How far would you go?

[Mufflerbearing]

Is there a point, or what is the point where you would fly commercial than fly your own plane?  I live in Idaho, but have children that are located as far away as Georgia.  I have found that even at this distance, time wise, I can beat a commercial flight all things considered.  My wife has reservations flying that far ourselves other than taking a commercial flight.  What do you do? 

[GeeBee]

Depends on how you calculate the "fun factor". 

To get to ATL you would have to go to Spokane, Salt Lake, then ATL. If your kids are in the ATL metro area, not too bad. If they are in South Georgia, it would be quicker to jump in the Mooney. I live 90 minutes from ATL everything east of the Mississippi is faster in my Mooney even non stops. Everything that is one stop east of the Rockies is faster in my Mooney, Beyond that, I am just having fun and who says you can't have fun?

 

[aviatoreb]

Flying myself should be fun - as GeeBee said - and I think also some version of convenient.  If flying commercial clearly beats the Mooney on either factor, then maybe I go commercial.  It can depend on all sorts of details, like how much flex I have on my schedule (tight work schedules can sometimes take the fun out if I know I will be watching weather the whole time), or if I just want to veg doing it the commercial way, or if I want to bring a bunch of stuff (bikes, etc) for a flexible schedule.  What time of year is it and what is the weather generally.  Anyway it may weigh differently every time even for the same legs.  I just go with the flow.

[N201MKTurbo]

Once I had to fly to Iowa City for work. I figured it would take 6 hours in the Mooney. I decided to take the airlines. It took 11 hours on the airlines....

[AH-1 Cobra Pilot]

1 hour ago, Mufflerbearing said:

Is there a point, or what is the point where you would fly commercial than fly your own plane? 

Hawaii.

[N201MKTurbo]

6 minutes ago, AH-1 Cobra Pilot said:

Hawaii.

Come on man, it's been done!

[David Lloyd]

My wife's parents lived in Carlsbad, NM with limited airline service.  From Charlotte to Dallas was okay but Dallas to Midland or Albuquerque and back to Carlsbad took at least half a day.  The two of us could fly our plane to Carlsbad for a less than we would spend on the airlines, both time and money.  Years of flying private for my job as a regional manager in the Southeast and Mid-Atlantic states, just would have been painful on the airlines. Oh dark thirty on Mondays, when I could leave on Wednesday or Thursday, my plane left when I did.  Airlines weren't quite as flexible.  So, it is a mix of time, money, convenience, distance and weather.

[Niko182]

I flew from Orange County to Sarasota 3 days ago. did the flight over 2 days and made it to New Orleans the first day. It is a lot more fun than taking airlines. Also at 6' 3", an airline seat isn't exactly spacious. I'd rather fly myself.

[Danb]

Anywhere in the country, my wife literally hates to fly commercial since we got the Bravo, having no schedule to follow we’ ll wait out nasty weather.

[jlunseth]

Norway.

In all seriousness though, the point for me is whether it is for business or personal. If for business, I go the airlines because I can work and be served, and not have to fly. And work always imposes a schedule. When doing long trips especially, there is always weather, and you can't always beat the weather, the big iron can beat the weather.

For personal trips, anywhere in North America, except I might think a couple of times about a flying to AK, there is an awful lot of over mountain flying and not many places to get maintenance or help, much more than crossing the Rockies, and AK is a dicey weather situation on the best of days.

[Danb]

8 minutes ago, David Lloyd said:

My wife's parents lived in Carlsbad, NM with limited airline service.  From Charlotte to Dallas was okay but Dallas to Midland or Albuquerque and back to Carlsbad took at least half a day.  The two of us could fly our plane to Carlsbad for a less than we would spend on the airlines, both time and money.  Years of flying private for my job as a regional manager in the Southeast and Mid-Atlantic states, just would have been painful on the airlines. Oh dark thirty on Mondays, when I could leave on Wednesday or Thursday, my plane left when I did.  Airlines weren't quite as flexible.  So, it is a mix of time, money, convenience, distance and weather.

Geez Dave last two times I went to Albuquerque the turbulence was so bad I was considering quitting, not really, but 

[aviatoreb]

Just now, Danb said:

Anywhere in the country, my wife literally hates to fly commercial since we got the Bravo, having no schedule to follow we’ ll wait out nasty weather.

That's it - its all about flexibility.

A truism about weather.  Bad weather passes and gives way to lovely weather.  Lovely weather gives way to nasty weather.  And strategic flying, often we can zig zag around the map to stay in nice weather.  All about flexibilty.

About 2 years ago I flew to Bozeman Montana, and I was impressed that we did it significantly faster than any available airlines option.

