glafaille Posted June 17, 2020 Report Posted June 17, 2020 Came across a plane for sale, obviously a “value” opportunity, not a “forever plane”. Before traveling to see it, the owner, to his credit, disclosed a ding picture. Said his IA has been signing off on it. Normally I would peek into the maintenance manual for guidance, but I don’t have access to one. What do you guys think? The flap can be easily replaced, it’s the wing that bothers me but then again, maybe I’m over reacting and it’s not critical. Quote
glafaille Posted June 17, 2020 Author Report Posted June 17, 2020 Had a little trouble with the picture. I think I got right now. Quote
RLCarter Posted June 17, 2020 Report Posted June 17, 2020 Just now, glafaille said: Had a little trouble with the picture. I think I got right now. Nope, not yet Quote
glafaille Posted June 17, 2020 Author Report Posted June 17, 2020 Hmmmm. Working on my end. It’s a jpeg file. Quote
RLCarter Posted June 17, 2020 Report Posted June 17, 2020 If you have an IA, show them the photo seeing how they will be the one signing it off, not all IA’s are created equal 2 Quote
N201MKTurbo Posted June 17, 2020 Report Posted June 17, 2020 The maintenance manual says minor dents in the wing skin are OK. It doesn’t say what a minor dent is. I say it is minor. 5 Quote
Yetti Posted June 17, 2020 Report Posted June 17, 2020 There seems to be alot going on with that wing. Might be the reflections, but it does not look smooth like it should. The fuel tank panel looks wonky too. Quote
carusoam Posted June 17, 2020 Report Posted June 17, 2020 I know there is a mirror image for that one.... If you go off the end of the runway on the centerline.... There are two lights right about that high.... they are a set of REILs. The wing gets taller as you go out towards the end... So... there is a dent there... but, it is far enough back from the leading edge it is not anywhere near the critical split zone... Get a good look at it to see if the new shape altered the leading edge at all... (this would be more serious) Open the nearby panels to see if you can flatten it out... put it back close to the original shape... (This would erase all the seriousness) Go to the other wing and see how bad the mirror image is... The frangible lights are frangible, but they weigh enough to leave a small dent like that... the light probably broke and fell over... Now... take a look at the flap... it looks like the wing took the initial hit... but the flap looks like it may have finished the job.... PP guesses only, no personal experience with sheet metal forming... but I’ve seen a few pairs of frangible lights lying around... over the years. Since were looking at what can be done better.... is that a Zerk missing from the MLG? I put some arrows on the pic... for discussion points... Best regards, -a- 1) highest arrow... Check the leading edge for straightness... or dent affects... 2) next arrow points at the big dent... 3) next arrow down points at the mark on the flap... see if the flap got damaged... What is that mark? 4) Bonus... is that a missing grease zerk? 2 Quote
tigers2007 Posted June 17, 2020 Report Posted June 17, 2020 Hah mine has similar dents from someone hitting something without reporting it. It could have been like that for 10 years 20, 40, or even 50 years. None of the IA’s really made a big deal out of it. IIRC Mooney doesn’t have an allowable damage specification for these. Quote
47U Posted June 17, 2020 Report Posted June 17, 2020 Odd that the gear door looks pristine. In my opinion, that is a wing skin waiting to be replaced. Sooner or later, the A&P (and/or IA) is going to say, “no.” There are places in TX that do that sort of work. Good sheet metal craftsmen produce artwork. Choose carefully. tom Quote
RLCarter Posted June 17, 2020 Report Posted June 17, 2020 Just now, 47U said: Odd that the gear door looks pristine. In my opinion, that is a wing skin waiting to be replaced. Sooner or later, the A&P (and/or IA) is going to say, “no.” There are places in TX that do that sort of work. Good sheet metal craftsmen produce artwork. Choose carefully. tom Gear door might have been destroyed and replaced? Quote
