Reviews of the AeroCruze 230

[Jetpilot86]

Planning some panel upgrades for an M20M and see the options are rather limited.  I've got the Avidyne 440/540 combo, currently the KFC150 with Altitude/V/S select.

Looking at the AeroCruze 230 as it appears to be only one of two certified for the M20's

Looking at Aspen's maybe a 1000/500 combo as well.

Any feedback on these?

[LANCECASPER]

Search is your friend:

 

 

[Jetpilot86]

When I searched last night, this one did not come up. Hopefully there are some updates to it. Thanks. 

[LANCECASPER]

2 hours ago, Jetpilot86 said:

When I searched last night, this one did not come up. Hopefully there are some updates to it. Thanks. 

The search feature on the site gets the job done most of the time, but is not always the greatest. I went to google and typed in: Mooneyspace:AeroCruze 230

[Jetpilot86]

1 hour ago, LANCECASPER said:

The search feature on the site gets the job done most of the time, but is not always the greatest. I went to google and typed in: Mooneyspace:AeroCruze 230

Thanks. I’ll keep that in mind for next time. 

[donkaye]

10 hours ago, Jetpilot86 said:

Planning some panel upgrades for an M20M and see the options are rather limited.  I've got the Avidyne 440/540 combo, currently the KFC150 with Altitude/V/S select.

Looking at the AeroCruze 230 as it appears to be only one of two certified for the M20's

Looking at Aspen's maybe a 1000/500 combo as well.

Any feedback on these?

Why not make your life really easy.  Sell the Avidyne units.  Sell the KFC 150.  Use the proceeds to upgrade to the G3X Touch or G500 TXi, GTN 750, and GFC 500. They all interface beautifully and give you all the benefits of the GFC 500 including VNAV and Smart Glide.  Add a few more dollars and get the GMA 35c Audio panel that interfaces seamlessly with the GTN 750 and have Telligence.

You may say, "But I like the Avidyne better than the GTN".  While I admit to not having a whole lot of experience with the Avidyne, a few things I find troublesome with it are:  At least for me, the user interface is clunky, too much information on the screen, too small Map Page when all that information is presented, flight plan page harder to use than for the GTN, inability to shut off the audio alerts when near terrain, and more that I can't think of off hand.

You just can't go wrong with Garmin in my opinion.  I've had that setup and more Garmin stuff for over going on 10 years in my M20M and wouldn't change a thing, even after that amount of time.

[MikeOH]

@donkaye

Own much Garmin stock?

[KSMooniac]

1 hour ago, MikeOH said:

@donkaye

Own much Garmin stock?

He has his own parking spot in Olathe!

[donkaye]

2 hours ago, MikeOH said:

@donkaye

Own much Garmin stock?

None. Just a former electrical engineer and flight instructor who recognizes and uses and teaches their products after extensive avionics research.

[jetdriven]

6 hours ago, donkaye said:

Why not make your life really easy.  Sell the Avidyne units.  Sell the KFC 150.  Use the proceeds to upgrade to the G3X Touch or G500 TXi, GTN 750, and GFC 500. They all interface beautifully and give you all the benefits of the GFC 500 including VNAV and Smart Glide.  Add a few more dollars and get the GMA 35c Audio panel that interfaces seamlessly with the GTN 750 and have Telligence.

You may say, "But I like the Avidyne better than the GTN".  While I admit to not having a whole lot of experience with the Avidyne, a few things I find troublesome with it are:  At least for me, the user interface is clunky, too much information on the screen, too small Map Page when all that information is presented, flight plan page harder to use than for the GTN, inability to shut off the audio alerts when near terrain, and more that I can't think of off hand.

You just can't go wrong with Garmin in my opinion.  I've had that setup and more Garmin stuff for over going on 10 years in my M20M and wouldn't change a thing, even after that amount of time.

I feel the same about avidyne.  Then you get locked into off-brand autopilots and aspens. Abs this stuff isn’t really much cheaper. But it’s not as good.  

[hubcap]

I know a lot of folks like to hate on Garmin, but their stuff works and it works well….in my experience.

[dzeleski]

I can’t stand the GTN UI and much prefer Avidyne IFD. I really think people get all wrapped around the axle with Mac vs Windows, Intel vs AMD, or Garmin vs Avidyne. They do the exact same thing but with different methodologies and some different strengths and weaknesses, none of them are perfect. And generally whichever one you start with is the team you decide to pick to “support”. If you don’t learn both products correctly then forming an accurate opinion is impossible.

Every time I show someone how to properly use an IFD they understand what I mean when I say it’s easier to use than a GTN. Is it different? 100%. I also much prefer having physical buttons. And the last time I checked the GTNs can’t load multiple approaches, meaning I can have my alternate programmed before I even take off or have my practice approaches fully planned before taking off. Why is that important? Because now I have very accurate live fuel numbers that include the approach when tied to an engine monitor to make sure I have what I need to stay within my requirements.

