Vintage Mooney Cowling Mod

[Browncbr1]

I'm loving this and have been watching for a while. Only thing I'm a little confused on is the spinner. I have the hartzell top prop on my C with the long pointed spinner. Will this work with your cowling? I know it's a topic that's been brought up before but most of the conversation was on the later model OEM spinner and I'm not familiar enough to know the difference.

I have the same setup on my F. After investigating, the longer pointed spinner used with the top prop doesn't work. It looks like the 201 spinner, but if this cowl ends up anything like the swta cowl, then the spinner back plate is too close to the engine to allow enough clearance for the new cowl. This is why I didn't get the swta cowl in the past, as a 201 spinner is over $1800 for a used one!

When I was talking to hartzell, the said the top prop spinner has little or no trade in value. I think it would end up being a really expensive cone-head Halloween costume accessory.

[Sabremech]

Hi Marauder,

 I'm currently working on a kit for 66 and up C,E,F, & G models and it doesn't matter what windshield is installed. Once the kit is defined and the STC process is well under way, I'll start to work on the 65 and older models.  I may have a solution to the high cost spinner issue. I'm going to send my spinner out to have a mold made for carbon fiber spinners. I don't know any of the costs of that yet, but am hopeful it will be a viable solution.

 Thank you,

 David

[mike_elliott]

Bring your order pad with you to the Mooney Summit in October, Dave, I think you will busy taking deposits! And thank Cindi for volunteering to help out!

[Sabremech]

Hi Mike,

 As much as I'd like to take orders for the cowling kit, I'm going to wait until the STC is complete as delays are inevitable once the certification process starts. I'll pass your message along to Cindi. I know she'll enjoy the trip more by helping out where she can.

 Thanks,

 David

[Sabremech]

Thought I would get caught up on a question about spinners and I promised a couple of pictures of my spinner backing plate and how it's attached to the prop. Here's 2 photos to show the spinner backing plate mounting.

 

 

  Here's a few more pictures of the cowling mod progress. First 2 pictures are of the new air filter location on the left front baffling and my first attempt at fiberglass parts manufacture, my duct to connect the air filter to the carb air box. I plan on having the ducts made by the same company that does the cowling pieces but I needed this part quickly so I made it myself.

 

 

 The next 2 pictures are of the cowling parts now riveted together to the top cowl and the lower cowl structure. Just about ready for them to go on my airplane for the last time soon.

 

 

 Thanks,

 David

 

 

 

 

 

[Browncbr1]

Nice. Now, were you doing the landing light cover too as part of the kit?

[Raptor05121]

I so want one of these

[Sabremech]

Hi Browncbr1,

I do plan on having a landing light cover with this mod. I just haven't made it yet for mine.

Thanks,

David

[DXB]

I'm loving this and have been watching for a while. Only thing I'm a little confused on is the spinner. I have the hartzell top prop on my C with the long pointed spinner. Will this work with your cowling? I know it's a topic that's been brought up before but most of the conversation was on the later model OEM spinner and I'm not familiar enough to know the difference.

Curious to know answer to this as I'm pretty sure I have the identical setup.  Also will love to hear how people do with cooling performance on old C models.  My doghouse is a piece of dog****.

[Andy95W]

Curious to know answer to this as I'm pretty sure I have the identical setup.  Also will love to hear how people do with cooling performance on old C models.  My doghouse is a piece of dog****.

You have to take the time to seal up all the leaks.

-around the starter

-around the generator

-under the vernatherm

-in the front where the baffles meet the front cylinders

-and so on

As an example: the outside circumference of the starter is probably about 8 inches or so. A small, 1/8" gap around it is the same as having a 1"X1" hole in the dog house. It takes time and patience but the end result is being able to keep CHTs under 400° On a 90° day.

[ryoder]

You have to take the time to seal up all the leaks.

-around the starter

-around the generator

-under the vernatherm

-in the front where the baffles meet the front cylinders

-and so on

As an example: the outside circumference of the starter is probably about 8 inches or so. A small, 1/8" gap around it is the same as having a 1"X1" hole in the dog house. It takes time and patience but the end result is being able to keep CHTs under 400° On a 90° day.

I'm new to this so how do you seal up a gap? The doghouse is a big metal box. The only thing I have done is to replace screws that fell out. Mine also runs hot enough that I leave the coal flaps half open during cruise on hot days.

[Andy95W]

I'm new to this so how do you seal up a gap? The doghouse is a big metal box. The only thing I have done is to replace screws that fell out. Mine also runs hot enough that I leave the coal flaps half open during cruise on hot days.

Sheet metal repair using real rivets for any cracks. Additional sheet metal to lengthen the doghouse metal, if necessary, to close gaps. Bent to fit.

RTV (silicone caulk) to seal up smaller gaps. Any color will work, but to be official you should use the orange/red high temperature stuff.

Rubber baffle material, cut to fit, to fill in other gaps where rubbing or overlapping joints is a concern. If not structural, pop rivets work adequately to hold this material in place.