kortopates Posted June 17, 2020 Report Posted June 17, 2020 I know there is a mirror image for that one.... If you go off the end of the runway on the centerline.... There are two lights right about that high.... they are a set of REILs. The wing gets taller as you go out towards the end... So... there is a dent there... but, it is far enough back from the leading edge it is not anywhere near the critical split zone... Get a good look at it to see if the new shape altered the leading edge at all... (this would be more serious) Open the nearby panels to see if you can flatten it out... put it back close to the original shape... (This would erase all the seriousness) Go to the other wing and see how bad the mirror image is... The frangible lights are frangible, but they weigh enough to leave a small dent like that... the light probably broke and fell over... Now... take a look at the flap... it looks like the wing took the initial hit... but the flap looks like it may have finished the job.... PP guesses only, no personal experience with sheet metal forming... but I’ve seen a few pairs of frangible lights lying around... over the years. Since were looking at what can be done better.... is that a Zerk missing from the MLG? I put some arrows on the pic... for discussion points... Best regards, -a- 1) highest arrow... Check the leading edge for straightness... or dent affects... 2) next arrow points at the big dent... 3) next arrow down points at the mark on the flap... see if the flap got damaged... What is that mark? 4) Bonus... is that a missing grease zerk? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote
Andy95W Posted June 17, 2020 Report Posted June 17, 2020 My prediction is that the wing dent is the least of that airplane's problems. 6 Quote
ArtVandelay Posted June 17, 2020 Report Posted June 17, 2020 Odd that the gear door looks pristine. In my opinion, that is a wing skin waiting to be replaced. Sooner or later, the A&P (and/or IA) is going to say, “no.” There are places in TX that do that sort of work. Good sheet metal craftsmen produce artwork. Choose carefully. tom Some body filler and a paint job would fix it, no need to replace skin. 1 Quote
ArtVandelay Posted June 17, 2020 Report Posted June 17, 2020 My prediction is that the wing dent is the least of that airplane's problems. +1. Id start by carefully looking for corrosion and filling fuel tanks to check for leaks. 1 Quote
Guest Posted June 17, 2020 Report Posted June 17, 2020 If there are no cracks in the skin and no damage to adjacent stringers, ribs or spars, it’s a minor dent. With no access the to back to try work it out, fill it with “aerodynamic filler” paint it and fly on. I would sign it out. Clarence Quote
glafaille Posted June 17, 2020 Author Report Posted June 17, 2020 Thank you gentlemen for your opinions. It appears that most of you think it is likely to continue to pass inspection as it is. Quote
cliffy Posted June 18, 2020 Report Posted June 18, 2020 (edited) We had a guy here a couple of years ago who had a few small dents in his airplane and the Feds did a ramp check and grounded his airplane. I believe he wound up scraping it. As mentioned above, there's a lot more going on here than just that dent. Be careful- be VERY careful! Lots of red flags here for me. How did the dent get there? Why the "new" gear door? Why the condition of the paint? (total neglect?) What I see goes a lot deeper than the surface. Edited June 18, 2020 by cliffy 1 Quote
McMooney Posted June 18, 2020 Report Posted June 18, 2020 heat + aluminum = smaller or no dent, just sayin 1 Quote
Pasturepilot Posted June 18, 2020 Report Posted June 18, 2020 Anyone ever try a paintless dent remover kit from Amazon? I doubt it'd remove the dent altogether but might minimize the need for filler. 1 Quote
Greg Ellis Posted June 18, 2020 Report Posted June 18, 2020 @glafaille I see you are located in Tyler, Texas. That is just a stone's throw from Longview where an excellent Mooney mechanic hangs out. I would definitely send this to Don Maxwell in Longview and get his opinion on this. He does not visit this forum so he won't see your post but he could offer some insight into this as well. If the plane is located in Texas, there is a slight chance that he may have worked on it at one time or another. Although you have received some excellent advice from this forum as usual. 1 Quote
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