned an Ovation for almost as long as I’ve had the Missile and we compare notes quite a bit. Cruise speeds are hard to compare directly because my brother runs his Ovation full out and ROP while my habit over the past 15 years or so is to run LOP. We see similar cruise speeds but I burn less fuel. To me, it’s not worth the extra 3 gph to see a 5 kt increase.

The tight cowl issues seem to be just as problematic in both planes. I mentioned in an earlier post that my brother’s Ovation shared the same issue with heat damage to paint over the #6 cylinder cowl blister. But getting familiar with how best to operate the planes took care of recurrent issues for both of us early on in ownership.

Brother’s Ovation has AC & it is nice, but he has more trouble keeping the engine cool in summer than I do with my Missile (but to be fair, his Ft Smith summers can run a little warmer than Louisville’s). If that were important to someone, I’m not sure how easily a Missile could be outfitted with it...so WIN Ovation. Likewise, TKS is more available to Ovations and would not be as easily added on a Missile. I used to think I wanted anti icing, but after pondering it for decades while flying, I’ve come to realize that the best “anti ice” equipment a Mooney pilot can have on board is what’s between the ears. The perfect “do it all” airplane is a illusion.

The Ovation also wins in extra space for passengers, but my brother’s long body airplane is not as fast to get off the ground and doesn’t climb quite as quickly as the Missile. Admittedly, the Ovation is still a class above a 20J in performance. But looking at my flying through the years, I rarely have anyone in the back seat...90% of my flight time is solo with most of the remaining 10% with my wife or a friend.

My brother has other airplanes in his stable that he flies more than the Ovation. He’s offered to sell me the Ovation at a very fair price that could have been covered by the sale of my Missile & 20J. But for me, and the kind of flying I’ve settled into over the years, I honestly favor the Missile over the Ovation.

[carusoam]

In this case...

The brother’s O would benefit from having the 310hp STC...

To compete against the Missile with 300hp... 

The missile does have a lot of benefits!

Best regards,

-a-

[1980Mooney]

On 11/19/2020 at 9:41 AM, Hillndale said:

The Ovation also wins in extra space for passengers, but my brother’s long body airplane is not as fast to get off the ground and doesn’t climb quite as quickly as the Missile. 

 

Of course, because Mooney, for some no good (some would say "insane") reason, limited the IO-550 in the Ovation for most of its production life to 2,500 RPM and 280 HP.  Only in recent years has Mooney come to its senses and allowed the Ovation's IO-550G to operate at its fully rated 2,700 RPM just like every other IO-550 installed in competing Cirrus SR22 and Beechcraft Bonanza G36.

If you limit your Missile RPM to 2,500 on TO and climb, just like your brother's Ovation set-up, I think you will find the Ovation to be equal to the Missile.  Alternatively, get the STC to allow the Ovation to operate at 2,700 RPM and 310 HP and I bet you will change your mind.

 

Edited November 21, 2020 by 1980Mooney

[Missile=Awesome]

14 minutes ago, 1980Mooney said:

Of course, because Mooney, for some no good (some would say "insane") reason, limited the IO-550 for most of the Ovation's production life to 2,500 RPM and 280 HP.  Only in recent years has Mooney come to its senses and allowed the Ovation's IO-550G to operate at its fully rated 2,700 RPM just like every other IO-550 installed in competing Cirrus SR22 and Beechcraft Bonanza G36.

If you limit your Missile RPM to 2,500 on TO and climb, just like your brother's Ovation set-up, I think you will find the Ovation to be equal to the Missile.  Alternatively, get the STC to allow the Ovation to operate at 2,700 RPM and 310 HP and I bet you will change your mind.

 

Doubt it with weight penalty of long body

[Missile=Awesome]

If ifs and but’s were nuts we’d all have food for life  

[Barnstormer]

I have a 1981 Mooney Missile N3545H that has been in the shop for a long time, the engine was rebuilt when I bought it, and now only has about 100 hours, and the plane has 4.5K total hours. It was used mostly back in the 90's to fly paychecks around, which is why it was upgraded to a Missile to get the paychecks out in time.

I am a first-time plane owner, and still need to get my pilot's license, I figured it would be a good starter plane. The plane is in Watsonville CA WVI now, I have a hanger house at Cape Blanco State Airport Oregon at 5S6 and kids in Gig Harbor Washington I plan on flying between the 3 states.

I have a beach house 10 miles from the Cape Blanco Oregon Airport 5S6 and welcome flyers to come and visit, I have a renter at the hanger house that can take you to town, or you can borrow a car and stay a the beach house, 404 Jackson St, Port Orford if anyone wants to visit the Oregon coast this summer.

Here are some pictures from the Port Orford Oregon beach house. Let me know if you are interested in a fly-in trip to the Southern Oregon coast.

 

[Schllc]

Popcorn….

[Utah20Gflyer]

12 hours ago, Barnstormer said:

I have a 1981 Mooney Missile N3545H that has been in the shop for a long time, the engine was rebuilt when I bought it, and now only has about 100 hours, and the plane has 4.5K total hours. It was used mostly back in the 90's to fly paychecks around, which is why it was upgraded to a Missile to get the paychecks out in time.

