Moving from a 231 to a Screaming Eagle

[GaryP1007]

Looking for insight from folks who have made a similar transition.  Any gotcha's?  Big differences?  Be careful of.....?

[kortopates]

No gotchas, small difference, easy transition.  I think they get stabler and easier to fly with length. Although I own a K too, I feel the longbody's are easier to land because of the improved stability. The only downside I can think is that its possible to tail strike a longbody, unlike the others - but no need to get the pitch so high and it will never happen if you keep the runway end in sight over the glareshield landing as you should always do. With the 310HP it'll take a little getting acquainted with to avoid getting to fast in the pattern; as you'll be at pattern altitude in no time. But you'll miss the Turbo if you liked to fly in the upper teens. 

Edited April 6, 2022 by kortopates

[LANCECASPER]

The number one thing I noticed in going from a 231 (210hp, 2 blade prop) to a Bravo 25 years ago was the additional right rudder needed going down the runway on take-off. The three bladed 270hp Bravo has rudder trim and you only forget to set it far-right one time.

The Eagle was only rated at 244hp with a two blade prop when it left the factory , so not nearly as big of a deal. In my opinion, part of the STC that brought it up to 310hp (3 blade prop)  should have included the addition of rudder trim. (The Ovation already has rudder trim.)

Get some transition training with a CFI very familiar with long body Mooneys. On Dec 31, 2019 there was an accident with a new owner on his first take-off after purchase in a 310hp Eagle from Johnson County KS (https://data.ntsb.gov/Docket/?NTSBNumber=CEN20FA049). Looking at the videos attached to the docket, if I had to make an educated guess, his seat wasn't locked in place, it slid back on take-off. Perhaps the elevator trim was even too much nose high. The airplane veered off to the right, in a very step climb, and ended up in a departure stall and spin into the ground. It was a tragedy.

Could that have been avoided with some transition training? I don't know. But it's good  to make the first few long body mistakes with an experienced long body instructor sitting next to you, correcting you before it gets away form you.

 

The number one long body insurance claim (Bravo, Ovation, Eagle, Acclaim) is the porpoise, bounce, bounce, prop strike. Be ready to go around if it bounces once or twice. The third time is generally a prop strike. Again training helps you to get your speeds and the sight correct on the approach. 

You're going to love it once you get used to it. 

[carusoam]

Awesome transition…

Going from the most capable plane with limited UL…

To the most capable plane with about 1k#+s of UL…

One has access to the FLs…

The other has a bigger trunk…

If you are current in one, transition to the other… will be a breeze…

See what the max FF has been set at… 27 is normal… 29-30 is probably preferred…. (CHT control)

 

Bring your WnB app, your T/O distance calculator, and be ready to smile… when pushing the throttle forwards…

PP thoughts only, Go TopProp!

Best regards,

-a-

[Mooney 217RN]

I transitioned from an E Model to the Ovation 3.  Landing took work to train for it, flying it is a breeze.  The Screaming Eagle is essentially an Ovation.  I flew a friend's 231 quite a bit.  It wasn't terribly different from the E Model, just a bit more power but more weight.  The biggest issue I see in the transition to this airplane is landing it.  The long bodies are heavy aircraft compared to the light and nimble E,F,J&K models.  You really notice the weight landing.  You have to carry in a good amount of power compared to the predecessors.  A stabilized approach is critical to your successful transaction.

[ziggysanchez]

I went from a 231 to a screaming eagle and the transition was pretty simple. First flight in the eagle I was behind the airplane mostly because of the differences in the panel and equipment. After a couple flights with the unfamiliar panel it too was easy to transition to. I too found landing the long body to be easier than the mid body although it is less forgiving if you happen to not get it right. It's definitely heavier in the controls. The long body definitely seems to be more stable than the mid bodies.  My favorite thing about the eagle over the 231 is engine management. Seemed like I was always having to check and adjust my settings in the 231. In the eagle I can just set it and monitor. Enjoy your new eagle.

[Mufflerbearing]

Truth be told, I have never flown another Mooney than my Screaming Eagle.  I love the simple engine management, ease of flight, it's speed and UL etc. etc. etc.  I thought of looking at a different plane, ie viper jet, Bravo, but always come back to how much I love my Eagle.  For me, nothing else compares.

