panel upgrade guidance for new M20C owner

[DXB]

I would recommend Agape Avionics (formerly Penn avionics) at Brandywine. They helped me do my panel in my 68' C and it came out fantastic! I fly to KPNE all the time as I have good friends that do a lot of the maintenance work for some of the aircraft owners there. I'd be happy to show you my plane sometime if you're interested, I can pm you my contact info.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

do you have plans to add a GPSS, or does the GTN have it built in?  you are going to have an awesome panel. 

 

My plane was done by Lancaster and the previous owner.  He was happy and so am I... I would add to your MUST list the GDL-88 for ADSB.  Given all the other Garmin stuff probably no hit to installation and you'll be glad you did.  I'm looking to add that now to my 430 panel.

BILL

(my panel pics in my Gallery).

 

Interestingly I have worked with several of the shops mentioned.

- Agape Avionics is the former Penn Avionics and is under new management. Bill Dunn their service manager is on this forum and contributes. They did my Aspen, Garmin and PS audio panel. It works and my complaints about their lack of responsiveness has been addressed with the new ownership. I have met with their ownership and it is clear they are trying to get the business back on track.

- Lancaster Avionics worked on my plane this past summer. Bad, bad, bad, bad experience. Won't be going there again. The shop was sold by Mark to Todd some time back and I think this may be the reason for the change. They also quoted me $8,000 more than the next highest quote on the stuff I had installed. Based on my experience this past summer, they are still high priced. PM me if you need or want details.

- Red Eagle did my STEC 60-2 install. The workmanship by Dale is exemplary. The shop was sold a few years ago and I think Dale for the most part is a one man shop. Dale is grumpy but does great work.

- Boshart did my Narco transponder back in the 1990s. Still in the panel and still working. Jeff I believe has handed over most of the avionics activities to Brian. I also used them before the Narco when they were just getting started in avionics. They helped me through a number of issues with my KX-170Bs. If you own or owned one, you know the issues

 

Thanks for  the great input from everyone- I've been talking to Penn (Agape) Avionics and will now contact Red Eagle as well.   Unfortunately Penn isn't selling Garmin stuff until their Garmin dealer status is reinstated, with no time estimate for this.  They are instead offering me a deal on the larger screen King KSN770 nav/com/MFD along with their KT74 transponder and KMA 30 audio panel, instead of the GTN 650 and other Garmin stuff for comparable price.   The increased size and functionality of the KSN770 are appealing, but I'm pretty hesitant given that this is such a new product in a market that Garmin dominates.  Any thoughts on this hardware? If it fails in the market, I worry support and value may be issues.

 

Some other issues that came up were:

1. Need for a GDL-88 in addition to the GTX330ES- As a  Foreflight user, I'm wondering if it's a good alternative to just get a Stratus 2  for ADS-b in and display traffic on a yoke mount IPad?  Given the small screen of the GTN650, using the Stratus 2/Ipad primarily for weather and traffic as well as AHRS backup for the steam gauges might be a more efficient (and economical) approach?

2.  Including GPSS install with the STEC-30 - I'm wondering if this will be overkill for a low time private pilot right now, and I could add it later if I finish an instrument rating and find myself doing more complex flying.  Or is there real value in installing it right now for an extra 2K?

3.  Aspen EFD 1000 Pro-  I'm also thinking about adding later on if I get deep into instrument flying rather than now. This would also eliminate need for GPSS as a separate install.  Or is there a strong practical case for getting one now? 

 

Too little experience, too many decisions...

[DXB]

I would recommend Agape Avionics (formerly Penn avionics) at Brandywine. They helped me do my panel in my 68' C and it came out fantastic! I fly to KPNE all the time as I have good friends that do a lot of the maintenance work for some of the aircraft owners there. I'd be happy to show you my plane sometime if you're interested, I can pm you my contact info.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Sure I'd love to see your '68 C.  Let me know next time you're planning on being at KPNE and will have time.   I'll definitely make an effort to stop by!

[N6758N]

I'm not sure if the KSN770 would even fit in your panel well with all the other stuff, at least not if you wanted to keep everything in the center stack. My transponder was all the way over on the right when I bought my airplane and it drove me nuts every time I had to dial in a squawk code from ATC.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[dcrogers11]

You might check your avionics shop and price the difference between the STEC 55X and the 30.  The 55X comes with GPSS and the 30 is a $2000 +- add-on and I believe its better to do the install up front.  The 55X will fly approaches from your WAAS enabled GPS.  I opted for the 55X and has been a real joy to fly with it.  

 

Also, +1 on PS Engineering's 8000 over the Garmin.  IMHO, a much better audio panel.  

 

I recently completed my panel upgrade and learned a lot from it.  Here's a picture of it.  

 

Good luck and welcome to Mooneyspace.

 

Don

[Marauder]

Chris,

I heard you were thinking of upgrading your autopilot. You know I'd be happy to take it off your hands if you ever go that route!

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Stand in line!

Well, I'll inherit his 60-2 and bequeath you my STEC50.

That works for me! Any STEC is better than no STEC.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I step away for a few hours and you guys my autopilot all parsed out! Why stop there? Who wants my GTN 650 or my Aspens or my PS Engineering 8000BT? Heck, while we are at it, who wants my Mooney?!

[Marauder]

Sure I'd love to see your '68 C. Let me know next time you're planning on being at KPNE and will have time. I'll definitely make an effort to stop by!

Dev -- sounds like you are in our backyard. Join the NJ Mooney Group on Yahoo. We have periodic fly ins at various airports in the area.

