M20F Fuel Stick - I know I know

[sdflysurf]

Ok I know it has been discussed, but I can't find exactly what I am looking for - Mine is the M20F Model with 32GAL tanks on each side (no bladder).

Anyone have a measurement stick they could show me next to a measuring tape so I can make my own?

And yes, when the money is there I will be going the Cies route.  Probably in 2019.

[N6018Q]

http://www.fuelstik.com/

Bought one for my E (26g/side) and its accurate to within a gallon. Not quite as cheap as a wooden stick but...

[Bob - S50]

39 minutes ago, N6018Q said:

http://www.fuelstik.com/

Bought one for my E (26g/side) and its accurate to within a gallon. Not quite as cheap as a wooden stick but...

Got one for our J.  Very nice.

[Yetti]

Build as you go.  Paint stirrer and sharpie.  Draw line.   Fuel and then subtract from 32

[pinerunner]

I took a dowel and started with an empty tank at the fuel pump. I just added 5 gallons at a time, stuck the dowel in and marked it with a pencil (not soluble is graphite so good for this). Kept doing it until is was full and I had a dowel marked in 5-gallon increments. 

[Bob - S50]

We were going to use a stick too, but found that the fuel wicked up the stick making it difficult to get an accurate reading.  Plus, if you happen to stick the tank with the most fuel first you have no way of checking the other tank until the stick dries.

[MBDiagMan]

I made a stick for my C from a paint stirrer and 100LL evaporated plenty fast enough before I made it to the second tank.  I don’t remember if I fueled the tank a few gallons at a time or got dimensions on this forum.  I too would like to have dimensions for 32 gallon tanks.

[sdflysurf]

6 hours ago, N6018Q said:

http://www.fuelstik.com/

Bought one for my E (26g/side) and its accurate to within a gallon. Not quite as cheap as a wooden stick but...

Question for you on this - do I have to do the whole "empty the tank and then add 1 or 2 gallons at a time and make a sharpie mark then rinse repeat" thing with this stick or do they have the measurements for an M20F already dialed in??

[GDGR]

I’m in the same boat, and will be dipping-marking-adding fuel and recording over the next couple of weeks. 

If you’re able to post fuel height measurements and fuel added, I’d be willing to do the same. 

[N6018Q]

1 hour ago, sdflysurf said:

Question for you on this - do I have to do the whole "empty the tank and then add 1 or 2 gallons at a time and make a sharpie mark then rinse repeat" thing with this stick or do they have the measurements for an M20F already dialed in??

There are downloads on their site for various capacities that you can print and use in the fuelstik. I used the M20C (same tank size). It also comes with a universal printout that you could mark in the manner you referenced.

[Yetti]

The more sturdy 5 gallon paint sticks from Sherwin Williams are made out of a harder wood.  Don't suck up the gas as much and work well with a Sharpie marker.  Or a few minutes with a saw and some red oak should work well.

[HRM]

I produced the attached chart showing the mapping from the "Universal" Fuel Hawk (0.012 AMU) to the Mooney M20E fuel level mapping by adding fuel a gallon at a time. Surprisingly linear. I just could not do the wood stick thing. 

Then I made a table that I taped onto the Fuel Hawk--has served me well.

 

 

[Bob - S50]

15 hours ago, sdflysurf said:

Question for you on this - do I have to do the whole "empty the tank and then add 1 or 2 gallons at a time and make a sharpie mark then rinse repeat" thing with this stick or do they have the measurements for an M20F already dialed in??

I have a "J", but if the tanks are the same as the "F", here is a PDF file that contains the markings for our airplane.  Cut the paper to fit in the FuelStik so that the mark for 11 gallons is at the very top of the rising indicator.  If you'll notice the notes (which can be left visible on your stick), for our airplane it takes 7 gallons of usable fuel to just wet the area under the filler cap.  It takes 11 gallons usable before there is enough fuel to float the riser.  If your plane has 50 gallons tabs, fill a wing to the tab and see if the FuelStik indicates 25 gallons.  If it does, you should be pretty close.

We did not calibrate above 25 gallons.  Our reasoning was that if you need more than that, you can fill to the tab and then meter in the amount needed to bring you up to the desired fuel level.  So for example, if you need 54 gallons and want 27 gallons/side, just fill to the 25 gallon tab and then meter in 2 more gallons.  Done.

Fuel Stick.pdf

[sdflysurf]

Thank you guys - I will work through these options and report back!!!

[carusoam]

Note:

1) The stick is a great method to know how much fuel is in the tank.

2) but... between hardware and procedure differences, there can be differences in the reading.  You want a calibrated stick and a trained operator...

3) be sure to calibrate a few points before relying on it.  If needed, train yourself to always take the reading the same way the stick was calibrated...

4) specifically, know how much usable fuel is in the tank when the stick measures ‘0’

5) Dihedral, fuel cap location, and operator differences can account for a few important differences...

6) Start with the calibrated stick, if / when able... Adding the analog wing mounted gauges is not very complex.  They cleanly mount into an inspection panel.

 

Hmmmm... makes me think...

7) fuel level indications change with attitude...

8) the wing mounted gauges are calibrated for the plane being on the ground.  They can be read in flight, but their indicating lines are in 5 gallon intervals...

