New Gizmo Thread

[Marauder]

I thought I would post a thread that might help others looking for gizmos related to aviation needs. One of the challenges I have is keeping the cabin warm to soften the transition from cold to start up for the gyros and electronics. I have been using Golden Rods which are used inside of safes to keep moisture down. I have 3 in the plane in the winter and they seem to warm up the cabin a little bit but certainly keep moisture at bay.

I found a new product that is apparently used by boaters to keep their cabins mold free. Bought one and currently trying it out in my Mooney. Looks well made by our friends in Canada. I like it is an active air mover and will circulate warm air in the plane. The unit is called a Caframo Stor Dry. Will post updates over the next weeks as I see how it does.

[Bennett]

I have been using an older version of this unit in my sailboat, and it works very well. I keep one in the main cabin, and one in the forward cabin. No mildew ever, and nothing feels damp I find the tops to be something more than warm, and I am careful to make sure that nothing touches the surface of the units.

[Oscar Avalle]

Looks like a great solution. Do you keep it on all the time?

[Marauder]

Looks like a great solution. Do you keep it on all the time?

The instructions say that it turns on at 45 and off at 65 degrees. I will find out later this week how it is fairing.

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[Oscar Avalle]

Please let us know

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[Hank]

 

The instructions say that it turns on at 45 and off at 65 degrees. I will find out later this week how it is fairing.

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So how do you get your cockpit temp to 45° in the winter??? My hangar is unheated and mostly uninsulated.

[Marauder]

  The instructions say that it turns on at 45 and off at 65 degrees. I will find out later this week how it is fairing.

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So how do you get your cockpit temp to 45° in the winter??? My hangar is unheated and mostly uninsulated.

It turns on when the temp in the plane drops below 45° and will turn off if it warms up to 65°. So, I'm expecting it to be running most of the winter.

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[Guitarmaster]

I have a small ceramic heater sitting on the hatrack. Keeps the cabin at about 70 degrees.

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[PTK]

So I'm trying to get my brain around this Caframo Stor Dry. I guess I'm unclear as to what the goal is. 

The dew point temp, by definition, never exceeds ambient temp. When equal we have maximum saturation. When ambient temp cools to below dew point condensation has to occur, again by definition, in order to remove moisture from the air. All this happens at above freezing ambient temps when the air contains a healthy amount of moisture. Hence I can see this device working at above freezing temps and dew points which is what it's designed to do.

It follows that very cold air at below freezing does not contain a lot of moisture. So if the goal is to heat the cabin by raising ambient temp, I don't see it working very effectively at sub freezing temps. It's designed to keep ambient temps above dew point. I don't see it being able to keep up heating a cabin from very cold subfreezing ambient temps. 

Just my opinion.

 

[Marauder]

So I'm trying to get my brain around this Caframo Stor Dry. I guess I'm unclear as to what the goal is. 

The dew point temp, by definition, never exceeds ambient temp. When equal we have maximum saturation. When ambient temp cools to below dew point condensation has to occur, again by definition, in order to remove moisture from the air. All this happens at above freezing ambient temps when the air contains a healthy amount of moisture. Hence I can see this device working at above freezing temps and dew points which is what it's designed to do.

It follows that very cold air at below freezing does not contain a lot of moisture. So if the goal is to heat the cabin by raising ambient temp, I don't see it working very effectively at sub freezing temps. It's designed to keep ambient temps above dew point. I don't see it being able to keep up heating a cabin from very cold subfreezing ambient temps. 

Just my opinion.

 

Did I mention Garmin made it?

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[Marauder]

So I'm trying to get my brain around this Caframo Stor Dry. I guess I'm unclear as to what the goal is. 

The dew point temp, by definition, never exceeds ambient temp. When equal we have maximum saturation. When ambient temp cools to below dew point condensation has to occur, again by definition, in order to remove moisture from the air. All this happens at above freezing ambient temps when the air contains a healthy amount of moisture. Hence I can see this device working at above freezing temps and dew points which is what it's designed to do.

It follows that very cold air at below freezing does not contain a lot of moisture. So if the goal is to heat the cabin by raising ambient temp, I don't see it working very effectively at sub freezing temps. It's designed to keep ambient temps above dew point. I don't see it being able to keep up heating a cabin from very cold subfreezing ambient temps. 

Just my opinion.

 

I'm in a meeting, but will try to answer it more fully later. If you own a safe, you would know what these products do. Warms the air to prevent condensation. Not heats but warms it to a point that won't allow condensation to form.

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[PTK]

I thought you were looking to warm the cabin. I didn't realize you were fighting musty mold or mildew. I misunderstood what your goal was.

My point was that in the dead of winter subfreezing temps there's hardly any moisture in the air. I keep a small ceramic heater in the cabin during the winter which I control through my GSM box. Makes cabin nice and comfortable.

[Marauder]

6 hours ago, PTK said:

I thought you were looking to warm the cabin. I didn't realize you were fighting musty mold or mildew. I misunderstood what your goal was.

My point was that in the dead of winter subfreezing temps there's hardly any moisture in the air. I keep a small ceramic heater in the cabin during the winter which I control through my GSM box. Makes cabin nice and comfortable.

 

The GoldenRod Dehumidifier is designed to handle humidity from the interior of your safe, locker or cabinet and protects against rust by generating a low level of heat that removes moisture from the air. More specifically, they warm up the air enough to keep the temp and dew points far enough apart to prevent condensation.

Unfortunately they are designed for more air tight containers and use low wattage (8 or 10) to provide a slight bit of heat in the enclosure. To offset that, I had been using three 18" versions and it is sufficient to keep the cockpit dry and provide a little bit of warmth in the cabin. On a 20° day, the interior might be a balmy 40° but there won't be any moisture. The pain in the arse part was pulling them all out before flying. Before I was using them, I sometimes would arrive to find the interior "cold and calmly".