I would not be replacing a perfectly functional IFD, makes absolutely no sense for how expensive avionics are.

3 hours ago, jetdriven said:

I feel the same about avidyne.  Then you get locked into off-brand autopilots and aspens. Abs this stuff isn’t really much cheaper. But it’s not as good.  

You can have a GFC 500 with an Avidyne navigator. You won’t get VNAV support but that’s because Garmin is such a closed ecosystem they won’t release the protocol. I have two G5s, GFC 500, and a IFD440 in my J. I can also upgrade to a g3x if I ever so desire.

[donkaye]

1 hour ago, dzeleski said:

I can’t stand the GTN UI and much prefer Avidyne IFD. I really think people get all wrapped around the axle with Mac vs Windows, Intel vs AMD, or Garmin vs Avidyne. They do the exact same thing but with different methodologies and some different strengths and weaknesses, none of them are perfect. And generally whichever one you start with is the team you decide to pick to “support”. If you don’t learn both products correctly then forming an accurate opinion is impossible.

Every time I show someone how to properly use an IFD they understand what I mean when I say it’s easier to use than a GTN. Is it different? 100%. I also much prefer having physical buttons. And the last time I checked the GTNs can’t load multiple approaches, meaning I can have my alternate programmed before I even take off or have my practice approaches fully planned before taking off. Why is that important? Because now I have very accurate live fuel numbers that include the approach when tied to an engine monitor to make sure I have what I need to stay within my requirements.

I would not be replacing a perfectly functional IFD, makes absolutely no sense for how expensive avionics are.

You can have a GFC 500 with an Avidyne navigator. You won’t get VNAV support but that’s because Garmin is such a closed ecosystem they won’t release the protocol. I have two G5s, GFC 500, and a IFD440 in my J. I can also upgrade to a g3x if I ever so desire.

I guess it's what you're used to.  When using a GTN, you can load another approach to any airport in the Country when you're on a missed approach to an airport.  It's simple to ping pong off of approaches, as for example, doing multiple approaches to KSNS, KWVI, KOAR, KMRY, all airports within a few miles of each other.  The most time consuming part of that is picking up the weather at each airport.  I did that a couple of weeks ago.  The weather was near minimums at all the airports, so it was good practice.  In fact I had wanted to land at Marina, KOAR, for cheap fuel , but that airport was below minimums, so couldn't get in there.

My initial response was a way to have your cake and eat it too, but then, to use a trite expression, "you can lead horse to water but you can't make it drink".  I can only communicate what 10 years of experience has taught me.

[Mark89114]

Regardless of the buttonology I believe the aerocruze is a bendix king product which has less than a stellar reputation last two decades.  

[Jetpilot86]

Probably not new news here, but I just discovered that the Stec55x is also an option. 

Anyone using one of these as your Autopilot and how do you like it?

[Ragsf15e]

1 hour ago, Jetpilot86 said:

Probably not new news here, but I just discovered that the Stec55x is also an option. 

Anyone using one of these as your Autopilot and how do you like it?

Yes, but tgey are old tech and expensive, so most people are not installing new ones.  If you buy an airplane with an stec already in it, they do work well and are somewhat supported.

[Jetpilot86]

56 minutes ago, Ragsf15e said:

Yes, but tgey are old tech and expensive, so most people are not installing new ones.  If you buy an airplane with an stec already in it, they do work well and are somewhat supported.

Ya, new is steep. I’m looking at Reman Aspen’s to ease the pain some, so if I can co that route with everything else as well, might work out. 
 

The 440/540 stack I bought are factory remans with a new warranty. 

[Ragsf15e]

9 minutes ago, Jetpilot86 said:

Ya, new is steep. I’m looking at Reman Aspen’s to ease the pain some, so if I can co that route with everything else as well, might work out. 
 

The 440/540 stack I bought are factory remans with a new warranty. 

Yeah nothing wrong with remans. I guess what I was saying is that for avionics, the installation cost of old avionics is the same as the installation cost for new avionics. So if you buy an Stec 55, the install is about the same as a GFC500. The Garmin is much newer and better and probably better supported. the final bill is pretty close to the same, but the capability is different. 

[KSMooniac]

Can you even still buy a new 55x?  I thought 3100 was the latest and greatest.... 

