Using ForeFight with Stratus 2s and Garmin Pilot with FlightStream/GTN on the same iPad

[Houman]

Just wondering, I tried on my last flight to use Garmin Pilot while my ForeFlight was connected to the Stratus 2s Wifi network, Garmin Pilot was telling me that it could'nt find my location or something like that about no gps position.

As I understand it, if I have my iPad's wifi network connected to my Stratus, then it will receive GPS positions from the Stratus and disables the internal 3g ipad GPS, but can the same iPad have a bluetooth connection trough FlightStream to my GTN at the same time ? since Garmin Pilot can't talk to my Stratus.

I'm looking into having a Garmin FlightStream added to my Rocket so that I can exchange flight plans trough my iPad, worst case scenario I already have 2 Ipad and will use one with Garmin Pilot only until ForeFlight comes out with 2 way transfers between it and my GTN.

Just wondering before I go and spend the 2 AMU's for the FlightStream purchase and installation.

Thanks !

[Marauder]

Just wondering, I tried on my last flight to use Garmin Pilot while my ForeFlight was connected to the Stratus 2s Wifi network, Garmin Pilot was telling me that it could'nt find my location or something like that about no gps position.

As I understand it, if I have my iPad's wifi network connected to my Stratus, then it will receive GPS positions from the Stratus and disables the internal 3g ipad GPS, but can the same iPad have a bluetooth connection trough FlightStream to my GTN at the same time ? since Garmin Pilot can't talk to my Stratus.

I'm looking into having a Garmin FlightStream added to my Rocket so that I can exchange flight plans trough my iPad, worst case scenario I already have 2 Ipad and will use one with Garmin Pilot only until ForeFlight comes out with 2 way transfers between it and my GTN.

Just wondering before I go and spend the 2 AMU's for the FlightStream purchase and installation.

Thanks !

If you have a WiFi connection to Garmin Pilot (to get weather on the ground), you would get the error you described on Garmin Pilot if your iPad now is connected to the Stratus.

You should be able to have a Bluetooth connection to Garmin Pilot and Flighstream while ForeFlight is using the WiFi.

The big question I have is for those who have ForeFlight is when it works with FlightStream what protocol will it use? Right now it only uses WiFi, will ForeFlight add Bluetooth support?

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Houman]

If you have a WiFi connection to Garmin Pilot (to get weather on the ground), you would get the error you described on Garmin Pilot if your iPad now is connected to the Stratus.

You should be able to have a Bluetooth connection to Garmin Pilot and Flighstream while ForeFlight is using the WiFi.

The big question I have is for those who have ForeFlight is when it works with FlightStream what protocol will it use? Right now it only uses WiFi, will ForeFlight add Bluetooth support?

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Good question, I just hope Foreflight comes out with it's full bi-directional transfer with Garmin products soon. I personally don't like Garmin pilot that much, I got a 3 month subscription just to try it and find it much less intuitive and somewhat cumbersom...

Waiting before spending 2 amu for the flight stream 210...

[Marauder]

Good question, I just hope Foreflight comes out with it's full bi-directional transfer with Garmin products soon. I personally don't like Garmin pilot that much, I got a 3 month subscription just to try it and find it much less intuitive and somewhat cumbersom...

Waiting before spending 2 amu for the flight stream 210...

Funny how pilots can have different perspectives. I had ForeFlight for 2 years at the same time I had Garmin Pilot. I really tried hard to like it, but found that ForeFlight was cumbersome and less intuitive than Garmin Pilot. It might be due to the fact Pilot looks a lot like my GTN menu.

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[Houman]

Funny how pilots can have different perspectives. I had ForeFlight for 2 years at the same time I had Garmin Pilot. I really tried hard to like it, but found that ForeFlight was cumbersome and less intuitive than Garmin Pilot. It might be due to the fact Pilot looks a lot like my GTN menu.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

That is true that it looks a lot like my GTN 650, but I was using ForeFlight long before Garmin Pilot or the GTN, so since as humans we are all creators of habits, it`s not always easy to get used to something else.

[donkaye]

I never gave it much thought, but should have.   While I have most of the iPad flight apps, I mostly use Garmin Pilot.  I have both Wifi and Bluetooth enabled on my iPad.  When on the ground at home I get all the Garmin weather apparently though the Wifi connection.  In the air before I select otherwise a screen overlay dims the display and displays "Garmin weather not available".  I then select either FIS-B or SXM, the screen lights up, and the weather shows up.  Since FIS-B or SXM is coming through the Flight Stream 210, the app is apparently smart enough to know to use Bluetooth and not Wifi.  Accurate GPS location must be coming through the Bluetooth, too, from the GTN 750.

