toomany Posted January 23, 2023 Report Posted January 23, 2023 anybody have any input on led landing lights for the bravo? id like to get the most powerful beams available relative to illuminating distance. if anyone knows of best mfr's and model #'s any help os greatly appreciated Quote
philiplane Posted January 23, 2023 Report Posted January 23, 2023 (edited) I usually install the Xevision HID lights. But the new Whelen Parmetheus Pro is a good second choice. While the G3 initially has a few more lumens, the Pro maintains a higher lever after 5 minutes of run time. You'll find the comparisons in the "output data" tab here: https://flywat.com/products/parmetheus™-g3 The yellow line is the G3 and the white line is the Pro. When you compare lumens, it's important to compare after the lamp has been on for 10-15 minutes. Most LED's lose lumens the longer they run, due to heat sink issues. Cheaper LED's get hot and lose brightness faster. That's why the Pro costs more than the G3. It's intended for more commercial applications where it will be on longer. Edited January 23, 2023 by philiplane Quote
slowflyin Posted January 23, 2023 Report Posted January 23, 2023 I'll be upgrading to WAT's G3. We have a resident expert. Calling @OSUAV8TER 1 Quote
OSUAV8TER Posted January 23, 2023 Report Posted January 23, 2023 Thanks guys! @toomany I am a Whelen Aerospace Technologies dealer and I carry the new G3 LED landing and taxi light. They are the best LED lamps on the market for the money and after flying behind it and the Whelen Parmetheus Pro, I believe the G3 is sligthly better. The graphics previously provided were taken in a static lab so when you get airflow over the lamp and the lens, it will help reduce that draw down by cooling the lamp. Below are some photos of the G3 in action on various other airplanes. I have them in stock and ready to ship at $299 each. Orders over $500 ship free and I do not charge sales tax. If you have any issues I fix them for you. I would put one G3 LED landing light in each wing and a G3 LED taxi light next to it. The landing light G3 has a 12 degree spot light while the taxi light has a 50 degree flood light. It will work out very nicely for you. https://www.gallagheraviationllc.com/WAT-14V28V-G3-PAR-36-LED-Landing-Light_p_189.html <-- Link to the G3 LED landing light on my website https://www.gallagheraviationllc.com/WAT-14V28V-G3-PAR-36-LED-Taxi-Light_p_190.html <-- Link to the G3 LED taxi light on my website gallagheraviationllc@gmail.com <-- Email me 1-833-425-5288 <-- Call me Quote
PT20J Posted January 23, 2023 Report Posted January 23, 2023 I installed the G3 PAR36 landing and taxi lights in my M20J and they are really bright. I'm very pleased with them. I purchased them from James @OSUAV8TER and he gives great service. Skip Quote
philiplane Posted January 24, 2023 Report Posted January 24, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, OSUAV8TER said: . The graphics previously provided were taken in a static lab so when you get airflow over the lamp and the lens, it will help reduce that draw down by cooling the lamp. 1-833-425-5288 <-- Call me The Bravo lamps are behind a lens in the wing with no cooling airflow. Heat rejection is a problem in this application. Edited January 24, 2023 by philiplane Quote
OSUAV8TER Posted January 24, 2023 Report Posted January 24, 2023 2 minutes ago, philiplane said: The Bravo lamps are behind a lens in the wing with no cooling airflow. Heat rejection is a problem in this application. You'd be surprised but cooler air gets in there. An aerospace engineer at AeroLEDs proved it to me. The Pro came from Lopresti and was renamed the "Pro" when they merged with Whelen to create Whelen Aerospace Technologies. It's an older more expensive lamp to manufacture. It does dissipate heat better on the back of the lamp but all of those measurements were taken in a static lab with no airflow. AeroLED is particularly bad because they have a very small heat sink. Airflow helps cool it but the heat sink is important. The G3 is a better lamp for the money. The Pro will eventually be totally discontinued and the G3 will take its place as it still has some corporate jet certifications the G3 does not have. Do XeVision lights even carry an STC or PMA? Quote
