Long XC Solo Suggestions

[Skates97]

Next Wednesday is my first XC solo from KCNO to KRNM. Saturday the 30th will be my long XC solo. After talking with my CFI I think I am leaning towards KCNO -> KCMA -> KPMD -> KCNO.

They don't want it to be too easy and figure navigating the mountains from Camarillo to Palmdale, and then back to Chino will provide somewhat of a challenge. At least more of a challenge than flying out to Palm Springs and hitting San Bernadino on the way back. Those of you that have toured around SoCal, any ideas?

[Hank]

Go new places, and make sure to get the required XC hours. You don't want to come up  0.2 short . . .

[211º]

I went from Hawthorne (KHHR) and landed at an airport that was below sealevel - Thermal (KTRM). That was unique for the log book.

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[Skates97]

47 minutes ago, Hank said:

Go new places, and make sure to get the required XC hours. You don't want to come up  0.2 short . . .

Camarillo (KCMA) and Palmdale (KPMD) are both new. Flight school says it has to be two airports I have never been to. (Three trips to Ramona with the CFI, well today we diverted to Palomar, plus my flight to Ramona next week is about as many times as I want to fly there...)

24 minutes ago, 211º said:

I went from Hawthorne (KHHR) and landed at an airport that was below sealevel - Thermal (KTRM). That was unique for the log book.

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That would be fun, but will have to save that for another trip. Flight school also wants both airports to be towered for this trip.

Thought about going to Mohave Space Port (KMHV) just because it would be fun to put a Space Port in the log book, but I am only signed off to 10kt cross winds and in looking at the typical winds up there I'm not going to be given the okay for it. Going to have to save that one for sometime down the road after I have my PPL and quite a bit more experience under my belt.

[kerry]

I don't think you land at KPMD without prior permission from the Defense Department.  Like Chino KMHV has some great airplanes to look at.  KDAG could be a great choice.  Long runways and winds are predominately from the West which gives you a head wind when landing.

 

[Skates97]

Just now, kerry said:

I don't think you land at KPMD without prior permission from the Defense Department.  Like Chino KMHV has some great airplanes to look at.  KDAG could be a great choice.  Long runways and winds are predominately from the West which gives you a head wind when landing.

 

Ah, I see that you need USAF approval to land there. Maybe my CFI doesn't know that (he had suggested Palmdale) or he is thinking of General Fox KWJF just to the north west of KPMD. KDAG would be nice, but doesn't fit the "needs to be towered" bill for this flight. KWJF would still take me over the mountains from KCMA and then I could fly back along north side of the mountains and down through the Cajon Pass. I could also land at KCMA and then continue on to KSBA and then back to KCNO.

[carqwik]

My long x-c was EMT-SBA-SBP-EMT....in a Traumahawk.  I think it was 4+ hours of flying...

 

[bonal]

Camarillo to Mojave would be nice there is a nice restaurant right next to transient parking and Mojave has the option of any winds with 3 very long runways. When you come in over the,west mountains Mojave is right in front and in a Mooney makes for a challenging descent but should be no problem in a Cherokee. This is getting close to the finish and you have closed the gap on Sam H. I wish you both success on you PPL

 

[Skates97]

The more I watch the weather at Mojave the more I'm just going to have to let that go for now. If I could get there in the morning when the winds are calmer it would be doable. However I am going to be flying in the afternoon and the pattern for the winds has been in the 20-23kt range with gusts in the 26-32kt range coming from 200 to 240. If they were from 220 it would be alright for runway 22, but if it is coming from anywhere else the gusts take the x-wind factor above what I am signed off for... Even at KWJF the winds this afternoon were out of my range for some of the time. I may have to plan KCNO -> KCMA -> KSBA -> KCNO.

[N201MKTurbo]

You couldn't have found more complex airspace to train in. The up side is after learning in SoCal you can go anywhere!

[carqwik]

That's what my instructor told me 33 years ago...I think they still had the TCA and TRSAs back then....and definitely no "Socal Approach."  From northwest to southeast it was Santa Barbara, Pt. Mugu, Burbank, Los Angeles, Coast, and San Diego approach...and to the northeast you got Ontario and March GCA before getting to Palm Springs approach... And I might be forgetting some!  I can see why they combined the approach controls (mostly)!