 

For Foreflight, since it is using the Flight Stream 210, all activity must be coming through Bluetooth including position from either a GNS or GTN.  It would be wise to contact Garmin to find out if a Stratus and Flight Stream 210 can be used at the same time, and if so, which takes preference for GPS location.

[Houman]

I never gave it much thought, but should have.   While I have most of the iPad flight apps, I mostly use Garmin Pilot.  I have both Wifi and Bluetooth enabled on my iPad.  When on the ground at home I get all the Garmin weather apparently though the Wifi connection.  In the air before I select otherwise a screen overlay dims the display and displays "Garmin weather not available".  I then select either FIS-B or SXM, the screen lights up, and the weather shows up.  Since FIS-B or SXM is coming through the Flight Stream 210, the app is apparently smart enough to know to use Bluetooth and not Wifi.  Accurate GPS location must be coming through the Bluetooth, too, from the GTN 750.

 

For Foreflight, since it is using the Flight Stream 210, all activity must be coming through Bluetooth including position from either a GNS or GTN.  It would be wise to contact Garmin to find out if a Stratus and Flight Stream 210 can be used at the same time, and if so, which takes preference for GPS location.

 

I have asked but have not gotten any answer, I'm looking into installing FlightStream 210 as well, but I guess will use 2 different IPAD's, one for my Garmin Pilot and the other with ForeFlight, it is very cumbersome when alone in the plane, but only do that in cruise mode with A/P on, so not soo bad...

[donkaye]

I have asked but have not gotten any answer, I'm looking into installing FlightStream 210 as well, but I guess will use 2 different IPAD's, one for my Garmin Pilot and the other with ForeFlight, it is very cumbersome when alone in the plane, but only do that in cruise mode with A/P on, so not soo bad...

 

I guess my question would be: Why even use the Stratus when using the Flight Stream 210?  See the "Feature Compatibilities" at this link:

 

FlightStream 110 210 | Garmin

[Houman]

I guess my question would be: Why even use the Stratus when using the Flight Stream 210?  See the "Feature Compatibilities" at this link:

 

FlightStream 110 210 | Garmin

 

Well I don't have ADSB-out yet, my ADSB-in is the Stratus 2S for Traffic and Weather and that only works with ForeFlight...

So my question was if I install the FlightStream 210, will I be able to use Garmin Pilot for my route planning and transfers to GTN and still use ForeFlight with my Stratus 2S for weather and traffic.

 

I see now on the compatibility list they have flight transfer with ForeFlight, but again, will Foreflight work with my Stratus if it is getting its GPS position through the GTN and its bluetooth connection with the FlightStream...

 

I think I will ask the question to Appaero or ForeFlight, they might have more info on it.

[donkaye]

Well I don't have ADSB-out yet, my ADSB-in is the Stratus 2S for Traffic and Weather and that only works with ForeFlight...

So my question was if I install the FlightStream 210, will I be able to use Garmin Pilot for my route planning and transfers to GTN and still use ForeFlight with my Stratus 2S for weather and traffic.

 

I see now on the compatibility list they have flight transfer with ForeFlight, but again, will Foreflight work with my Stratus if it is getting its GPS position through the GTN and its bluetooth connection with the FlightStream...

 

I think I will ask the question to Appaero or ForeFlight, they might have more info on it.

 

I see.  So the Stratus works with Wifi and the Flight Stream works with Bluetooth.  The only question would be which GPS source takes precedence.  For you the only reason to buy the Flight Stream would be to transfer flight plans, and with the GTN that isn't so important.  Currently the flight plan transfer aspect of the flight stream isn't implemented.  Unless you bought either the GDL 84 or GDL 88, I wouldn't spend the money on the Fight Stream 210 in your current situation, since there is so little value in it.

[Marauder]

Well I don't have ADSB-out yet, my ADSB-in is the Stratus 2S for Traffic and Weather and that only works with ForeFlight...

So my question was if I install the FlightStream 210, will I be able to use Garmin Pilot for my route planning and transfers to GTN and still use ForeFlight with my Stratus 2S for weather and traffic.

I see now on the compatibility list they have flight transfer with ForeFlight, but again, will Foreflight work with my Stratus if it is getting its GPS position through the GTN and its bluetooth connection with the FlightStream...

I think I will ask the question to Appaero or ForeFlight, they might have more info on it.

Well it looks like you need someone who has a Mooney with the FlightStream installed to prove or disprove my hypothesis.

