Panel upgrade - do I have to go Garmin?

[Rick Junkin]

@Max Clark I bought my 1989 TLS/Bravo in 2016. The previous owner was a fastidious A&P/IA and maintenance shop owner who had completely refurbished the airplane inside and out. Except for the panel. It had essentially a 1989 panel with the exception of a GNS430. I immediately started planning my panel upgrade. I added and updated only what was required to meet the 2020 ADS-B mandate and kept planning "the big one".

I finally pulled the trigger last year . In that 7 year period Dynon got their equipment approved for certified aircraft, Garmin brought the G5, G3X, and GFC500 to the certified side and developed the GI275, uAvionix brought their equipment into the mix, Aspen kept upgrades coming, and those are just the things I can think of off the top of my head. The point is it's likely that by next year you will have even more options to choose from at competitive prices, as well as not having to suffer some of the growing pains of the equipment more recently available. Inflation will happen, but that's not a great reason to be in a hurry. It sounds like you want to replicate your G1000 experience and there are several ways to achieve that. There may be a few more soon.

Take the opportunity to fly around this year to the places where you can get some hands-on time with the equipment you're interested in and better inform your decision.

Cheers,
Junkman

[DCarlton]

2 hours ago, toto said:

Having had a number of vacuum pump failures in my flying career, in my opinion there is no better upgrade than replacing a vacuum AI with a solid state digital unit. Good luck with the certification today!

Appreciate the encouragement.  I've need had a vacuum failure but you may have far more hours than me.  

[201Mooniac]

You might as well plan to fly it for a year as it will take that long to develop the plan and get a spot at an avionics shop (at least the good ones)

[Bolter]

On 5/19/2024 at 11:52 AM, Max Clark said:

TLDR; Questions on the Aspen (esp. if you have one):

1. An Evolution E5 Dual Electronic lists at $5k - am I going to regret not adding a MFD?
2. I’ve read posts that the Aspen MFD cannot get full details from the IFD due to interface limitations - is this accurate?
3. Besides the vacuum removal, having an integrated GPSS is a big plus - does the Aspen provide enough sensitivity for LPV approaches?
4. Is this just a waste of money and time, should I just wait until I can do the Garmin?
5. Anyone have any secret news on Dynon autopilot I should consider?

Thanks!

 

 

 

The Aspen panel example is my plane, but it was all installed by the previous owner, who definitely knew what he was doing.  Everything talks to each other and works very well.  The AP is an STEC 55x, and I can set altitude and VS on the Aspen.  Traffic is on the Aspen and the Avidynes.  FMS details show up in both places.  The xpdr is a Garmin unit.

I never had glass except a G5 for an HSI, before.  The Aspen form factor does limit how you display data, but this has never been a problem for me.  There are so many ways to use each screen, that you can find the right solution.  I played with things, and came up with my preferred layout to show everything I want.  I like that each screen is a different unit when it comes to backups.  One button, and the MFD becomes the PFD, still right in front of you.  

In case it is not clear, the ipad on the right is in a clever mount he designed.  Gives the passenger something to look at, but quickly removed if not needed.  

[LANCECASPER]

On 5/19/2024 at 8:46 PM, EricJ said:

If the bottom pic is your airplane it looks like there's a KFC225 at the bottom of the stack, just under the IFD440.

I think he was asking what autopilot you were using with your IFD and G5s.

[EricJ]

3 minutes ago, LANCECASPER said:

I think he was asking what autopilot you were using with your IFD and G5s.

Oh, duh...

It was a Century III before it crapped out, but I still had a vacuum AI to drive it at the time. 

[Ryan ORL]

On 5/20/2024 at 11:08 AM, Pinecone said:

One things with the Aspen.  The EA-100 interface to the auto pilot is known to fail at times.  Mine did.  Luckily my shop had one to loan me for a few months until my shop date.

My J went through 3 separate EA100s before I ripped it out for my G3X.  The EA100 unit is junk.

[hazek]

16 hours ago, Rick Junkin said:

I bought my 1989 TLS/Bravo in 2016.

That new panel looks fantastic! I saved the picture for inspiration for mine. I see you also managed the refurbish the electronic trim and flap indicators. Did you buy new or refurbish them?

[Rick Junkin]

8 hours ago, hazek said:

That new panel looks fantastic! I saved the picture for inspiration for mine. I see you also managed the refurbish the electronic trim and flap indicators. Did you buy new or refurbish them?

Thanks! I ultimately bought new, but I did take a whack at refurbishing the originals. Mine had bubbled/warped and I was able to use an iron to flatten them out, but I wasn’t able to get the surface renewed to my satisfaction. They looked ok and I would have put them back in if I wasn’t updating the panel, but decided I’d rather have the new ones.

Cheers,
Junkman

EDIT: Here's a picture of the new versus refurbished indicator lenses. I wasn't able to get the top coating completely stripped off the original lenses.

[Pinecone]

On 5/21/2024 at 11:30 AM, 201Mooniac said:

 and get a spot at an avionics shop (at least the good ones)

That is a big one.  When I booked my upgrade, it was an 8 month wait for a slot.

As for the plan, that also changed DURING the install.

 

[donkaye]

10 hours ago, Rick Junkin said:

 

EDIT: Here's a picture of the new versus refurbished indicator lenses. I wasn't able to get the top coating completely stripped off the original lenses.

Rick, where did you buy the new labels, or where did you have them made?

[Jetpilot86]

While we're at it, is there a source for the labels for the overhead lights on a bravo, mine is plastic and warped.

[Marc_B]

@Jetpilot86 I believe that the overhead light panel you’re referring to may be an electroluminescent panel. They can be overhauled by either Air Capital Dial or Nimbus Aviation. 

[LANCECASPER]

14 hours ago, donkaye said:

Rick, where did you buy the new labels, or where did you have them made?

@Rick Junkin will probably chime in, but when I did the panel on a Bravo I owned, I ordered new lenses.

Any Mooney Service Center can order them. I ordered mine from Dan at Lasar and since Mooney drop ships them I had them the next day. If I remember correctly both of them were a couple hundred dollars total  back in 2018. In the grand scheme of aviation expenses it wasn't much.

The Mooney part number for the Lens, Flap/Trim is 880060-001.

The Mooney part number for the Lens, Rudder Trim is 880058-001.

Edit - here's a post that deals with it:

 

 

[Rick Junkin]

14 hours ago, donkaye said:

Rick, where did you buy the new labels, or where did you have them made?

@donkaye I ordered them through my local MSC, AGL Aviation. $275 IIRC.

Cheers,
Junkman

[PT20J]

Remember that any MSC can order parts from Mooney, but they all set their own markups. LASAR seems to have raised its prices lately and doesn’t stock nearly as much as it used to, so it may not always be the best choice.

[cliffy]

Don't change a thing until you go through your first annual and find any "surprises" to fix,

then start the mod process. 

Too many first time buyers have had issues and BIG surprises on their first annual that threw

out any budget they had in mind.