Wing Leveler, Turn and Bank coordinator

[Luxuryairtravel]

I just purchased my Mooney M20E Super 21. So the turn and bank is inop! I believe it’s the Brittain instrument and was overhauled 10+ yrs ago. What are my options? Overhaul? Replace? Take out completely? My panel needs some work too. Dynon system? I’d rather have the least amount of down time. Do I have to have it at all if I’m going to get new avionics in a yr?

Thanks for any assistance.

Mark

[chriscalandro]

If it's the Brittian one I think your options are pretty limited.  It also should be running your wing leveler.

 

I think the lesson I've learned when it comes to replacing and redoing things in the panel is don't do it in pieces unless you are 100% sure of your future upgrade path, or do it all at the same time.

 

What about it doesn't work?  It should be electric.  Check fuses and connections.

Edited February 23, 2020 by chriscalandro

[Luxuryairtravel]

13 minutes ago, chriscalandro said:

If it's the Brittian one I think your options are pretty limited.  It also should be running your wing leveler.

 

I think the lesson I've learned when it comes to replacing and redoing things in the panel is don't do it in pieces unless you are 100% sure of your future upgrade path, or do it all at the same time.

 

What about it doesn't work?  It should be electric.  Check fuses and connections.

I’m trouble shooting what the issue is. It’s Tango Uniform! Can I just disconnect and fly? Day VFR should be no issue. I need a new panel, as far as instruments are concern, I’m debating on Dynon or old school.

[chriscalandro]

I suppose so, It’s not required for day VFR. Placard and log entry. 
 

does it make any sound at all with the master switch on?

[Nukemzzz]

Since you have the pitch adjust knob on the yoke then I believe your version of the PC wing leveler system uses a separate gyro hidden against the firewall behind your panel. You can see it when you pull the top panel off in front of the windshield. 

The M20e 67’ model moved the pitch trim to a knob on the turn and bank  Prior was on the yoke  

you don’t need a turn and bank for VFR. I’d put an inop sticker on it and carry on for now. 

Edited February 23, 2020 by Nukemzzz

[chriscalandro]

Just now, Nukemzzz said:

Since you have the pitch adjust knob on the yoke then I believe your version of the PC wing leveler system uses a separate gyro hidden against the firewall behind your panel. You can see it when you pull the top panel off in front of the windshield. 

you don’t need a turn and bank for VFR. I’d put an inop sticker on it and carry on for now. 

I think you may be correct about the wing leveler. On my 67 it’s built into the turn/bank. 
I did think the older ones had the gyro in the tail. 

[Luxuryairtravel]

No sound at all. Great feedback and plan on flying and enjoying my new Mooney to me! 
 

Off topic, what would be the first thing you would do to an older Mooney? The best bang for your buck?

[chriscalandro]

before redoing the panel?
 

Alternator conversion. 
pcu5000 governor

Sky-Tec starter. (I didn’t want to believe this one but it’s worth it for the hot starts alone)

 

if you do all of them at the same time you can get away for reasonable cost and have current technology accessories. 

Edited February 23, 2020 by chriscalandro

[Nukemzzz]

I personally added an EDM-730 engine monitor. First flight with it is actually tomorrow!

im a big believer in being able to quickly see what’s up with individual cylinders when the engine makes wonky sounds. Also, fuel flow is good for keeping a better eye on fuel avail. Lastly, setting mixture should be much improved. 

i bought a 66’ M20e in Dec. 

Edited February 23, 2020 by Nukemzzz

[chriscalandro]

Just now, Nukemzzz said:

I personally added an EDM-730 engine monitor. First flight with it is actually tomorrow!

im a big believer in being able to quickly see what’s up with individual cylinders when the engine makes wonky sounds. Also, fuel flow is good for keeping a better eye on fuel avail. Lastly, setting mixture should be much improved. 

i bought a 66’ M20e in Dec. 

If he’s going to redo the panel he should wait and get a 900 or 930. Then he can replace the old stuff. 

[Nukemzzz]

Just now, chriscalandro said:

If he’s going to redo the panel he should wait and get a 900 or 930. Then he can replace the old stuff. 

Fair point. However, think it’s about a $7500 premium for the primary JPI and I still like having the mechanical gages personally. That’s why I didn’t go for it.
 

My plan is to rearrange the current gages, retain the primary, then add basic GPS for IFR legalities and an ADS-B transponder. 

To each his own. But I don’t want to add $30k of instruments to a $30k plane and i like the vintage feel of the older gages. But I did want to modernize the engine monitor for awareness and safety. 

[redcatcher27]

2 hours ago, Nukemzzz said:

Fair point. However, think it’s about a $7500 premium for the primary JPI and I still like having the mechanical gages personally. That’s why I didn’t go for it.
 

My plan is to rearrange the current gages, retain the primary, then add basic GPS for IFR legalities and an ADS-B transponder. 

To each his own. But I don’t want to add $30k of instruments to a $30k plane and i like the vintage feel of the older gages. But I did want to modernize the engine monitor for awareness and safety. 

I love the aesthetic pleasure, form and feel of the vintage gauges. That's why I am going with the CGR-30 Combo for my engine monitor and replacement for all of my engine instruments. https://iflyei.com/product/cgr-30-combo/

[0TreeLemur]

The Brittain T&B is both electric and vacuum driven.   They can be had on online auction sites in working condition for several hundred dollars.  What you need depends on the year of your a/c.

You should spend some time searching these pages.  There are many, many folks who in the past asked the same question you asked, including me.   Learn from their stories.

Cutting and installing a new panel is relatively inexpensive if you have some skills.

A primary engine monitor is not prohibitively expensive to install if you can find a certified mechanic who will let you do some of the work.

[Yetti]

The Dynon has a certified engine monitor.   If you are going that way.   Go that way.

[CSmith]

Hi Mark, this is Cecilia Henderson from Brittain.  Please call me at (918)836-7701 or email me at support@brittainautopilots.com.  I would like to assist you with the turn coordinator if possible. 

[McMooney]

On 2/22/2020 at 9:30 PM, Luxuryairtravel said:

I just purchased my Mooney M20E Super 21. So the turn and bank is inop! I believe it’s the Brittain instrument and was overhauled 10+ yrs ago. What are my options? Overhaul? Replace? Take out completely? My panel needs some work too. Dynon system? I’d rather have the least amount of down time. Do I have to have it at all if I’m going to get new avionics in a yr?

Thanks for any assistance.

Mark

It can be overhauled, call brittain.

[chriscalandro]

20 minutes ago, McMooney said:

It can be overhauled, call brittain.

Did they give you a quote?

[McMooney]

 

46 minutes ago, chriscalandro said:

Did they give you a quote?

no, but they will give you the name of a shop which does the overhaul.  you may be able to find the name with a search here on mooneyspace.

[carusoam]

Putting a reminder here...

Cecilia Henderson is the Brittain person and can be found here @CSmith...   or support@brittainautopilots.com

including search terms for when somebody is searching for the brittain guy gal person... 

Cecilia has successfully kept the doors open at Brittain.  
 

Some day, Cecilia, when you get time... it would be great to get an update on your current products and services...

I see three people responding to @H.B.Avionic Parts sale list... for one group of Brittain parts...

Best regards,

-a-

 

 

[hammdo]

That would be great! I have the PC Wing leveler and TC in mine and would like to know about doing the auto pilot upgrade...

-Don