I'm betting it can do both...

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[Houman]

Well it looks like you need someone who has a Mooney with the FlightStream installed to prove or disprove my hypothesis.

I'm betting it can do both...

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Yep, and with a GTN 650 or 750...

Anyone with that kind of setup in the north-east ???

[Marauder]

Yep, and with a GTN 650 or 750...

Anyone with that kind of setup in the north-east ???

MooneyBob from Jersey I think has the FlightStream and Garmin Pilot. Don't know if he has ForeFlight.

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[JohnB]

Well I don't have ADSB-out yet, my ADSB-in is the Stratus 2S for Traffic and Weather and that only works with ForeFlight...

So my question was if I install the FlightStream 210, will I be able to use Garmin Pilot for my route planning and transfers to GTN and still use ForeFlight with my Stratus 2S for weather and traffic.

 

I see now on the compatibility list they have flight transfer with ForeFlight, but again, will Foreflight work with my Stratus if it is getting its GPS position through the GTN and its bluetooth connection with the FlightStream...

 

I think I will ask the question to Appaero or ForeFlight, they might have more info on it.

 

Great question. I would say your setup should ABSOLUTELY work. If your stratus does not take position and weather precedence, you could easily turn off your bluetooth on your iPad which should completely disconnect it from your flight stream. (easy to do, just a swipe up from the bottom any screen and tap the bluetooth icon)

 

I was hoping that when Foreflight v 7.3 comes out that enables flight plan transfer through foreflight, this should do both. (keep stratus input for weather, and bluetooth output to your flightstream for flight plan transfer) Im waiting until v 7.3 comes out THEN I will probably get my flight stream.

 

I already have a stratus. Will be getting my ADSB out solution in the next 2 weeks with an AXP transponder, so I should have ADSB weather and traffic input active on my ipad, and out on my transponder which should make me meet the 2020 mandate early, and have all available ADSB info on my ipad.

[Houman]

Well here is an interesting response from ForeFlight Support ( the are just amazing, since they are all pilots as well ) :

 

"Here's some follow-up information regarding the FlightStream and Stratus working together (FFM=ForeFlight Mobile):

 

The FS210 uses BlueTooth and the Stratus 2S uses wireless. Both may be connected at the same time. With 7.2, FFM with the FS210 supports using GDL88 for ADSB weather and traffic, pressure altitude, GPS position, and AHRS.

 

Since you do not have a GDL88, your configuration with a FS210 would not include the ADSB weather and traffic.

 

With 7.3 of FFM (available soon) , support for flightplan exchange is added. You can simultaneously obtain weather and traffic from your Stratus 2S via the wireless and the other functions from the Bluetooth/FS210. When you upgrades\ to a GDL88, you will no longer need the Stratus 2S other than as a backup. Currently with 7.3, the ADSB weather and traffic needs to come from the GDL88 as a single source when there is a GDL88 available."

 

I think on his last phrase, he ment to say currently with 7.2,...

[Marauder]

Well here is an interesting response from ForeFlight Support ( the are just amazing, since they are all pilots as well ) :

"Here's some follow-up information regarding the FlightStream and Stratus working together (FFM=ForeFlight Mobile):

The FS210 uses BlueTooth and the Stratus 2S uses wireless. Both may be connected at the same time. With 7.2, FFM with the FS210 supports using GDL88 for ADSB weather and traffic, pressure altitude, GPS position, and AHRS.

Since you do not have a GDL88, your configuration with a FS210 would not include the ADSB weather and traffic.

With 7.3 of FFM (available soon) , support for flightplan exchange is added. You can simultaneously obtain weather and traffic from your Stratus 2S via the wireless and the other functions from the Bluetooth/FS210. When you upgrades to a GDL88, you will no longer need the Stratus 2S other than as a backup. Currently with 7.3, the ADSB weather and traffic needs to come from the GDL88 as a single source when there is a GDL88 available."

I think on his last phrase, he ment to say currently with 7.2,...

It does sound like they are adding Bluetooth to ForeFlight to be used with the FlightStream. So, once you go with the FlightStream, the big question is who will be in charge of flight planning information? ForeFlight or Garmin Pilot? Presumably both can be connected to Bluetooth at the same time. If so, how will FlightStream treat each app?

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[aviatoreb]

Well here is an interesting response from ForeFlight Support ( the are just amazing, since they are all pilots as well ) :

 

"Here's some follow-up information regarding the FlightStream and Stratus working together (FFM=ForeFlight Mobile):

 

The FS210 uses BlueTooth and the Stratus 2S uses wireless. Both may be connected at the same time. With 7.2, FFM with the FS210 supports using GDL88 for ADSB weather and traffic, pressure altitude, GPS position, and AHRS.