It really ends up being a custom job. No two airplanes will be the same.

[Marauder]

Sheet metal repair using real rivets for any cracks. Additional sheet metal to lengthen the doghouse metal, if necessary, to close gaps. Bent to fit.

RTV (silicone caulk) to seal up smaller gaps. Any color will work, but to be official you should use the orange/red high temperature stuff.

Rubber baffle material, cut to fit, to fill in other gaps where rubbing or overlapping joints is a concern. If not structural, pop rivets work adequately to hold this material in place.

It really ends up being a custom job. No two airplanes will be the same.

Speaking about silicone, is there any way to remove it without taking the paint with it? Some idiot (okay, it was me) used silicone that he now wants it removed.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[DXB]

You have to take the time to seal up all the leaks.

-around the starter

-around the generator

-under the vernatherm

-in the front where the baffles meet the front cylinders

-and so on

As an example: the outside circumference of the starter is probably about 8 inches or so. A small, 1/8" gap around it is the same as having a 1"X1" hole in the dog house. It takes time and patience but the end result is being able to keep CHTs under 400° On a 90° day.

Highest CHT under 400 in climb at Vy (vs. approaching 430 now) would make my summer (yes, I need to get life).  Luckily nothing ever above 380 in cruise at 75% power, even with it leaned out. I had the mechanic caulk the starter and alternator holes already.  I'm curious what I should close off where the baffles meet the front cylinders, and how I should do it (or should an inexperienced owner even be messing around with a caulk gun in this area?).  Clearly there's some gaps there up front.

[Sabremech]

Hey, what's going on here? I don't want you fixing up these old dog house baffles as you won't want my cowling mod!!! Just kidding.

David

[Hank]

David, many of us ARE interested. I've done significant restoration work on my doghouse at the last two annuals, and need to do more. I'd rather put that time & money into a better, permanent solution! But I have gained 10 mph and seem to be able to run slightly LOP now without depending on proper phase of the moon, alignment of the stars or holding my mouth properly for the duration.

[DXB]

David, many of us ARE interested. I've done significant restoration work on my doghouse at the last two annuals, and need to do more. I'd rather put that time & money into a better, permanent solution! But I have gained 10 mph and seem to be able to run slightly LOP now without depending on proper phase of the moon, alignment of the stars or holding my mouth properly for the duration. being able to do so easily would be nice, to say nothing if being able to climb decently in the summer.

Yeah sorry for hijacking- my interest is genuine as well !    Will have start another thread at some point on how to become handy with a caulking gun as a stopgap until your product hits the market.

[Guest]

Speaking about silicone, is there any way to remove it without taking the paint with it? Some idiot (okay, it was me) used silicone that he now wants it removed.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Silicone sealants don't like 100LL. Remove as much as you can with a sharpe knife then you can soak a rag then place it on the remaining sealant to remove it. For the baffles, if you can remove them you can soak them in a bucket or tub with some 100LL.

Clarence

[Yetti]

So the auto parts house has some really nice bright flashing LEDs for cars. Since you are STCing the new cowl.  Can you add a bunch of blinky strobe light LEDs to this effort?

[MyNameIsNobody]

Face palm...

[Yetti]

I am guessing in the 13 pages of stuff I did not read LEDs have been discussed.  How about just doing an insert for the guppy mouth?  Was that discussed?

[Sabremech]

Hi Yetti,

I'm going to have a landing light lens cover as part of my mod. I'd recommend using an LED landing light to keep from damaging the lens from heat of a standard landing light bulb.

I didn't consider an insert for the guppy mouth as I don't think I could get the look I wanted and it would still possibly have the same issues that I had with the ARI enclosure, which was cracking in the corners every year. I'm hopeful that I've eliminated those issues and dramatically modernized the look of the vintage Mooney.

Thank you,

David

[aviatoreb]

Hi Clarence,

Never say never. Let me finish the Mooney project and then maybe I can make you a better part for your 400.

David

 

I'm jealous too - I wish you would make a comparable part for my rocket....  No kidding.

[Hank]

I am guessing in the 13 pages of stuff I did not read LEDs have been discussed.  How about just doing an insert for the guppy mouth?  Was that discussed?

I have the guppy mouth closure. This new cowl gets rid of the whole front and ties in to the existing cheek panels (I think). Then there are cool, efficient, modern air intakes on each side. And no more carb chin.

Keep going, David, we're all standing and cheering as you approach the finish line!

[Sabremech]

Time for an update. Getting close to being finished and making the first flight with my new cowling. The bottom cowl is almost complete with just the oil cooler to install. I found mine cracked at the threaded fitting when I was installing it. I had another one handy so no delay with that issue. I also picked up the new inlet rings I had made as I didn't like the look of the original ones I have. Now they blend into the shape of the cowling. Much better looking.

I'm going to hold off posting a completion photo as I'm planning on flying it down to the Mooney Summitt III and showing the completed project Oct 1-4.

Thanks,

David