9) Using the stick in flight could have a few extra challenges.  

 

10)  @fuellevel would have to ask the Cies guy... with all that 1 gallon accuracy in level flight... what do pilots do for accuracy while filling a Mooney on level ground? Is there and adder/subtractor for ground attitude?

 

There are so many budgetary levels in the Mooney world... but, the need for accuracy, and ability to have accuracy, is in reach for even the most entry level CB... 

Don’t run out of fuel flying to the nearest airport with fuel... that’s already been done before.

PP thoughts only, not a fuel service technician....

Best regards,

-a-

 

[skydvrboy]

Like @Yetti said, build it as you go by marking the line, adding the fuel, then subtracting to get your number.  Although, I'd run a tank dry and then fill it completely to determine your actual capacity rather than going by the published 32 gallons.  My F holds 33.2 gallons per side, give or take 1/10 of a gallon.  I still use 32 gallons for making my stick, but I think it's valuable information to know.

I personally don't particularly like the "add a few gallons at a time" method.   It seems like it takes a while for the fuel to flow into the lower part of the tank.  That gave me incorrect markings at the lower fuel levels where it is most important.  I suppose that could be fixed with more patience, but the above method doesn't suffer from that inaccuracy.

Also, try different woods if you have access to them.  You will find that they react to the fuel differently.  I found that cedar works really well because it changes colors dramatically showing exactly where your fuel level is.  Whether the stick wicks the fuel up a bit or not is irrelevant if you calibrate your own stick rather than relying on making one off measurements.  Your measurement will be off by the same amount as the mark that was made when you calibrated it.

One more key that no one has directly mentioned, since the tank is sloped, make sure you take your measurement through the opening the same way.  I used the center, but you could use the outside, inside, front, back, whatever.  Just make sure you do it the same way every time.

[RLCarter]

I did a stick years ago for the 172, I slid a 5/16" rubber hose over a 1/4" wooden dowel, fuel level was very easy to see and didn't wick up, I was only after the measurement to give to the guy that use to do the Custom fuel dipsticks

[MyNameIsNobody]

My stick on 26 gallon tank

[MyNameIsNobody]

Mine is/was done with black ball point pen on a Walmart Glidden 100% wood stick.

[fuellevel]

You still use a stick?

[Hephaestus]

Give me a second to figure out why fusion isn't playing right and I'll post it to thingiverse - based on measurements above.

Print in PETG - decided to make it 300mm tall, so it fits on the more common 3d printers. 

* 3d printing is inaccurate so is my eyeball tape measure and parralax error not accounted for. So if you crash due to using it your problem not mine, suggest you verify accuracy and Mark correctly.

[MyNameIsNobody]

4 hours ago, fuellevel said:

You still use a stick?

Ya, I do.  It is accurate.  Simple and F.R.E.E.  Take your gadget and market it to someone that cares. #unnecessarywaste

[HRM]

9 hours ago, MyNameIsNobody said:

Mine is/was done with black ball point pen on a Walmart Glidden 100% wood stick.

This is sort of a 'whatever floats your boat' thing.

My question is, doesn't the wood stick pick up fuel smell?

Also, when you find a splinter clogging a fuel injector, won't that ruin your day?

[MyNameIsNobody]

41 minutes ago, HRM said:

This is sort of a 'whatever floats your boat' thing.

My question is, doesn't the wood stick pick up fuel smell?

Also, when you find a splinter clogging a fuel injector, won't that ruin your day?

15 years of use.  Answers: No, Yes, but a nitwit 16 year old rear-ending me will too and likelihood is actually real unlike the “phantom splinter”.  Can an IPhone open a bottle or a can too?  Some stuff just makes me laugh.  Yes 100% agree it’s a whatever floats your boat.  Fuellevel wants to troll me...I told him what I think of his gadget...

The end.

[fuellevel]

Actually - I like the reaction.    A fixed position (i.e. mounted in the tank) accurate reporting device should if designed correctly outperform

•  A methodology that involves human interface, that coordinates a predictable repeatable action in a nearly impossible still volume of fuel  with a porous and human marked stick.

The ability to project that accuracy on the ubiquitous smartphone that everyone caries os just a succinct way of illustrating this disparity 

The last cars to come equipped with a stick are Early 1950's Volkwagon Beetles and MC TD's  for a point of reference

I am not driving in the illustration and I hardly qualify as a teenager.

The fact that this former methodology (Stick)  has no impact on fuel starvation and exhaustion statistic in aviation.   An Actual Scientific Study was performed that indicated that this methodology for long distance flights is nearly universal or near 100% in the pilot population and slightly less so for a short distance flights.

If you look at the current Nall Report -  the Fuel Statistic remains stubborn while overall accidents in aviation are falling 

 

Funny - in speaking to people much older than me,  it was equally unsuccessful in Volkswagen Beetles and MG TDs

 

If I told you 10 years ago that you would take strangers into your house and  rent them a spare room or get into a car with a total stranger to be taken somewhere - your arguments to those concepts may have had equal vitriol - yet here we are with Airbnb, Uber and Lyft 

The world does change 

Edited September 27, 2018 by fuellevel
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