[Cruiser]

Not a problem but something to focus on, 

the IO550 on the nose pushes the CG forward, do some W&B calculations to see this, After landing and the plane stops flying the nose will want to "drop like a rock" if you don't aggressively hold it off. 

[MarkD34M]

I had about 800 hours in my 231 and now an Ovation. Much has been covered here but you will adjust quickly. Less pilot workload to deal with. No fiddling with throttle on climbout and no cowl flaps to deal with. I'd also suggest the takeoff and climb is better - at least to 7-8000 give or take. The extra horsepower is felt down low. One you lean out, the fuel flows are within a couple of gallons also. Enjoy the new ride!

[StevenL757]

On 4/6/2022 at 6:16 PM, Mooney 217RN said:

You have to carry in a good amount of power compared to the predecessors.

Largely disagree here.  The Ovation will tell you when it no longer wants to fly.  You bleed off power until you’re at flight idle…the goal being arriving at that point in the flare and right before touchdown.  It’s been said that getting the stall warning horn immediately before touchdown will result in a perfect landing…meaning, you have essentially no more speed to lose at that point to make a great landing.  Carrying too much speed lends itself to porpoising and a prop strike if the approach and flare aren’t stabilized.  In other words, you’re forcing the aircraft to the ground by carrying too much speed.

In the Ovation, for ever 1 knot you are fast on touchdown, add 100 feet of runway used to get the airplane stopped.  So, 10 knots fast?  Do the math.

I do like your comment though about a stabilized approach.

Steve

[ilovecornfields]

I agree. An Ovation isn’t that difficult to land.  There’s no magic involved. Just don’t bring it in too fast and try to force it to land.

The best advice I heard for landing these planes is “try not to let it land.” If you came in too fast (and have a long enough runway) just hold it off until it’s ready to stop flying. as @StevenL757 said it will let you know when it’s ready to land. I usually hear the  stall horn about 5-10 seconds before touchdown but I have VGs installed so that seems to make a difference. I do have to warn my passengers, though.

[aviatoreb]

18 hours ago, ilovecornfields said:

I agree. An Ovation isn’t that difficult to land.  There’s no magic involved. Just don’t bring it in too fast and try to force it to land.

The best advice I heard for landing these planes is “try not to let it land.” If you came in too fast (and have a long enough runway) just hold it off until it’s ready to stop flying. as @StevenL757 said it will let you know when it’s ready to land. I usually hear the  stall horn about 5-10 seconds before touchdown but I have VGs installed so that seems to make a difference. I do have to warn my passengers, though.

That's what I say!  Try not to let it land.  Just fly to the runway, reduce the power to zero when the runway is made, and then try and not land but just fly along level to the runway at 3 inches agl trying not to land for as long as possible.  Even then, you don't actually ever land the plane.  It will just settle in and be on the ground when there is no more lift.

[ilovecornfields]

6 hours ago, aviatoreb said:

That's what I say!  Try not to let it land.  Just fly to the runway, reduce the power to zero when the runway is made, and then try and not land but just fly along level to the runway at 3 inches agl trying not to land for as long as possible.  Even then, you don't actually ever land the plane.  It will just settle in and be on the ground when there is no more lift.

I will neither confirm nor deny whether or not I stole that from you. But I’m pretty sure I did. Although I go for 2 inches. Can’t stand sloppy airmanship. ;-)

[aviatoreb]

5 hours ago, ilovecornfields said:

I will neither confirm nor deny whether or not I stole that from you. But I’m pretty sure I did. Although I go for 2 inches. Can’t stand sloppy airmanship. ;-)

Wait.  Wait a second now.  Are you saying someone - you - actually listened to something I said?!!!

2” is living pretty dangerous.  I prefer 3”.  In case of 2” bird poop piles.

… anyway for everyone else / point of what I said is - there’s never a stage where you say ok I feel that lift has run out so I had better land now then push the yoke to land / nope / just keep trying not to land and it will just settle in sometimes so soft you need to think oh I think it may have landed?

Edited April 11, 2022 by aviatoreb