PT20J Posted January 24, 2023 Report Posted January 24, 2023 Hey James, @OSUAV8TER, not to confuse things, but what's the projected certification timeframe for the PAR46 dual mode landing/taxi lamp and is it G3 technology? Skip Quote
OSUAV8TER Posted January 24, 2023 Report Posted January 24, 2023 25 minutes ago, PT20J said: Hey James, @OSUAV8TER, not to confuse things, but what's the projected certification timeframe for the PAR46 dual mode landing/taxi lamp and is it G3 technology? Skip I'm not sure if they are doing one? There are not very many PAR-46 equipped aircraft out there, the numbers are low. The new Duo requires a lot of new wire run and a new switch so it's not quite the drop in replacement like the G3. Additionally, it's not quite as powerful. It does have a replaceable lens like the Parmetheus and Parmetheus Plus but the G3 has a more durable lens. I'm going to install a pair on the main gear of my Bonanza to try them out. They'll work well if you have a single lamp PAR-36 equipped aircraft (Piper comes to mind) and you want to run new wire and add a 3 way switch. 1 Quote
carusoam Posted January 24, 2023 Report Posted January 24, 2023 11 hours ago, toomany said: anybody have any input on led landing lights for the bravo? id like to get the most powerful beams available relative to illuminating distance. if anyone knows of best mfr's and model #'s any help os greatly appreciated See OSU James… landing lights taxi lights recognition lights and how to keep the annunciator from staying dim or bright…. Best regards, -a- Quote
jetdriven Posted January 24, 2023 Report Posted January 24, 2023 We installed a pair of G3 landing lights in a Bravo and they are very bright. Much more so than the incandescent ones they replaced, and also a lot brighter than the original Parmertheus Whelen lights. Quote
Fly Boomer Posted January 25, 2023 Report Posted January 25, 2023 On 1/23/2023 at 7:08 PM, OSUAV8TER said: Do XeVision lights even carry an STC or PMA? Probably not, but at 300,000 candela, it would be like a xenon strobe that just stays on. Quote
LANCECASPER Posted January 26, 2023 Report Posted January 26, 2023 While it's great to have the extra brightness, the biggest advantage of LED or HID is not having to skin up your hands reaching in there changing to change the GE bulbs when they burn out frequently. . 2 Quote
PT20J Posted January 26, 2023 Report Posted January 26, 2023 1 hour ago, LANCECASPER said: While it's great to have the extra brightness, the biggest advantage of LED or HID is not having to skin up your hands reaching in there changing to change the GE bulbs when they burn out frequently. . Yeah, that’s actually what drove me to LEDs. You would think they would be designed to be changed by removing the lens and extracting them from the front. But it’s a Mooney and the basic design philosophy seems to be “we hate maintainers.” Quote
philiplane Posted January 26, 2023 Report Posted January 26, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, Fly Boomer said: Probably not, but at 300,000 candela, it would be like a xenon strobe that just stays on. Some of the Xevision products are OEM lights on Kodiak and Diamond aircraft. I have used them to convert Mooneys via FAA Field Approvals. These HID lights have 550,000 or greater candlepower, so they are five times brighter than the incandescent lamps they replace. FWIW, even the early Cirrus Aircraft (2001-2013) used Lopresti HID's, which are just rebranded Phillips automotive products. In 2014, Cirrus switched to dual rectangular Whelen LED's which have six LED's per light. Which were half as bright. And didn't last very long. Individual LED's burned out in less than 2 years in service. I've replaced many of them, with the WAT HID kit. Most were just beyond the 3 year warranty. $$$$ Edited January 26, 2023 by philiplane 1 Quote
carusoam Posted January 26, 2023 Report Posted January 26, 2023 The Boom Beam was a popular HID light for Mooneys back in the day… Oddly, it was part of a collection of companies bought by Whelen a few years ago… Best regards, -a- Quote
