L3 NGT9000 + WIFI Issue

[jamesm]

Hi,

I was wondering if any other Mooney owners have been experiencing an issue where their WIFI connection dropping out?  From their NGT9000+ unit's PIM (WIFI) Module to IPad's connection.

Mine has been doing this for awhile now but wasn't really an issue until I started my instrument training then all the data you really need may or may not be there.  Eventually  reconnects  but It's unreliable my instructor said at some point It quit trying to reconnect with their I-Pad. It's drops out with Foreflight and Fly Q  EFB  EFB apps and two different Ipad's as well.

I noticed that the installer who installed mine used twisted pair wires to the PIM (WIFI) module which is pretty short distance 18" or less.  However some of the wiring diagrams from installation manual seem to indicate it should be shielded twisted pair wires to the PIM (WiFI) module from the NGT9000+.

 

Thanks in Advance,

James '67C

Edited November 17, 2020 by jamesm

[carusoam]

Nice detailed request, James!

Now to find a list of all MSers with L3’s NGT9000....       

This may help...

https://mooneyspace.com/search/?q=NGT9000&quick=1

I see Derek was having some challenges with its communication... might be related...

Best regards,

-a-

[StevenL757]

  On 11/17/2020 at 4:57 AM, jamesm said:

Hi,

I was wondering if any other Mooney owners have been experiencing an issue where their WIFI connection dropping out?  From their NGT9000+ unit's PIM (WIFI) Module to IPad's connection.

My has been doing this for awhile now but wasn't really an issue until I started my instrument training then all the data you really need may or may not be there.  Eventually  reconnects  but It's unreliable my instructor said at some point It quit trying to reconnect with their I-Pad. It's drops out with Foreflight and Fly Q  EFB  EFB apps and two different Ipad's as well.

I noticed that the installer who installed mine used twisted pair wires to the PIM (WIFI) module which is pretty short distance 18" or less.  However some of the wiring diagrams from installation manual seem to indicate it should be shielded twisted pair wires to the PIM (WiFI) module from the NGT9000+.

Thanks in Advance,

James '67C

Expand  

James, I have the NGT9000+ with the WiFi module and have never had an issue in the last 4+ years, and know a couple others with this same setup that haven’t reported anything either.

Inviting Jim @JKeeth from L-3 Harris to comment.  I’ll also check with my shop in the morning, as I need to be there for other stuff.

Steve

Edit:

@Marauder has this arrangement too I believe...adding for his comments/experiences.

[Baker Avionics]

  On 11/17/2020 at 4:57 AM, jamesm said:

Hi,

I was wondering if any other Mooney owners have been experiencing an issue where their WIFI connection dropping out?  From their NGT9000+ unit's PIM (WIFI) Module to IPad's connection.

Mine has been doing this for awhile now but wasn't really an issue until I started my instrument training then all the data you really need may or may not be there.  Eventually  reconnects  but It's unreliable my instructor said at some point It quit trying to reconnect with their I-Pad. It's drops out with Foreflight and Fly Q  EFB  EFB apps and two different Ipad's as well.

I noticed that the installer who installed mine used twisted pair wires to the PIM (WIFI) module which is pretty short distance 18" or less.  However some of the wiring diagrams from installation manual seem to indicate it should be shielded twisted pair wires to the PIM (WiFI) module from the NGT9000+.

 

Thanks in Advance,

James '67C

Expand  

It should be a shielded twisted pair wires as the induced voltage from adjacent wires can and will cause issues similar to what you are experiencing. Any questions, feel free to PM, email, text or call. I will do all I can to help you out. 

[928kc]

i had a problem after recently upgrading the ipad's OS. It would connect then drop, connect and drop etc.  It affected both fltplango and FLyQ.   I do not remember the exact steps needed, but it had to do with resetting the wifi on the IPAD.  There are a number of suggestions if you do a search in google on IPAD wifi dropping.

[Marauder]

  On 11/17/2020 at 6:14 AM, StevenL757 said:

James, I have the NGT9000+ with the WiFi module and have never had an issue in the last 4+ years, and know a couple others with this same setup that haven’t reported anything either.

Inviting Jim @JKeeth from L-3 Harris to comment.  I’ll also check with my shop in the morning, as I need to be there for other stuff.

Steve

Edit:

@Marauder has this arrangement too I believe...adding for his comments/experiences.

Expand  

My Lynx WiFi has worked fine since it was installed. If I have any complaint, it is soooo fast to connect that it beats out the Garmin Wifi connection. I had to set the Wifi "ask to join" setting on my iPad to "on" to allow me to connect to the FlightStream 510 first.

[jamesm]

  On 11/17/2020 at 9:42 PM, Marauder said:

I have any complaint, it is soooo fast to connect that it beats out the Garmin Wifi connection. I had to set the Wifi "ask to join" setting on my iPad to "on" to allow me to connect to the FlightStream 510 first.

Expand  

So do you switch back and forth between NGT9000 for traffic and then swicth to FS510 to upload your flight plan?  The reason I ask I was contemplating on getting a FS510 in the future after my instrument ticket (if when that happens) and was curious to know what other useful capabilities of FS510.

Thanks for all the input.