[Echo]

Do most of you IFR guys and gals really fly significant weather (with regularity) that the benefits of these wiz bang systems really are applied?  I am really curious and not trying to be confrontational.  I would just have zero interest in flying to low IFR levels and wonder if many recreational Mooney pilots utilize their planes in such a way?  I really liked the STek system (altitude hold and flying the magenta line) as a VFR pilot, (for ease of operation) but hand flying is fun too.  Most of my missions are two hours and so fatigue isn't a big factor.  The money to update a panel (to current tech) is, to me, not well spent in return on investment.  I of course understand that if you have a load of money getting latest and greatest is fine.  Why not just get a latest and greatest Mooney or "gasp" Cirrus?  I fly for fun and yes when weather allows.  This will be even more flexible with retirement coming in a year.  Love looking at the amazing panels many here have on their planes, but it is NEVER gonna happen for me.  I wish there was ability to install older Stek systems that have been removed (like System 30) into older planes for less AMU's.  Like new vehicle prices I find avionics (new tech) prices absurd.  Enjoy the investment you have made.  Just put in the Garmin, says I to you, not to myself in mirror.  It's only money  

[LANCECASPER]

4 hours ago, Jetpilot86 said:

Probably not new news here, but I just discovered that the Stec55x is also an option. 

Anyone using one of these as your Autopilot and how do you like it?

No one would ever install a new one of these in 2023 - 20 years ago maybe.

The Garmin GFC500 and a couple GI-275s would make a lot more sense for the same money. I used to refer to the STec that I had in a Piper Mirage as the STurn autopilot. It was OK but not even close to a King or Garmin autopilot since it’s rate based. When STEC owned it they had better support. Then Meggitt bought them and now it’s Genesys.

A simple STec 30 might be OK but I would never spend what they ask for a STec 55x  these days with any other option out there.

[LANCECASPER]

On 10/5/2023 at 1:48 AM, Jetpilot86 said:

Planning some panel upgrades for an M20M and see the options are rather limited.  I've got the Avidyne 440/540 combo, currently the KFC150 with Altitude/V/S select.

Looking at the AeroCruze 230 as it appears to be only one of two certified for the M20's

Looking at Aspen's maybe a 1000/500 combo as well.

Any feedback on these?

If you have a Bendix King KFC150 autopilot in your panel right now that was a $50,000 complete system back then. It’s still very capable and might need just some tweaks by a competent shop. The AeroCruze won’t do anything that the KFC150 would do.

[EricJ]

There are some AeroCruz 100 installations happening in Mooneys that are looking very nice.    Installations are reportedly pretty straightforward and operation is good.    Expectations from other aircraft installations have been that the AeroCruz 100 should be an easy install, and that seems to be playing out for the Mooney as well.

Fingers crossed that availability will improve in a bit.   I'll get one eventually.

[Jetpilot86]

3 hours ago, KSMooniac said:

Can you even still buy a new 55x?  I thought 3100 was the latest and greatest.... 

It seems so, but the 3100 is not yet STC'd for the Mooney's yet, last I looked yesterday.

[Jetpilot86]

2 hours ago, Echo said:

Do most of you IFR guys and gals really fly significant weather (with regularity) that the benefits of these wiz bang systems really are applied?  I am really curious and not trying to be confrontational.  I would just have zero interest in flying to low IFR levels and wonder if many recreational Mooney pilots utilize their planes in such a way?  I really liked the STek system (altitude hold and flying the magenta line) as a VFR pilot, (for ease of operation) but hand flying is fun too.  Most of my missions are two hours and so fatigue isn't a big factor.  The money to update a panel (to current tech) is, to me, not well spent in return on investment.  I of course understand that if you have a load of money getting latest and greatest is fine.  Why not just get a latest and greatest Mooney or "gasp" Cirrus?  I fly for fun and yes when weather allows.  This will be even more flexible with retirement coming in a year.  Love looking at the amazing panels many here have on their planes, but it is NEVER gonna happen for me.  I wish there was ability to install older Stek systems that have been removed (like System 30) into older planes for less AMU's.  Like new vehicle prices I find avionics (new tech) prices absurd.  Enjoy the investment you have made.  Just put in the Garmin, says I to you, not to myself in mirror.  It's only money  

It might be an airline pilot thing.  Most of my buddies, load up their private birds to take on all the stuff we simply fly over in the big jets.  If they ever have to couple up an approach to mins in the personal bird, it's a planning failure for them, but then just executed.  I decided to not pay for a 2nd engine that comes with a T310R/340A/58TC/58P and I'm finding a few less barrels to burn money in vs the twins.  As it stands, I should be able to kit out my M20M for around $250k, which is the plane, and everything but fresh paint, and over 1000 hours left to TBO.

I guess the short answer to your question is, we'd rather not, but also rather not divert unless absolutely necessary.  In my case I'll be commuting to work in mine, so the more things I can do to give myself the best chance with what I've got, the better.

And then there is that old saying that the battle plan rarely survives first contact....  :-)

Edited October 6, 2023 by Jetpilot86