 

Since you do not have a GDL88, your configuration with a FS210 would not include the ADSB weather and traffic.

 

With 7.3 of FFM (available soon) , support for flightplan exchange is added. You can simultaneously obtain weather and traffic from your Stratus 2S via the wireless and the other functions from the Bluetooth/FS210. When you upgrades\ to a GDL88, you will no longer need the Stratus 2S other than as a backup. Currently with 7.3, the ADSB weather and traffic needs to come from the GDL88 as a single source when there is a GDL88 available."

 

I think on his last phrase, he ment to say currently with 7.2,...

 

I've been saying this for a while - That's the problem/limitation of the flightstream 210 - whether you use garmin pilot or foreflight - you do not get adsb information into your ipad app unless you purchase and pay to install a gdl88.  Even if you have an on the glareshield device (gdl39 or stratus) then you no longer get any adsb traffic or weather without a gdl88.

 

I for one already have an adsb out transponder and I will not buy a gdl88.  I also won't by a 210 and loose my adsb in traffic/weather.  They really would have a home run if they had a flightstream 310 that was essentially a gdl39 for adsb in data, and all the stuff of the current flightstream 210, all in one box.  I would buy that.  I told that to Garmin at Oshkosh.  Of course garmin was just sales people and I don't think garmin will respond.

[Houman]

I've been saying this for a while - That's the problem/limitation of the flightstream 210 - whether you use garmin pilot or foreflight - you do not get adsb information into your ipad app unless you purchase and pay to install a gdl88.  Even if you have an on the glareshield device (gdl39 or stratus) then you no longer get any adsb traffic or weather without a gdl88.

 

I for one already have an adsb out transponder and I will not buy a gdl88.  I also won't by a 210 and loose my adsb in traffic/weather.  They really would have a home run if they had a flightstream 310 that was essentially a gdl39 for adsb in data, and all the stuff of the current flightstream 210, all in one box.  I would buy that.  I told that to Garmin at Oshkosh.  Of course garmin was just sales people and I don't think garmin will respond.

 

 

Erik, my understanding from the ForeFlight support response is that you will have exactly that with Foreflight 7.3, where you can exchange flight plan with the panel GPS trough FlightStream, but your ForeFlight continues to get ADSB traffic and Weather trough Stratus... 

 

Not sure if Garmin will do the same eventually if they want to keep up with Foreflight

[hramirez8]

Hoeman;

 

I have an identical set up to yours, with the exception I already have the flight stream 210 and I have an ADSB out solution via the GTX330ES coupled with the GTN and a G500.

 

I use Foreflight with Stratus 2 inflight for weather and traffic (although I get a similar traffic picture via the GTX330ES), and I use Garmin Pilot for flight plans (It has international flight planning capabilities whereas FFM doesn't). I don't have any problems using both at the same time. I even get the situation information for FFM and Garmin Pilot from the AHRS on the aircraft via the Flightstream 210. if I want Forelight to obtain situation information from Stratus I can always go to "More, Devices" and then choose Stratus 2 as a source.

 

Three questions to anybody on the thread:

1) I am getting some traffic solution on my G500. Since I do not have the GDL-88, I presume it is coming from the GTX330ES. How complete is this traffic picture (I asked the Garmin people at Oshkosh but got an answer which was not satisfactory- they were sales people and I not sure if the are just trying to push the GDL88).

2) Donaye mentioned "When on the ground at home I get all the Garmin weather apparently though the Wifi connection.  In the air before I select otherwise a screen overlay dims the display and displays "Garmin weather not available".  I then select either FIS-B or SXM, the screen lights up, and the weather shows up." I assume you have Sirius XM weather and/or GDL88 to get that info on the garmin pilot while on flight?

3) I'm curious to learn if FFM will be able to provide Weather and traffic from Stratus2 to my G500 via Flightstream or I am definitely forced to buy GDL88 to get that on the panel...

 

One more comment: I find the Synthetic Vision on FFM ultra precise when compared to Garmin Pilot even though the navigation source is the same. I have tested repeteadly and can vouch to that effect.

 

So good luck and let us know your experience!

[aviatoreb]

Erik, my understanding from the ForeFlight support response is that you will have exactly that with Foreflight 7.3, where you can exchange flight plan with the panel GPS trough FlightStream, but your ForeFlight continues to get ADSB traffic and Weather trough Stratus... 