[Hank]

18 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

You couldn't have found more complex airspace to train in. The up side is after learning in SoCal you can go anywhere!

That's what my CFI told me about learning at our 3000 x 75 field with no taxiway and trees at both ends. It's other good point was the D with radar 4.2 nm away, I got used to talking in the radio and setting up flight following shortly after takeoff. I can land anywhere . . . and realistically don't have to worry about airspace as complex as SoCal, as getting my plane there would be a challenge.

[N201MKTurbo]

16 minutes ago, Hank said:

That's what my CFI told me about learning at our 3000 x 75 field with no taxiway and trees at both ends. It's other good point was the D with radar 4.2 nm away, I got used to talking in the radio and setting up flight following shortly after takeoff. I can land anywhere . . . and realistically don't have to worry about airspace as complex as SoCal, as getting my plane there would be a challenge.

270 deg 8 hours, where is the challenge?

[Skates97]

47 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

You couldn't have found more complex airspace to train in. The up side is after learning in SoCal you can go anywhere!

I don't know, I look at where Sam H is training up in Palo Alto and I'm glad I'm down here. There is a good mix of everything, busy field with good controllers, some airspace I have to avoid and work around but not too much, getting passed off through three different approach controllers on my trips down to Ramona, it's all been good experience.

23 minutes ago, Hank said:

That's what my CFI told me about learning at our 3000 x 75 field with no taxiway and trees at both ends. It's other good point was the D with radar 4.2 nm away, I got used to talking in the radio and setting up flight following shortly after takeoff. I can land anywhere . . . and realistically don't have to worry about airspace as complex as SoCal, as getting my plane there would be a challenge.

Hank, I agree that you had a challenging field to learn on. That and you have a lot less landmarks to navigate with than I do. I lived in AL for a couple of years and I'm glad to be flying around here in SoCal. When we left Palomar Saturday my CFI wanted to know how I was going to find my way back to my route (as if it was going to be difficult). I told him it was easy to head NE until I saw I-15, but even without that I could see Palomar Mountain to the East, and off to the north I could see both San Gorgonio and Mt Baldy about 70nm away so there was no way I was getting lost.

[N201MKTurbo]

Hay, Hank, I was just looking up your location and I delivered my old F model to Prattville when I sold it in '03, I'm pretty sure it is still there.

Well, I was wrong, it would be more like 12 hours... 3 four hour legs, a good days flying...

[Hank]

41 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

Hay, Hank, I was just looking up your location and I delivered my old F model to Prattville when I sold it in '03, I'm pretty sure it is still there.

Well, I was wrong, it would be more like 12 hours... 3 four hour legs, a good days flying...

Plotting a route through the mountains for my little C would be the challenge. (I'm allergic to cumulogranite. ) And paying the fuel bill . . . I'm not ready to make a one-way flight! I was just in Prattville on the 4th, there was a white-over-red Mooney outside one of the hangars, but I missed the number. Can I really ignore the increasing magnetic variation? It's about 8°W here, what is it out there?

Skates, I trained on the WV/OH border, the airport was on the bank of the Ohio River. It was a great landmark, we were right at the bottom of the river. (Look at a map of Ohio, the southern border is the river, we were at the point in the middle. The next town over called themselves "the southernmost point in Ohio," but I don't think those two words belong in the same sentence.) Climb high, look for the River, and fly for the low point. Now that I'm in Alabama, there are very few landmarks at all; if I'm low and hunting for my airport, it's ~8nm north of the interstate and sort of NW of the big red landfill (but there are two of those . . .). Descending from the NE, my most common trip, there ain't nothing around and the river here is pretty narrow. At least I have a taxiway, though!   Gotta look for the good points. And having learned where I did, there are few fields that bother me, like the one near my parents--patched, uneven, faded and 2770 x 40, beware the church steeple on short final for 14.

This is why you need to get away from your local area and go new places. It's all very different; I've been to runways with humps in the middle, saddle-shaped, uphill, downhill, wide, narrow, hidden in corn fields and up on hilltops. Your first downhill landing is eye opening, the runway falling away at the same rate you are descending . . . My challenge was logging enough landings at a field with an operating tower; you should visit several new untowered fields before your checkride, since that's what the overwhelming majority of U.S. airports are.

In the meantime, keep on learning and posting, I enjoy your writing. And fly safe!