[aviatoreb]

Actually, there is one more reason that sometimes business calls for flying commercial.

If the weather is really bad, and the airlines make you late - no one is mad - just blame those stupid airlines and the stupid weather and everyone nods with understanding and forgiveness.

If you fly yourself for business and you are an hour late for whatever reason, its your fault.

I do fly for business, but usually only if I can drive as a backup plan.  Meaning (gulp) within maybe 8 or 9 hours drive distance.  And usually it is ok, flex coming home.

[N201MKTurbo]

Besides, you don't have to wear a mask in the Mooney!

[PeteMc]

We used to fly a fair amount from NY to Spokane.  But always when connected to a vacation and we'd pick places to stop for a day or two along the way. 

 

[Schllc]

The only time i consider commercial is when plane is down, or time doesn't permit me to make weather calls.

Otherwise, i am going in my own plane.  

It is never a cost factor, that would be like saying you own a boat to save money on fish...

Plus, thats why i own a plane!

[Mufflerbearing]

All excellent points!  We are heading down to Scottsdale AZ for the Barrett-Jackson auction which will be the longest small plane flight my wife has taken.  We have flown several times to Salinas CA and she enjoyed that.  Scottsdale is just 5.5 hours but GA will be a bit more of an adventure. 

[N201MKTurbo]

8 minutes ago, Mufflerbearing said:

All excellent points!  We are heading down to Scottsdale AZ for the Barrett-Jackson auction which will be the longest small plane flight my wife has taken.  We have flown several times to Salinas CA and she enjoyed that.  Scottsdale is just 5.5 hours but GA will be a bit more of an adventure. 

My plane has been to your airport. 
 

I traded a plane ride for a boat trip around the lake.

[Amelia]

Yep. The Coast Guard Auxiliary sent me to STL a couple of years ago, insisted it be commercial. Sighhhh. So I left home (EDE) at 0530 to get to ORF for the day’s first departure. There at 0700 for an 0800 departure. TSA ignored my military orders and not-a-security-risk designation, rifled my single carry-on and fondled this old granny. OG was annoyed. Finally to the boarding gate in time to learn the flight to ORD was delayed. For hours. Finally boarded, worried that might not make the ORD-STL connection. A six circuit hold over Lake Michigan . Finally cleared to the gate. Oh. Oh. Oh. See Granny run. Run, Granny, run, Board 1 hour flight to STL. Sit. Sit, Granny, sit. In the takeoff queue, once we were finally cleared for pushback, for well over an hour. No lie. Just after sunset, we lined up for takeoff. Go! Waited in sleet for an hour for the hotel shuttle. Finally got to the hotel to learn no dinner available at that hour. Grrrr. 17 hours en route. Time to spare? Go by air. More time yet? Go by jet.

EDE to STL (or nearby) is an almost door to door 4 hour nonstop Mooney trip. No TSA dimwits. No parking hassles. No traffic to and from the distant big airports. Going by Mooney, I could have left after a civilized breakfast, had lunch with my STL son and his, spent time with dear ones doing fun things, and and been delivered to the hotel across town to my conference tired, but happy. And home with a whopping tailwind afterward. 
 

For me, too far is water I can’t cross in 7 hours at 175 kts. The joy of flexibility is why I own such a fine bird. GA from coast to coast has afforded me time with scattered friends and family, impromptu stops at fabulous and quirky national parks and monuments, legendary towns, sometimes just as an excuse to stretch legs. The geologic wonders of the west, the neat wee airstrips, the good people who run them... why in the Sam Hill would anybody go commercial if they weren’t forced to?

[Hank]

My longest trip so far was a little over 1300 nm each way, and I hit 200 hours total time in my logbook on the outbound trip. Went slow, VFR, enjoyed seeing the sights in the air and on the ground. I counted it as three vacations:  3 days enroute, WV-WY; 5 days on the ground at Yellowstone; 3 days enroute home. My wife had a good time, and I did all of the flying. Beeing a noob, I avoided the mountains, flew through morning turbulence KRAP--BIL--KCOD. Had a great time!

My suggestion is to go for it! Don't be in a hurry, don't go for bladder-busting legs. I've been 4:45 twice [neither on the Big Trip], and while my bladder was fine, I was ready to get out, stand up and walk around way before we finally landed. Dad-gum headwinds!