 

Not sure if Garmin will do the same eventually if they want to keep up with Foreflight

 

Are you sure?!  This is what Garmin said that their device wouldn't do when I asked the (sales) people at oshkosh.  If it is true....please let me know...I will switch!

[Marauder]

Hoeman;

 

I have an identical set up to yours, with the exception I already have the flight stream 210 and I have an ADSB out solution via the GTX330ES coupled with the GTN and a G500.

 

I use Foreflight with Stratus 2 inflight for weather and traffic (although I get a similar traffic picture via the GTX330ES), and I use Garmin Pilot for flight plans (It has international flight planning capabilities whereas FFM doesn't). I don't have any problems using both at the same time. I even get the situation information for FFM and Garmin Pilot from the AHRS on the aircraft via the Flightstream 210. if I want Forelight to obtain situation information from Stratus I can always go to "More, Devices" and then choose Stratus 2 as a source.

 

Three questions to anybody on the thread:

1) I am getting some traffic solution on my G500. Since I do not have the GDL-88, I presume it is coming from the GTX330ES. How complete is this traffic picture (I asked the Garmin people at Oshkosh but got an answer which was not satisfactory- they were sales people and I not sure if the are just trying to push the GDL88).

2) Donaye mentioned "When on the ground at home I get all the Garmin weather apparently though the Wifi connection.  In the air before I select otherwise a screen overlay dims the display and displays "Garmin weather not available".  I then select either FIS-B or SXM, the screen lights up, and the weather shows up." I assume you have Sirius XM weather and/or GDL88 to get that info on the garmin pilot while on flight?

3) I'm curious to learn if FFM will be able to provide Weather and traffic from Stratus2 to my G500 via Flightstream or I am definitely forced to buy GDL88 to get that on the panel...

 

One more comment: I find the Synthetic Vision on FFM ultra precise when compared to Garmin Pilot even though the navigation source is the same. I have tested repeteadly and can vouch to that effect.

 

So good luck and let us know your experience!

 

I think I can answer some of your questions;

 

1) What you are seeing on the G500 is most likely TIS-A. It is a legacy traffic system triggered by the squitter capability of the Garmin 330-ES. It is not complete and is going away. Here is some more information on it: http://www.aopa.org/Advocacy/Air-Traffic-Services-,-a-,-Technology/Air-Traffic-Services-Brief-Traffic-Information-Services

2) Garmin Pilot allows you to select FIS-B weather via a GDL-39, Baron mobile Link (XM) or a WiFi connection. When on the ground and within WiFi coverage, you select "Garmin weather" from the overlay menu. If you lose WiFi coverage like in the air, you would get the error you described. Switching to XM (on the ground or in the air) or FIS-B (air only) and switching the overlay menu to FIS-B would make the error go away.

3) I don't believe you can use the Stratus 2 to feed the G500. It is a certified box and I suspect either the GDL-84 or GDL-88 would be required.

[donkaye]

Hoeman;

 

2) Donaye mentioned "When on the ground at home I get all the Garmin weather apparently though the Wifi connection.  In the air before I select otherwise a screen overlay dims the display and displays "Garmin weather not available".  I then select either FIS-B or SXM, the screen lights up, and the weather shows up." I assume you have Sirius XM weather and/or GDL88 to get that info on the garmin pilot while on flight?

 

 

Yes, I do have XM through the GDL 69A to Flight Stream 210 interface.

[hramirez8]

Thanks for input Marauder. It clarifies things... and confirms my feared need to spend another 12K on my plane.... 

 

(I have a standing agreement with my wife: Anything I spend on plane, she can spend on a house makeover....)

 

 

Humberto.

[Houman]

Are you sure?!  This is what Garmin said that their device wouldn't do when I asked the (sales) people at oshkosh.  If it is true....please let me know...I will switch!

Well that is what Foreflight support has told me, I think it will be great. I'm probably installing a flightstream in the Rocket next month and at the same time having the required cables for an ADSB-out transponder put in place so that I can add that in later without the hassle of re-cabling and more avionics shop time...

[aviatoreb]

Well that is what Foreflight support has told me, I think it will be great. I'm probably installing a flightstream in the Rocket next month and at the same time having the required cables for an ADSB-out transponder put in place so that I can add that in later without the hassle of re-cabling and more avionics shop time...

 

Well I will be very interested to hear if it works.  Or better yet - come show me!!!

 

As for pre-cabling?  Why not finish the job and just install the ADSB out transponder.  I really like mine - seeing lots of traffic is very useful when travelling into busy airspaces.