OSUAV8TER Posted January 26, 2023 Report Posted January 26, 2023 7 minutes ago, carusoam said: The Boom Beam was a popular HID light for Mooneys back in the day… Oddly, it was part of a collection of companies bought by Whelen a few years ago… Best regards, -a- Actually had a M20J owner pick up a PAR-46 G3 because his 22 year old HID BoomBeam had finally worn out. That vintage BoomBeam does somewhere around 200,000 candela power while the G3 LED emits 250,000 candela. When HID work they do a good job but there are power ballast, sensitive lamps, and other components that eventually wear not like LED. They are generally very reliable but not as good as LED. So he'll just run a new power and ground wire and put the G3 in. More simple and less heat. Here is the G3 performing on my Bonanza (granted I have 3x PAR-46 G3 and 2x PAR-36 G3s running in this photo). 1 Quote
carusoam Posted January 26, 2023 Report Posted January 26, 2023 Fantastic drone pic! Funky swept tail feathers on the Bo… Best regards, -a- 1 Quote
OSUAV8TER Posted January 26, 2023 Report Posted January 26, 2023 1 minute ago, carusoam said: Fantastic drone pic! Funky swept tail feathers on the Bo… Best regards, -a- Thanks! I enjoy flying the drone but I don't do it often. Makes for good airplane photos to show you how it looks! When I started providing Whelen these drone images they went out and got a drone for themselves and now you see a lot of their material with drone shots. 1 Quote
Pinecone Posted January 26, 2023 Report Posted January 26, 2023 I hope you have your Part 107 Remote Pilot Certificate. Quote
OSUAV8TER Posted January 26, 2023 Report Posted January 26, 2023 2 minutes ago, Pinecone said: I hope you have your Part 107 Remote Pilot Certificate. I am. Quote
Fly Boomer Posted January 26, 2023 Report Posted January 26, 2023 20 hours ago, philiplane said: Some of the Xevision products are OEM lights on Kodiak and Diamond aircraft. I have used them to convert Mooneys via FAA Field Approvals. These HID lights have 550,000 or greater candlepower, so they are five times brighter than the incandescent lamps they replace. FWIW, even the early Cirrus Aircraft (2001-2013) used Lopresti HID's, which are just rebranded Phillips automotive products. In 2014, Cirrus switched to dual rectangular Whelen LED's which have six LED's per light. Which were half as bright. And didn't last very long. Individual LED's burned out in less than 2 years in service. I've replaced many of them, with the WAT HID kit. Most were just beyond the 3 year warranty. $$$$ I did not realize that the Xevision HIDs put out that much light. Their LEDs have active cooling (fan). How are the HIDs cooled? Quote
philiplane Posted January 27, 2023 Report Posted January 27, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Fly Boomer said: I did not realize that the Xevision HIDs put out that much light. Their LEDs have active cooling (fan). How are the HIDs cooled? HID's do not need cooling, they run cooler than an LED. LED's have to shed the heat generated by the diodes through the mounting base, so you need some airflow. HID's emit most of their heat from the lens, same as an incandescent. The remaining heat comes from the remote mounted ballast, and it is a fraction of what comes from an LED assembly. The biggest problems with LED's is heat. The chart I posted shows the degradation of light output, and this is due to heat soak of the assembly reducing the light output. So anytime you choose an LED over an HID, check the output after 10 minutes of run time. And the better LED's have better diodes and heat sinks. Whelen has the best LED's right now, and Xevision is working on an even better solution. They've both invested in the right components to make commercial grade lights. Cheap LED's are a waste of time and money. I want the best light so I can see and avoid the deer crossing the dark runway at night. Any HID will have at least 500,000 CP, those are 35 watt rated units. 50 and 85 watt versions are also available. Edited January 27, 2023 by philiplane Quote
affricate Posted January 27, 2023 Report Posted January 27, 2023 AEROLEDS SUNSPOT 4596 LANDING LIGHT 01-1030-4596 I installed 2 of the sunspot landing lights and really like them. While I was as it, I also replaced all other original bravo lights and strobes with LEDs, The Arizona sun is intense, and I really wanted the extra safety with the NAV lights and strobes during the day, too. I got some useful load back and got rid of the extra drain on the electrical system. 2 Quote
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