[kortopates]

Speaking purely of pleaure flying here - not for business flying which is entirely a different topic. But for some us, it has very little to do with beating the airlines schedue or economics of flying GA vs commercial.  Our flying is all about adventure. With an annual flying budget commited as an aircraft owner, that eliminates the concern for transportation cost ecconomics. If economics was an important factor, we wouldn't fly anywhere GA. The only time there is any real competition from an alternative means of transportation is for shorter trips that are driveable when wx and schedule don't always coinicide. But for longer adventures we simply pick our days to fly and its rare we can't use our faster cruise speeds to fly an alternate route that skirts weather systems  or to use our turbo to get above a lot of weather into the flight levels and enjoy the smooth sunshine. But we're never in a hurry to go anywhere. Its not just a single destination for us but the series of destinations we'll visit, such as our last trip before the pandemic in early 2020 to Central America with many fun destinations going and coming back that makes it fun for us. Rarely do we fly all day and then spend the night only to spend another long day in the cockpit to get somewhere. We more typically spend at least 2 nights before moving on to the next destination. Luckily we've always had  ample time for at least a couple multi-week trips every year plus several 3-4 day long weekends through the year; like to go pet the Calif Grey Whales in Baja. But thankfully we've never felt the need to stay aloft as long as possible to cover the most distance we can in a day.  There is one notable exception when we'll fly commercial. For us that has been diving destinations  where we really do want to maximize our time at our diving destination and not be bothered with carrying all our diving equipment (everything but tanks and weights). But we've visited some of our same diving destinations such as Cozumel by both Mooney and commercial for different kinds of trips.

Anyway, every trip we do is much the same, in that its just one leg at a time, whether its a day trip or a near 3 week international trip. Of course the longer trips need more advance planning and often adminstrative paperwork for flying out of the US. But the pre-flight planning is another element of the adventure since logistics is just as important as the flying on longer trips. 

Edited February 23, 2021 by kortopates

[Amelia]

Oh, and about the flexibility of GA: We were invited to eastern Oregon to meet internet friends and see mountain backcountry only available to hearty horsemen and aviators. On our way to a spectacular lodge deep in an Idaho gorge.” Hop in and follow me,” encouraged friend, Skybobb.  

“Not me,” I said. “The Beast stays right here. I want to ride shotgun in an old straight-tail 182 flown by an expert.”  This plane prefers 3000 feet of pavement. But is perfectly content across the entire nation in heavy smoke if need be. And when the airport we’d intended to stop at on the way home, GPI, was closed due to wildfire, I had a handy alternate in my hip pocket, a little side trip down to Davis, CA, to visit a beloved sibling. Match that, United! And home to the Right Coast with a very nice tailwind on my own schedule. This Mooney was meant for travel!

[ArtVandelay]

Besides, you don't have to wear a mask in the Mooney!

You do if you’re in the flight levels, which based on your screen name I assume is often.

[aviatoreb]

49 minutes ago, Mufflerbearing said:

All excellent points!  We are heading down to Scottsdale AZ for the Barrett-Jackson auction which will be the longest small plane flight my wife has taken.  We have flown several times to Salinas CA and she enjoyed that.  Scottsdale is just 5.5 hours but GA will be a bit more of an adventure. 

I remember a few years ago I went with my son to Bozeman Montana fishing - and my plane was in the shop for paint, so we went commercial.  Commercial was supposed to be able 12 hours each way, including 2 connections, so 3 airplanes.

On the way back, one connecting flight was cancelled because of weather in Chicago, which we found out when they rebooked us to DC.  In DC that flight was a typical airline disaster.  After waiting like 6 hours for the flight, beautiful weather, we boarded the flight with a thunderstorm bearing down.  We sat stuck in the airplane for like 2 hours until they allowed to de-board us.  Then after another hour, the crew timed out.  So we were in DC.  Stayed in a hotel.  The next day that flight was cancelled because the airplane didn't arrive since it diverted for a medical emergency.  So then they rebooked us to Burlington VT (my request because then I just wanted to get close) and we got there at around 1am and I was too tired to drive home so we stayed in a hotel.  Then I drove a rental car the 50 mi or so to Plattsburgh where my car was.  Then drove the rest of the 2+ hrs home.  It was pretty much a 36 hour flight home. 12 hours there, 36 home.  To Drive to Bozeman Montana from KPTD is 2,135 miles and google maps says it is 32 hours.

Well at least we had a great time fishing - a river runs through it.

Then two years later I had a conference to go to in Bozeman, so I jumped at it and said YES! And I brought my same son who is a fishing fanatic.  This time I flew N314EB.  Well it was something like 10 hours there, including two luxurious stops, and about 8 hours back including 1 stop. Oh - and his prized fishing rod didn't get munched this time. 

[TGreen]

2 hours ago, Niko182 said:

I flew from Orange County to Sarasota 3 days ago. did the flight over 2 days and made it to New Orleans the first day. It is a lot more fun than taking airlines. Also at 6' 3", an airline seat isn't exactly spacious. I'd rather fly myself.

First stop Demning, NM? Looks like we fly the same routes.