Also, I'm based at N57. If you want to see my setup and talk through options over a cup of coffee. I can walk you through the process.

[Bob_Belville]

I step away for a few hours and you guys my autopilot all parsed out! Why stop there? Who wants my GTN 650 or my Aspens or my PS Engineering 8000BT? Heck, while we are at it, who wants my Mooney?!

Well, now that you mentioned it, you have a very nice Mooney...

[Delta]

Since you listed Lancaster as an option, you may want to talk to Ben at Smart Avionics located at Donegal Springs (N71), just 13 miles west of LNS.

www.smart-avionics.com

[DXB]

 I incorporated a lot of input from folks here to come up with a schematic and plan for the panel upgrade, so it's only fair that i share it (attached).   Also attached is a friend's panel in a '66C that I used as a model for mine.  Now if I can just find a way to get this done within budget...

[rob]

You won't need the VSI, my 65C had a fairly similar setup to what you're looking at but had the CDI (backup for the Aspen) in place of the VSI.

[Marauder]

You can also lose the second CDI unless you want it as a backup. The Aspen will handle all of the Nav inputs.

[bonal]

I like the layout but I don't think you can use a single sheet for everything and I'm sure I will be corrected if I'm wrong but don't the flight instruments have to be mounted on an isolation vibration panel (I don't know the proper name for this)

Now where was that post on "If you won a small lottery"

[PTK]

You can also lose the second CDI unless you want it as a backup. The Aspen will handle all of the Nav inputs.

 

It won't handle anything if/when it red x's on you at the most inopportune moment on an approach!

 

Give yourself some piece of mind and keep the second CDI as a backup.

 

Not only would I keep it but I'd see if it can be positioned in my primary scan.

Maybe swap places with the ap head if possible? Also I'd meke sure I had GS on that head as well.

[Marauder]

It won't handle anything if/when it red x's on you at the most inopportune moment on an approach!

Give yourself some piece of mind and keep the second CDI as a backup.

Not only would I keep it but I'd see if it can be positioned in my primary scan.

Maybe swap places with the ap head if possible? Also I'd meke sure I had GS on that head as well.

Peter -- since you are concerned about backups, I think it might be time to sell your Mooney. You know Mooneys only have one engine?!

[PTK]

In my home field there have been two instances of failures that I've heard of within the past three years. 

Incidentally, none of these were engine failures. Both of these were Aspens!

 

Coincidence? Possibly. But then again probably not!

Reasonable for one to be concerned? I don't know...it's an individual's private decision.

[Marauder]

In my home field there have been two instances of failures that I've heard of within the past three years.

Incidentally, none of these were engine failures. Both of these were Aspens!

Coincidence? Possibly. But then again probably not!

Reasonable for one to be concerned? I don't know...it's an individual's private decision.

Peter, Peter, Peter -- Funny on my field there are 200,000 Aspens installed and no failures Funny how the Internet works isn't it?

BTW -- the red X stuff you keep talking about has NOTHING to do with the HSI where the Aspen displays the Nav signals. The red X is the result of an AHRS failure which pertaining only to the attitude indicator. The HSI function will continue to function.

[Bob_Belville]

FWIW, today while getting my IFR/xponder/altimeter/static certification done, I asked my avionics shop, a Garmin and Aspen dealer, about problems with Aspens based on comments here. He told me that Aspen had some problems with bad boards from 2 different venders when their sales and production expanded rapidly. He was pretty sure all that was past and most board failures were while the units were still under warranty. Did I mention he is an Aspen dealer?

[PTK]

...Funny on my field there are 200,000 Aspens installed and no failures Funny how the Internet works isn't it?...

 

I don't see your point. What does the internet have to do with the two data points I provided?

[DXB]

Well I thought I should close out this old thread with pix of the new panel.  About a year ago I started thinking out loud in this thread about putting a modern panel in my newly acquired '68C. The install hit some snags and took 10 weeks- finally got it back a week ago.  Some minor squawks to iron out, and lots of flying and practice needed to get best use out of it. Biggest one is that I've had a couple of squelch breaks on the GTN650 that I hope to stop somehow.  But overall I'm extremely happy .  I particularly love my Flightstream 210 - only downside is that it will slow me down at learning the GTN650, since it's so dang easy to transfer the flight plan from the ipad.

Thanks to Mooneyspace for all the guidance! 

 

 

[carusoam]

Nice pics, Dev!

Best regards,

-a-

[Marauder]

Well I thought I should close out this old thread with pix of the new panel.  About a year ago I started thinking out loud in this thread about putting a modern panel in my newly acquired '68C. The install hit some snags and took 10 weeks- finally got it back a week ago.  Some minor squawks to iron out, and lots of flying and practice needed to get best use out of it. Biggest one is that I've had a couple of squelch breaks on the GTN650 that I hope to stop somehow.  But overall I'm extremely happy .  I particularly love my Flightstream 210 - only downside is that it will slow me down at learning the GTN650, since it's so dang easy to transfer the flight plan from the ipad.

Thanks to Mooneyspace for all the guidance! 

 

 

I was wondering how long you were going to keep the secret! Can't wait to see it in person

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[wombat]

Where did all of your circuit breakers go?   We can't see the right edge of your panel, but they used to be lined up on the bottom next to the yoke, and they have moved somewhere!

[Marauder]

Where did all of your circuit breakers go?   We can't see the right edge of your panel, but they used to be lined up on the bottom next to the yoke, and they have moved somewhere!

Circuit breakers are overrated!

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[DXB]

They are cleverly hidden on the far right by my sub par photography skills - will post better pic soon.