I am a first-time plane owner, and still need to get my pilot's license, I figured it would be a good starter plane. The plane is in Watsonville CA WVI now, I have a hanger house at Cape Blanco State Airport Oregon at 5S6 and kids in Gig Harbor Washington I plan on flying between the 3 states.

I have a beach house 10 miles from the Cape Blanco Oregon Airport 5S6 and welcome flyers to come and visit, I have a renter at the hanger house that can take you to town, or you can borrow a car and stay a the beach house, 404 Jackson St, Port Orford if anyone wants to visit the Oregon coast this summer.

Here are some pictures from the Port Orford Oregon beach house. Let me know if you are interested in a fly-in trip to the Southern Oregon coast.

 

What made you think a Missile would be a good starter plane?  Hopefully you are just trolling us because a Mooney missile is the exact opposite of a good starter plane.  If this wasn’t a joke please get working on your license and building some time in a nice Cessna or Piper before attempting to transition to the Mooney.  There is a reason insurance is unavailable to students for high performance complex aircraft and it isn’t because insurance companies want to make you fly a boring Cessna 172 to ruin your fun and I’m not writing this because I want to be a buzz kill.  If you were trolling then haha you got me.  
 

By the way, beautiful beach house, looks amazing!  

[hubcap]

^^^^^THIS!!!!!^^^^^

The Mooney Missile conversion would be a DISASTROUS starter airplane....IMO

Just don't.....not until you get some experience.

[William Munney]

I went through this during aircraft purchase options.

My thoughts are:  If you want the IO-550, or the Rocket/ Missile conversion with none of the CG, noise, range, gear wear and specialty parts drawbacks of those conversions……buy the Ovation.  Which i did.

 

[Echo]

10 hours ago, William Munney said:

I went through this during aircraft purchase options.

My thoughts are:  If you want the IO-550, or the Rocket/ Missile conversion with none of the CG, noise, range, gear wear and specialty parts drawbacks of those conversions……buy the Ovation.  Which i did.

 

Well I 100% agree with NOT buying a Missile as a first airplane, BUT Munney: you know NOT what you speak.  There is NOT a "CG" issue with the Missile.  Missile's came with the long range tank conversion so there is NOT a "range issue with the Missile".  Gear wear?  What are you talking about dude?  The Missile gear was beefed up and has no more issues than a Long body.  Parts "drawbacks"?  What are you talking about?  The dedicated canted engine mount is a great design and available.  The custom exhaust is also available.  Good for you in buying a long body.  Probably need to not talk about an airframe that you clearly don't know jack about.  Enjoy your Ovation.  Scott

[William Munney]

That’s not what I’m hearing around the Mooneyverse Scott.  Happy it’s working for you though.  You may disagree, which you did, but I’m chuckling over the keyboard tough guy bit.

[Echo]

2 hours ago, William Munney said:

That’s not what I’m hearing around the Mooneyverse Scott.  Happy it’s working for you though.  You may disagree, which you did, but I’m chuckling over the keyboard tough guy bit.

Me too.  At rather than with though.

[Echo]

Mooney's are small and hard to land.  Heard that around the "mooneyverse".

[William Munney]

Well, that really hurt Scott as your opinions are very important to me.

[McMooney]

22 hours ago, Echo said:

Mooney's are small and hard to land.  Heard that around the "mooneyverse".

you know, this is a thing.  never understood why people try to scare people away from mooneys.  

they are not harder to land than say a piper or diamond and let's be honest if you aren't flying an ovation at close to the fl  only 20 to 30ish kts faster.  as i try to fly lop, i only get about 10 to 15kts faster

yes you do need to remember to put the gear down.

 

 

 

[Echo]

9 minutes ago, McMooney said:

you know, this is a thing.  never understood why people try to scare people away from mooneys.  

they are not harder to land than say a piper or diamond and let's be honest if you aren't flying an ovation at close to the fl  only 20 to 30ish kts faster.  as i try to fly lop, i only get about 10 to 15kts faster

yes you do need to remember to put the gear down.

 

 

 

Yes.  My attempt at humor was missed.  Shame on me.

[Echo]

11 minutes ago, McMooney said:

you know, this is a thing.  never understood why people try to scare people away from mooneys.  

they are not harder to land than say a piper or diamond and let's be honest if you aren't flying an ovation at close to the fl  only 20 to 30ish kts faster.  as i try to fly lop, i only get about 10 to 15kts faster

yes you do need to remember to put the gear down.

 

 

 

Especially other Mooney owners.

[Schllc]

On 3/5/2024 at 7:25 PM, William Munney said:

That’s not what I’m hearing around the Mooneyverse Scott.  Happy it’s working for you though.  You may disagree, which you did, but I’m chuckling over the keyboard tough guy bit.

I don’t know an owner of any aircraft that isn’t struggling with some parts issues, required and discretionary. 
Owning an aircraft of any make or model is a labor of love these days. 
if you want to separate the wheat from the chaff about any plane, all you have to do is to talk to actual owners.  Everything is a trade off…

[Jetpilot86]

When I was looking, as intriguing as the Rocket line was, longer term support was a concern I had so the more units of a model available in my mission parameters the better.

As a first time owner, after a long hiatus from GA making a living getting paid to fly jets instead, the fewer variables, the better for me.

Probably should have hopped back in GA 5-6 years ago, with a 182.  However, while the learning curve has been steep, many thanks to those here keeping it shallower, I'm really enjoying my Bravo.