3 blade props. What do you think?

[sleepingsquirrel]

Yes, three blades is sexier than two blades, but four blades would be better!

North American had one heck of a marketing department!

[FlyDave]

Quote: sleepingsquirrel

Yes, three blades is sexier than two blades, but four blades would be better!

North American had one heck of a marketing department!

[sleepingsquirrel]

My Dad took that photo, he's 87 .

[drpep]

I have a three blade hartzell on my 67 E Mooney. I was curious about the clearance as a result of the comments from this thread so I measured it today and got a measurement of 10 1/4 inches. Comparing my experience owning a 2 blade 76 F and then the 67E I would say that the climb performance is better with a 3 blade. I am at sea level and my climb performance single pilot is  around 1100ft per minute at 100mph.

Philip

[Mooney13]

If anyone is interested I have a 3 blade MT with white and red scimitar blades for sale,  complete with composite spinner for an E or F as is or it can be installed on a J with a different spinner. Asking $5,500 plus shipping

Clarerence Beintema

clarence@tricityaero.com

519-580 -1572

[Alan Fox]

Whenever I see Mooney (early) with a three blade , It screams  THIS PLANE WAS ON ITS BELLY !!!!!!

[orangemtl]

This is a cold forum, I know but:  any information regarding 4 blade props?  I've got a perfectly good 3 blade on my aircraft, and need a new, expensive propeller like I need a draining sore, but for the pure theoretical question: MT propellers has an STC'd 4 blade for at least later model Mooneys.  Besides the 'gosh, that's good looking' aspect: are they indeed quieter?  Seems that more blades improve climb, but decrease maximum cruise.

Someone educate me on this. Thanks!

[fantom]

Quote: orangemtl

....MT propellers has an STC'd 4 blade for at least later model Mooneys. 

[sleepingsquirrel]

Wow! Four blades! One step closer to my 10 GPH Mooney Mustang clone. If I could just get the third wheel in the right place.

[AlexR]

There seems to be some confusion...

 

Alex -

Sorry, I'm logged in as you. Post deleted.  

Ross

[Shadrach]

There seems to be some confusion in this thread about diameter and allowed diameter.  AFAIK all metal props for Mooneys both 2 and 3 blade have the same dimeter specs. If you measure your prop, you would hope that it falls within those specs. When a blade is OHd, it can and some times does get shortened a tad. Most Hartzles have enough meet on them to be OH'd 3 times. I had several 2-3 mm gouges on the face of mine after a FOD encounter. It was OH'd by East Coast Propellor Services. They told me it has at least 1 more OH left on the blades.   Little to no benefit for a standard metal 3 blade on a 200HP Mooney. Maybe a bit more climb and perhaps increased drag in the pattern (I'm skeptical of  the significance this).

[jetdriven]

The Cardinal RG gained 100 FPM of climb maybe a little more but lost a solid 4-5 knots true with the 3-blade Hartzell, from the 2 blade McCauley.  And when he dropped the wrench in the blades after changing the oil, it was 8K for a new prop instead of 5.   I am not totally sure but shortening the blades is allowed in overhaul but not if it has been prop struck enough to warrant a teardown, which is nothing at all.  Then the prop is scrap.  They scrapped his with 3 gouges in the rear face of 2 blades.

That said, Im not sure why people want 3 blades on a 4 cylinder Mooney.  Mostly its a loser but hey, looks "sexy" on the ramp if thats your thing.  Bragging rights.

[FoxMike]

Michael,

A four blade MT is STCed to the TLS.  It was done in Europe but can be installed on US airplanes.  The advantages are shorter TO distance, less noise, little better climb.  Disadvantages less cruise, more maintenance cost.  One of the folks at Mooney told me they tried one on a factory TLS and were not impressed.  If you have known ice you would lose that certification unless you wanted to do the testing.  The Acclaim would require a complete a do over of testing.  What you have now is pretty good and more blades is not going to help much unless you want shorter TO distance.    

Walt

[jetdriven]

I think thats a certification issue.  Supposedly a 172 with a flat tire and a flat strut wont hit the prop either.  Bet there is not much room in that case.