"Fly as if your life depended on it. Because it does."

[Bryan1016]

A few weeks ago I did DC then on to Republic in NY, IFR in VFR out. I'll never go back to DC. They claim all the airspace. Everywhere. The small airports inside the 60 mile circle are dying. I understand why they do it, but still very sad.

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[Skates97]

Hank, the list of airports that I want to visit is quickly growing. I've only been to two non-towered fields so far, Corona KAJO, and Flabob KRIR. I'm looking forward to when I can just go out and visit places. My wife has on her list Santa Ynez KIZA for shortly after I get my PPL. She's wanted to visit Solvang for quite awhile and that's all the excuse I need to fly her there.

[Jerry 5TJ]

On July 17, 2016 at 11:41 PM, Bryan1016 said:

A few weeks ago I did DC then on to Republic in NY, IFR in VFR out. I'll never go back to DC. They claim all the airspace. Everywhere. The small airports inside the 60 mile circle are dying. I understand why they do it, but still very sad.

I flew in California for a couple of decades, then moved east last year and now I base my Ovation at Baltimore KMTN, right at the edge of the SFRA and in the middle of that 60 mile zone.

Yes, it is a nuisance to call and get a squawk code before departing non-towered fields inside the SFRA.  But it's quick and painless, you put in your code and go. 

A positive stemming from that pre-assigned code & flight plan is that you don't have to plead for VFR flight following.  Once airborne you call, you're identified and acknowledged.  

IFR operations feel no different than elsewhere (just don't cancel in the air and switch to 1200!)  Oh, and keep your airspeed below 180 KIAS when you buy that TBM900.

It is just a little different than elsewhere in the USA.   There's still lots of fine flying all over our country.  

 

 

[FlyDave]

On 7/16/2016 at 10:14 PM, carqwik said:

My long x-c was EMT-SBA-SBP-EMT....in a Traumahawk.  I think it was 4+ hours of flying...

 

Cool!

My long XC in 2003 was EMT-BFL-SBA-EMT. My instructor told me to read up on clearance delivery for SBA - good suggestion!

BFL may be a better choice than MHV for winds as it can absolutely HOWL at MHV (ask me how I know that.....).

All this in a 152 with one NAV for BFL-SBA (learned a lot about VOR's that day)

Best of luck - I'm sure you'll do fine.

Dave

[carqwik]

Mine was in 1983...SoCal was still very busy and convoluted airspace even back then!  I think Avgas was around $2.15/gal...

Edited July 19, 2016 by carqwik

[Skates97]

36 minutes ago, FlyDave said:

Cool!

My long XC in 2003 was EMT-BFL-SBA-EMT. My instructor told me to read up on clearance delivery for SBA - good suggestion!

BFL may be a better choice than MHV for winds as it can absolutely HOWL at MHV (ask me how I know that.....).

All this in a 152 with one NAV for BFL-SBA (learned a lot about VOR's that day)

Best of luck - I'm sure you'll do fine.

Dave

Ok, I'll bite. Always enjoy hearing a good story. 

CNO - CMA - BFL - CNO would work. I think I'll run that one and CNO - CMA - SBA - CNO past my CFI and get his opinion.

[Bryan1016]

How'd it go Skate?   Did you have to read any water towers?

[Skates97]

15 minutes ago, Bryan1016 said:

How'd it go Skate?   Did you have to read any water towers?

You're a day early. My initial XC solo is tomorrow from CNO to RNM. I hope I don't need any water towers, the only one I can think of is the other direction from where I'm supposed to be going... 

I'm not worried about getting lost, it's just flying along I-15 and along the mountains. I didn't have any problem finding the way there the 1st, 2nd, or 3rd times I flew with my CFI. If I get lost tomorrow I should probably just walk away from it all.  I'll report in with a story and some pictures tomorrow night. (Got the GoPro ready to stick on the dash and just let it take pictures on a time-lapse setting along the way.)

For my long XC on the 30th looks like I will be going CNO-CMA-SBA-CNO. I ran both options by my CFI and he likes that there are alternate airports along the way if there's any problems going to SBA and there's really nothing between CMA and BFL.

[Hank]

29 minutes ago, Bryan1016 said:

  Did you have to read any water towers?

Here in the 21st century, pilots read the exit signs along the interstate . . .  

Do well tomorrow, skates!