More Pre-buy questions.

[Mcstealth]

I have scheduled an inspection with Dugosh. I asked for and recieved what their pre-buy entails. They handed me the Mooney 100hr inspection guide. $1800. 

I read the two sheet inspection. Seems pretty thorough to me. 

I am paying extra to borescope the cam. 

Should I ask for anything more to be done?

Edited June 4, 2023 by Mcstealth

[N201MKTurbo]

1 hour ago, M20Doc said:

The current Mooney inspection checklist is 7 pages long.

https://www.mooney.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/100-HOURANNUAL-Inspection-Guide.pdf

That’s the checklist I used to develop my progressive maintenance plan. It must be a good one, the FAA approved it.

[bcg]

Dugosh is good people and they're thorough, if there are issues with the plane, they'll likely find them.

Sent from my Pixel 6a using Tapatalk

[cliffy]

Money well spent !!!

[Mcstealth]

On 6/4/2023 at 4:53 AM, M20Doc said:

The current Mooney inspection checklist is 7 pages long.

https://www.mooney.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/100-HOURANNUAL-Inspection-Guide.pdf

The papers I have, are dated. Good catch Dr. Clarence. There are some differences but not a terrible lot. There is one added section though and the whole checklist was revamped.

Thanks........

[gabez]

here is one I learned the hard way, pressurize the fuel tanks for fuel cap leaks...or any other leaks

[Mcstealth]

3 hours ago, gabez said:

here is one I learned the hard way, pressurize the fuel tanks for fuel cap leaks...or any other leaks

Got ya. Actually @LANCECASPER has already schooled me on that one.

[dlthig]

Infinity quoted me 16 hours for a pre-buy. They borescope.

[Yetti]

Get an AD list and purchase the CD from the FAA.    Depending on the year of the plane, the initial AD list would take 4-8 hours.  Depending on the level of documentation some ADs are just guesses.    Oil gears being one of the guesses

 

Edited June 15, 2023 by Yetti

[PT20J]

7 hours ago, gabez said:

here is one I learned the hard way, pressurize the fuel tanks for fuel cap leaks...or any other leaks

Not too much pressure or you can damage things. I put a length of vinyl hose over the vent and blow with my lungs while spraying soapy water on the cap. 

[MikeOH]

3 hours ago, Yetti said:

Get an AD list and purchase the CD from the FAA.    Depending on the year of the plane, the initial AD list would take 4-8 hours.  Depending on the level of documentation some ADs are just guesses.    Oil gears being one of the guesses

 

Yuuup! I backed out of PPI because the seller couldn’t prove the oil gears AD.

[Yetti]

51 minutes ago, MikeOH said:

Yuuup! I backed out of PPI because the seller couldn’t prove the oil gears AD.

I doubt anyone could.   There were three AD on the gear in rapid succession.   So the write is usually "replaced oil gears"   Unless it says which one and what materials then you just have to guess.

[Mcstealth]

6 hours ago, M20Doc said:

Remove the right magneto, light and mirror to examine the the pump body.

Excuse my ignorance. Oil pump?

Edited June 16, 2023 by Mcstealth

[Mcstealth]

18 hours ago, Yetti said:

Get an AD list and purchase the CD from the FAA.    Depending on the year of the plane, the initial AD list would take 4-8 hours.  Depending on the level of documentation some ADs are just guesses.    Oil gears being one of the guesses

 

I would think Dugosh would have this CD? Don't assume?

[MooneyMitch]

3 minutes ago, Mcstealth said:

Excuses my ignorance. Oil pump?

There are no question that need an excuse. Ask away, you're learning and that's a good thing!!

[Fly Boomer]

12 minutes ago, Mcstealth said:

I would think Dugosh would have this CD? Don't assume?

I assumed “the CD” meant the one with all documents (337s, etc.) ever filed with the FAA on a specific airplane?

[Yetti]

y'alls google fu is weak.   https://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/aircraft_certification/aircraft_registry/copies_aircraft_records

[MikeOH]

17 hours ago, Yetti said:

I doubt anyone could.   There were three AD on the gear in rapid succession.   So the write is usually "replaced oil gears"   Unless it says which one and what materials then you just have to guess.

Correct.

IIRC (it's been many years ago), between the multiple ADs, and WHEN the engine was apart relative to the AD's date requirements, we couldn't confirm which gears.  And, I wasn't going to purchase based on a 'guess' and the seller wasn't going to pay for the inspection.  Life went on...

[MikeOH]

8 hours ago, M20Doc said:

Remove the right magneto, light and mirror to examine the the pump body.

@M20Doc

You are the expert!  My admittedly long ago failing memory of the the "oil pump gears" ADs was one of gear material: namely, if the gears were of sintered metal construction they needed to be replaced.  If true, how does examining the pump body render a decision on what the gear material is?

I might have bought that plane if the inspection only involved removing the mag!  I was told the whole accessory case had to be removed in order to examine the gears.  (Truth be told, I'm MUCH happier with the plane I bought vs. that one.  So, it all worked out)

Thanks!

[EricJ]

7 hours ago, Fly Boomer said:

I assumed “the CD” meant the one with all documents (337s, etc.) ever filed with the FAA on a specific airplane?

You can download them directly now.    No need to order the CD.    Set up a free account and download whatever you want.

https://cares.faa.gov/home

[MikeOH]

1 hour ago, M20Doc said:

Oil pump body design is a good indicator of gear replacement AD compliance.  The old pump bodies were two piece, some had a large cotter pin holding the idler shaft in place.  Current gears go in a one piece pump body with spinning shafts as part of the gear and hence no cotter pin required.

@M20Doc

As an indicator or as proof of compliance?

Again, my recollection is the original pumps (old style bodies) had ‘good’ gears but if the engine had been apart the gears could have been replaced with ‘bad’ sintered gears back into the old bodies. Hence, the issue is if the logs don’t reflect what exact gears were used.

The time period came into play because after the sintered gears were purged from the supply chain any later replacements could only have been with ‘good’ gears; it matters when the engine was apart!

The above is NOT to be taken as the absolute truth; just what I remember from my experience.

[Mcstealth]

23 hours ago, PT20J said:

Not too much pressure or you can damage things. I put a length of vinyl hose over the vent and blow with my lungs while spraying soapy water on the cap. 

I assume with full tanks?

[zehutiman]

I utilized Savvy services for several Prebuys.  They perform a lot of the legwork and, coordinate with the mx facility.  If it’s your first time getting involved in purchasing an airplane, they’re a helpful resource.  It’s nice to get a second opinion on some squawks that arise from the Prebuy.

[Mcstealth]

1 hour ago, zehutiman said:

I utilized Savvy services for several Prebuys.  They perform a lot of the legwork and, coordinate with the mx facility.  If it’s your first time getting involved in purchasing an airplane, they’re a helpful resource.  It’s nice to get a second opinion on some squawks that arise from the Prebuy.

First I've heard of that. Thank you. 

[wombat]

I recently bought a plane and used Savvy's prebuy as well.

The biggest thing they did was to find several shops near the aircraft and contact them about doing the prebuy. 

I'm not unsatisfied, but not entirely confident I really got a good deal.  But it's like insurance...  Unless things go horribly wrong, it's a waste of money.