Quote: JimR

Years ago, when the MAPA Log was still a black and white publication, there was an in flight close up photograph on the front cover of a Mooney that was landed gear down but without a nose wheel.  Apparently someone had forgotten to install the cotter pin on the axle nut after maintenance and the nut worked it's way loose in flight and the entire nose wheel fell off.  I remember the article saying that the prop did not strike upon touch down, but it had to have been close.  So, with proper piloting technique, you should be ok by a comfortable margin with a nose gear blowout upon landing. 

Jim 

[orangemtl]

Quote: FoxMike

Michael,

A four blade MT is STCed to the TLS.  It was done in Europe but can be installed on US airplanes.  The advantages are shorter TO distance, less noise, little better climb.  Disadvantages less cruise, more maintenance cost.  One of the folks at Mooney told me they tried one on a factory TLS and were not impressed.  If you have known ice you would lose that certification unless you wanted to do the testing.  The Acclaim would require a complete a do over of testing.  What you have now is pretty good and more blades is not going to help much unless you want shorter TO distance.    

Walt

[Awful_Charlie]

I've got the standard 3 blade on the front of my TLS which is coming up for overhaul in a year or two.  I'm seriously considering the 4 blade MT, as in Europe noise is quite an issue, but more significantly, the 10 lb weight saving on the front means I can lose one of the 6lb charlie weights in the tail - getting rid of 16lbs of weight and each end of the aircraft is going to be a good thing, and the extra couple of gallons or crate of wine is always useful!

I would be disappointed if the cruis speed dropped by more than a knots or two, although they say on http://www.mt-propeller.com/en/entw/stcs/mooney_5.htm that it should pick up that amount.

The loss of FIKI would make it a no-go item, however the pic shows it fitted to a TKS equipped machine, but it might of course be a 'no hazard' TKS install - maybe I'l have to give MT a call on that)

Ben

[M016576]

Quote: jetdriven

That said, Im not sure why people want 3 blades on a 4 cylinder Mooney.  Mostly its a loser but hey, looks "sexy" on the ramp if thats your thing.  Bragging rights.

[John Pleisse]

Quote: M016576

 

+1.

[scottfromiowa]

My reply is...No reply.

[scottfromiowa]

On second thought.  Why don't you Non vintage guys go start a link in Modern Mooney's on why 3-blade props are such a bad idea in a four cylinder Mooney?  Then maybe you J drivers could get up to +1,000.  That would be awesome.

[scottfromiowa]

Double post.

[Shadrach]

Scott, what kind of climb do you see with your E?  I've been told that they are one of the best from SL to 4K. My F with a 2 blade is good for about 1000FPM @ gross on a standard day and will easily exceed 1200 when light. In the winter I've seen better than 1400 to 2K... 

[rbridges]

What kind of climb difference do you see in 3 vs 2 blade?  I've seen it mentioned several times that cruise suffers by a knot or two.  Personally, I'd rather have better cruise vs. climb, but I don't do lots of cross country flying so I may be speaking out of ignorance.

[scottfromiowa]

800-900fpm reduced (by me) as I climb at 120MPH up to 5,000.  Reduces over 5,000 but still over 600 with my speed at 120mph up to my standard altitude of 6500-7500.

[scottfromiowa]

This weekend at D25 there was a Bravo (3-blade) mine and a J.  Yes Jet Driven you are correct my plane DID look sexier on the ramp than the J (of course that's IMO) and yes ramp appeal "IS" important and yes my plane looked "tiny" next to the A36 with tip tanks.  There it was standing about a mile high on it's gear with my old '66 next to her.  Porsche compared to Lexus.  I like my "Porsche".  So do most Vintage pilots on Mooney Space.  That said, calling my planes prop a loser, saying 3-blade prop guys are vain and valuing "bragging rights" pretty much ticks me off.  The reasons for putting a 3-blade prop on a 4-cyl Mooney are out there.  The reasons for sticking with a stock 2-blade prop are there too.  At this point if you don't "get it"...that's O.K.  I don't "get" why people spent a LOT of money upgrading in other areas, but I don't "ASSUME" that they are "doing it" for bragging rights when there are likely other reasons...reduced ground run, climb performance and others stated in this Vintage Mooneys (pre-J models) link.