Help with Mooney purchase.

[Classic Aircraft]

Looking for some advice on a potential Mooney purchase. My wife and I have a boat in Key West and live on the east side of Houston. I am considering a later model J to see if the Mooney is even feasible. How long do clean Mooneys sit on the market? If I were to buy before the end of the year for tax reasons and decided to upgrade to a turbo or even a different make of aircraft do Mooneys sell relatively quick? Discounts from listed prices? I do not mind paying for someone with extensive knowledge to help with buying the right aircraft at the right price. There are a lot of sellers out there looking for a buyers agent or good advice.

[Hank]

Call All American right there in Texas. Jimmy Garrison knows much about the Mooney market.

[rainman]

+1 on All American. (830) 885-5723 Jimmy Garrison or David McGee.

[schule]

+1 for All American.

I have bought both my Mooneys through them. An original N/A and then turbo. Right now they have a well equipped 1985 J and a couple of 252s along with a flavor of all the rest. Airplanes move when the right buyer finds what they want and the banker tells them they can afford it.......so even good planes may be on the market for a while.

Good luck!

[Bluevalley]

Sold my '87J through All American a few years back, and would definitely work with them again buying or selling. Good folks to know.

[Parker_Woodruff]

What do you want to be able to do with your airplane? I've owned both an M20J and a turbocharged M20K. Traveled to KEYW from Lakeland a few times. I liked having the turbo, even in Florida.

Jimmy and David at All-American are great. I've also helped a few of their clients with aircraft delivery and flight training.

Buying a Mooney out of Texas is always a good idea. You have good Mooney Service Centers (Don Maxwell), you have a good interior shop in San Antonio (Aero Comfort), and there are plenty of great avionics shops around.

[Hank]

For general advice, try this excellent thread: http://mooneyspace.com/topic/8-prospective-vintage-mooney-buyers/?hl=%2Bbuying+%2Bvintage+%2Bmooney

There are also others here (use the Search box), but this one has much good information from a knowledgable source.

[N601RX]

If the trip to Key West is going to be a regular trip, I probably makes sense to look at a 252, Rocket or Missile conversion. Also look at range if you plan to make the trip without stopping. Some planes will have extended range tanks.

[Parker_Woodruff]

I just read that you are in Houston. I could do nonstop to Central Florida (LAL) from Dallas or Austin on about 54 gallons. Extended range tanks on a Mooney M20K would make a nonstop trip basically guaranteed. You'd need a higher useful load variant to assure that the W&B would work out.

[Mooneymite]

If you're thinking of making regular trips across the gulf, get a twin. 

[piperpainter]

I'd get a twin too! That way you could go direct with two engines! 

[Classic Aircraft]

Thanks for all the replies. I have spoke to Jimmy at AllAmerican. His suggestion was a K model. My curiosity (and I realize that some of these aircraft may very well belong to folks on this forum) is if I were to buy a nice shape J model. Are large discounts realistic? Not that I have a issue with asking prices if that is the market. Is the ask prices on most of these aircraft out of line? I realize when you buy something there are no guarantees but I would hate to pay 120k for an aircraft realize it does not suit my needs and not be able to sell it or have to give it away for 30-50% less than paid. So I guess what I am asking is how do you negotiate a fair price without being insulting? What is fair? How long have you as owners had to sit on an aircraft after you listed it? What is the best source for determining a value that a particular aircraft would sell for? In other words a clean J listed at 100-110 would it sell quickly at 85-90? Do Mooneys sell quickly if priced right or is the market soft for sellers? Thanks for the replies I am just trying to understand the Mooney market.

[Classic Aircraft]

In response to the twin idea. I have considered it but I am not a fan of partners and trying to avoid the extra expense of ownership. I love the idea and stay multi proficient I am a corporate pilot King Air 350, Citation 650 but a lot of trips will be solo or 1 pax. Reality will probably be T41 to DTS. Fuel and Hooters then on to KEYW.

[Parker_Woodruff]

Most nice airplanes that have been flown often and are well maintained and well equipped sell quickly and for close to the asking price, If the asking price is reasonable.

For a top notch, late model M20J, the mid $100Ks aren't out of the question.

I really think you're going to want the speed of the M20K for your KEYW trips.

You can buy a lot of M20K in the mid $100s right now.

[fantom]

Thanks for all the replies. I have spoke to Jimmy at AllAmerican. His suggestion was a K model. My curiosity.......if I were to buy a nice shape J model. Are large discounts realistic? .......I am just trying to understand the Mooney market.

A K sounds about right. Jimmy, better than anyone, can give you an idea of fair market value. If you're looking for a 20% discount off on a good plane that Jimmy has then good luck!

Jimmy recently sold my very nice J in seven weeks at a fair price, that he and I set. The market is solid for good planes and you need to move quickly on one when you locate it. Bottom feeding is ill advised and you'll wind up with more problems than you bargained for.

[Classic Aircraft]

Thanks again. What I mostly wanted was input from owners that have sold or purchased aircraft recently. I do not expect a 20 or even 10 percent discount if the ask price is actually the market value. I am merely stating I have no idea what market value or time spent on the market for sale may be. I thought I would try and buy a popular very resell friendly model for my first Mooney purchase. Do the K models have sufficient cabin heat at altitude?

[ArtVandelay]

When I was looking I went to controller.com and other sites, kept track of all planes of the model I was interested in, which sold and those that didn't. After a few months, I could quickly tell which were overpriced and which would sell quickly. I spent 6 months window shopping before I ever looked at plane up close.

[Parker_Woodruff]

Thanks again. What I mostly wanted was input from owners that have sold or purchased aircraft recently. I do not expect a 20 or even 10 percent discount if the ask price is actually the market value. I am merely stating I have no idea what market value or time spent on the market for sale may be. I thought I would try and buy a popular very resell friendly model for my first Mooney purchase. Do the K models have sufficient cabin heat at altitude?

Plenty of heat at FL210 in the winter.

[GeorgePerry]

Not sure what American is pushing a turbo for TX to Key West?  Ask your wife if she minds flying on O2.  If cannulas don't bother her then it might be a good option.  Just remember you need to get a "K" over 12K to start seeing any real airspeed gain over a J.  Operating costs will likely be slightly higher too.  

[carusoam]

At least using All American... You buy it at what is considered a fair price. If you need to sell it, you can expect to use a price similar to that, minus the cost of selling. As good it gets...

The challenge is...

For quickest sale, you need to have a desirable, updated plane.

Go visit AAA in KSAT in person.

Expect that it takes a month to complete the transaction successfully.

A PPI is critical to your financial health.

Get started soon to be able to purchase by dec 31st.

I used this same thought process four years ago... Didn't have to sell, so I don't know exactly how well it would work.

Best regards,

-a-

[schule]

My wife drove our transition from N/A without O2 to a turbo with O2 because she hates the chop caused by summer heating. It is also great to quickly get above the scud layers hanging around normal N/A altitudes.

Highly recommend an altitude chamber ride if you plan to go high. Don't forget to give a couple of days after any Key West scuba before flying home regardless of the model you decide on.

Good luck with the search.

[DonMuncy]

Except that Jimmy and David are not at KSAT anymore. Google All American.

[carusoam]

I may have missed something in my deep sleep period...

When did they move?

-a-

http://allamericanaircraft.com/Default.htm

This one, Don?

http://www.aviationacres.com/Texas.asp?CMD=ResDetail&LI=76674&SI=44275

-a-

[DonMuncy]

The top one, yes

[DonMuncy]

At my age, time slips by. It seems like about a year ago, but likely longer.