James '67C

[Marauder]

  On 11/18/2020 at 4:40 AM, jamesm said:

So do you switch back and forth between NGT9000 for traffic and then swicth to FS510 to upload your flight plan?  The reason I ask I was contemplating on getting a FS510 in the future after my instrument ticket (if when that happens) and was curious to know what other useful capabilities of FS510.
Thanks for all the input.
James '67C

The FlightStream only uses the WiFi for database uploads and once you connect to Garmin Pilot, it switches to Bluetooth so you can do flight plan adjustments on the iPad (or GTN) and port it over to the opposite device. If you are seriously considering the FS510, I would give it a big thumb’s up just for the database downloads.

Since I have multiple displays for showing ADS-B In stuff (Aspens, Garmin 650 and the Lynx), I typically don’t use my primary iPad to connect to the Lynx. I will use my FltPln Go app on my cell phone and connect to the Lynx as a backup.


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[Bob]

The WiFi module is a separate unit and is connected by only 4 wires.  Power, Ground and a shielded pair for the RS-232 communication.  The Wifi Module most likely is tucked under the panel and possibly secured by plastic ties.  May be good to locate it and check that the wire connections are secure and also check for proper shielding.   If all looks good, you may want to download the software from the Lynx website.  The Lynx NGT9000 stores fault codes that you can access with their software and should give you a possible direction.

 

[bmcconnaha]

try forgetting the wifi network on your ipad... ive had two lynx units and both exhibit this... my work around is only using the avidyne wifi lol 

[jamesm]

What is the advantage of having 2 lynx units ?

[Airways]

  On 11/23/2020 at 7:52 AM, jamesm said:

What is the advantage of having 2 lynx units ?

Expand  

I’m guessing they were not in one acft at the same time ?

[carusoam]

Requirement for the FLs for altitude separation... RVSM airspace..? 
 

Analog transponders used to croak on schedule... having two would keep you flying...

Best regards,

-a-

[bmcconnaha]

  On 11/23/2020 at 7:52 AM, jamesm said:

What is the advantage of having 2 lynx units ?

One was in my sr22, the other is in my current Mooney. Really like the unit


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[Derek]

  On 11/17/2020 at 4:57 AM, jamesm said:

Hi,

I was wondering if any other Mooney owners have been experiencing an issue where their WIFI connection dropping out?

Expand  

Hey @jamesm, I had an issue that ended up being the wiring between the lynx unit and the wifi dongle.

My problem manifested as being able to connect to the lynx wifi but there was no communication with foreflight.

In my case, of the 4 wires connecting the the Lynx to the wifi dongle (2 data wires, 1 power, one ground), the 2 data wires ended up being twisted and connected to the wrong positions.

Perhaps you're having a connection issue with the power wires.

my A&P noticed that in my J the wifi dongle had likely been kicked by a passenger because it was affixed to the air duct on the passenger side. This didn't cause the wiring issue, but I could see if your lynx was installed similarly that the power wires might have become poorly connected and are intermittent.

[jamesm]

Thanks for the followup question Derek,

I have had a couple of problems with wiring on the PIM (WIFI) module/dongle. I  miss spoke earlier when I had said the installer didn't use shielded twister pair wiring they did. The strip length of the shielding was longer than most that I have seen. In the past I had found that the original installer had way over crimped the pins for the TX & RX signal on the DB9 connector. So over period of time the connection would work harden and break.  Since the NGT 9000 +  was installed in 2017  there was a service bulletin (not sure if was technically  a service bulletin) but L3 support suggested that I grounding shield of the shielded twister pair wiring to the back shell of the connector on the DB9 connector end and run a  ground wire to aircraft ground so I had to add a back shell on the DB9.  Also Apple was having  IOS WIFI connections issues with certain releases of their IOS with the which didn't help the trouble shooting process.

I have flown very little since the fix but the fix looks promising but time well tell.

 

James '67C

[Yetti]

did you try shutting off cell/LTE data?   sometimes things looks at the wrong connection.  

[jamesm]

I have not.  Does shutting off the cell effect Internal GPS signal of the I pad?

If the WIFI problem connection  continue  persist,  I will have give shutting off the cell a try. 

I have to get better flying weather to get more data.

 

Thanks,

James

Edited December 26, 2020 by jamesm

[larrynimmo]

I had my L3 installed in September 2016 and had a lot of issues with loss of WiFi ...in fact, I was losing communication with every single flight....L3 was of little help, they told me several people have had this same issue....finally I found a brand new PMA voltage regulator on eBay for $200...I installed it and in 20 tach hours I have only had loss of WiFi 3 times...all three times was departing KMTN (not my home field) and power cycling got it back immediately.   I consider this a great success.  Prior to changing the VR voltage would go from 13.7 to 15.1v and was never steady...the new Zeftronics model holds a steady 14.0v

changing a VR on an M20J is about the easiest job imaginable...plug and play!  And it so easy to get to the VR on the copilot side ...2 small bolts and it’s out

Edited December 25, 2020 by larrynimmo
Additional detail

[Marauder]

  On 12/25/2020 at 11:48 PM, larrynimmo said:

...the new Zeftronics model holds a steady 14.0v
changing a VR on an M20J is about the easiest job imaginable...plug and play!  And it so easy to get to the VR on the copilot side ...2 small bolts and it’s out

Which is a great improvement over the late model Fs which attached the VR using nuts & bolts through the firewall. Ouch!




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