Since I was only throwing 30 watts at the cockpit, I thought I would try something designed for a larger open area. That is what these Caframo units are designed to do. It won't heat the cabin to 80°, but should be able to keep it closer to 50° or 60° which would be perfect.

More when I get a chance to see how it does. One problem with older ceramic heaters is that many don't have a "tip" shutoff. So, if it gets knocked over by accident, there is a higher likelihood of fire. I have a ceramic heater and when I am there, I will toss it in for the time I am pre-flighting or getting ready to fly.

A Goldenrod:

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[Marauder]

I'm adding another gizmo to my thread. You boaters probably seen this one as well.

This gizmo is supposed to keep an engine compartment warm on a boat. It is not waterproof but does have a UL 1500 rating for ignition protection and both a USCG ignition rating and a Mil-Spec for vibration, hi/low temp and humidity.

I plan on trying this out on the timer to do the heating for the cabin on days I fly. It is set to activate for at 41°F and shuts off at 59°F. It is a true heater as opposed to the dehumidifier above.

It is supposed to get real cold here on Monday. Will provide a PIREP on it when I can.

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[Browncbr1]

I buy these in 3 pack boxes for under $10.  

http://www.damprid.com/product/hanging-moisture-absorber-fragrance-free

Depending on humidity, one will last a couple months.  I hang it on the coat hangar and it stays there.  For warming, I have a small ceramic heater, but I I just plug it in when I arrive and let it run while I'm doing preflight.  

Edited January 17, 2016 by Browncbr1

[kpaul]

On ‎1‎/‎13‎/‎2016 at 7:59 PM, Marauder said:

I will find out later this week how it is fairing.

Marauder,

Any updates? 

I need something soon, yesterday when I pulled the plane from the hanger and cranked up all the instruments fogged over.  Way too much moisture.  Although, being in Florida I may need a actual dehumidifier and pump combination for continuous operation due to the high humidity.  Additionally, it this one truly turns off at 65 degrees it may not fit the bill since we don't stay cold very often.

[Tony Armour]

On January 13, 2016 at 3:43 PM, Marauder said:

Did I mention Garmin made it?

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In that case, it will only work half the time :-)

(Basing that on non-aviation Garmin products)

[1964-M20E]

Warming the air increases it's ability to hold water vapor and decreasing the possibility of it condensing on surfaces or in the air as droplets i.e. rain, fog or clouds.  The only two ways I now to get moisture out of the air is

1. condense it out which is done in an AC unit or dehumidifier hence the drains and water dripping from them

2. some type of desiccant, silica gel or other type, which absorbs the water vapor from the air but eventually they reach saturation and have to be regenerated by the use of some type of heat to drive the moisture out of the material.  Desiccants work well in tightly sealed environments if you do not have any type of regeneration process.

Many "tightly sealed containers" really breath quite easily with atmospheric temperature and pressure changes therefore allowing moisture to infiltrate the container.

In the south shutting down the heater at 65F would not wok well during the fall and spring.

[Tom]

I would think that heating the cabin would produce, in sub-freezing temperature, particularly with fluctuating external temperature, somewhere on the airframe a transition temperature on the structure where condensation would actually be encouraged.  If true, this would tend to cause moisture to condense repetitively in the same areas--perhaps in the nooks and crannies where it is least desirable.  Just a paranoid thought.

 

[Marauder]

On January 17, 2016 at 9:13 AM, kpaul said:

Marauder,

Any updates? 

I need something soon, yesterday when I pulled the plane from the hanger and cranked up all the instruments fogged over.  Way too much moisture.  Although, being in Florida I may need a actual dehumidifier and pump combination for continuous operation due to the high humidity.  Additionally, it this one truly turns off at 65 degrees it may not fit the bill since we don't stay cold very often.

Based on what you are describing, you would need a full dehumidifier. The purpose of these heaters are to raise the internal temperature enough to prevent condensation from occurring. I have experience with safes, both small ones and large ones. The Golden Rods, portable dehumidifiers, etc. are fine for preventing a small amount of moisture from condensing on the items inside the safe. I learned the hard way with a small safe that moisture does build up in them. A Golden Rod will keep the temperature a few degrees above the dew point and prevent the condensation.

 

[Marauder]

On January 16, 2016 at 2:41 PM, Marauder said:

 

I'm adding another gizmo to my thread. You boaters probably seen this one as well.

This gizmo is supposed to keep an engine compartment warm on a boat. It is not waterproof but does have a UL 1500 rating for ignition protection and both a USCG ignition rating and a Mil-Spec for vibration, hi/low temp and humidity.

I plan on trying this out on the timer to do the heating for the cabin on days I fly. It is set to activate for at 41°F and shuts off at 59°F. It is a true heater as opposed to the dehumidifier above.

It is supposed to get real cold here on Monday. Will provide a PIREP on it when I can.

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Quick PIREP on both devices. The Cafroma Stor Dry unit is running constantly and the inside humidity of the cabin is remaining below 40% which is what I am targeting. The last couple of days the temp has dropped and the humidity has gone into the 30s. Our temperatures have fluctuated a bit from the 50s to the recent lows in the teens.

The bigger unit is a puzzle at this point. I put it in the plane in the co-pilot footwell and found that it turns off pretty quickly. I suspect there isn't enough room in the footwell so it reaches the 65 degree cutoff fairly quickly. I then moved it to the baggage compartment and set it on top of an elevated surface so that it was equal to the height of the rear seats. Again, I turned it on and found it shut off fairly soon after it started. It may be defective but there is a testing procedure. to determine if it is working as designed. I will do that test later this week and report back.