Pre buy inspection cautions?

[MooneyBe]

Hi all,

Apologies if there is already a thread on this but I am wondering if you all have a perspective on the 'top hit' items to look for during Mooney inspection for a TLS with Bravo conversion. The big things I've gleaned so far are ensuring the engine is healthy and not going to blow up in the next 10 hours :), fuel tanks/leaks, O2 tank inspection, wing spar corrosion, and landing gear (apparently there is a component that isn't manufactured anymore that costs 10+k to repair?). 

Appreciate additional perspectives/considerations and thanks for helping a 'newbie'. Looking forward to joining this community.

B

[gsxrpilot]

52 minutes ago, MooneyBe said:

the 'top hit' items to look for during Mooney inspection for a TLS

#1 is a shop that's done this many times before.

[MooneyBe]

We're looking at Dugosh--bring it home to mama so to speak. 

[gsxrpilot]

They are good. If looking for someone to do a pre-buy, you might reach out to Brian Kendrick, also in that part of Texas. He's independent but with 30 some years of almost exclusively Mooney long body experience. A&P/AI, Pilot. PM me if you need contact info.

[GeeBee]

Make sure who ever you choose has no connection to previous work on the airplane.

 

[MooneyMitch]

4 minutes ago, gsxrpilot said:

They are good. If looking for someone to do a pre-buy, you might reach out to Brian Kendrick, also in that part of Texas. He's independent but with 30 some years of almost exclusively Mooney long body experience. A&P/AI, Pilot. PM me if you need contact info.

+1 for Brian.  He was previously Mooney service manager.  Also Brian performs annual for a good friends gorgeous 2005 Ovation. Brian keeps that beauty in perfect condition.  First class, top notch for Brian.

[Austintatious]

7 hours ago, MooneyBe said:

Hi all,

Apologies if there is already a thread on this but I am wondering if you all have a perspective on the 'top hit' items to look for during Mooney inspection for a TLS with Bravo conversion. The big things I've gleaned so far are ensuring the engine is healthy and not going to blow up in the next 10 hours :), fuel tanks/leaks, O2 tank inspection, wing spar corrosion, and landing gear (apparently there is a component that isn't manufactured anymore that costs 10+k to repair?). 

Appreciate additional perspectives/considerations and thanks for helping a 'newbie'. Looking forward to joining this community.

B

I would recommend  a few  things having done two of these pretty recently...

1. pay Saavy aviation to manage the PPI.  IIRC for around 1000.00 you can get them to do so AND have 1 year of managed maintenance and breakdown assistance.  Not to mention engine analysis if you have the equipment.

2. MAKE them follow a Mooney checklist.

3. YOU must thoroughly look over the aircraft yourself (using a checklist) and look for things that might get overlooked.

The fact is that no one is perfect and despite having highly reputable people do the work for me, there were small things missed by the "pro's" that ended up costing me more money than expected down the road.  Very annoying to find out people missed these things later.

On one of my aircraft for example... the panel had been completely re-done and nice rocker switches put in... What no one noticed during PPI OR the annual  was that the shop that did it completely forgot to put in a switch for the prop heat.  It just was not there.  Luckily we noticed before getting into any icing, but the deal was done and the same shop that goofed this up in the first place charged us to fix it.

I am only a year into owning my own aircraft... it has been great... But I cannot tell you how disappointing the experience with EVERY single mechanic/shop has been.  It seems it may be impossible to find a truly good shop that knows what they are doing and will make it right if they mess up.  Hell, just getting them to do what I want them to do is like pulling teeth.  One WELL known and highly regarded MSC simply refused to adjust my fuel system AS PER THE MANUAL to remedy a low partial throttle fuel flow issue I am having in 1 aircraft.  I cant find anyone with the equipment OR the knowledge willing to follow the F^&*%^ING manual... which repeatedly warns that if the procedure is not followed that YOU WILL NOT HAVE ENOUGH PARTIAL THROTTLE FUEL FLOW.  Everyone wants to do it their own way thinking they know better, charge me 100.00 per hour and leave me with the same issue.

Sorry, I am getting really frustrated with that last bit.  It is pissing me off royally and affecting how I have to fly the aircraft to keep the engine cool.

[Guest]

8 hours ago, GeeBee said:

Make sure who ever you choose has no connection to previous work on the airplane.

 

Why?

Clarence

[GeeBee]

Because you don't know what their relationship is with the current owner or owners.

 

 

[Guest]

18 minutes ago, GeeBee said:

Because you don't know what their relationship is with the current owner or owners.

 

 

Sorry I don’t follow your logic.  A reputable maintainer worked on the plane 5,10,15,20 years ago and are now disqualified form rendering an opinion on it today?

Clarence 
 

 

[StevenL757]

10 hours ago, gsxrpilot said:

They are good. If looking for someone to do a pre-buy, you might reach out to Brian Kendrick, also in that part of Texas. He's independent but with 30 some years of almost exclusively Mooney long body experience. A&P/AI, Pilot. PM me if you need contact info.

The best of the best as far as I’m concerned.

+1

[StevenL757]

9 hours ago, MooneyMitch said:

+1 for Brian.  He was previously Mooney service manager.  Also Brian performs annual for a good friends gorgeous 2005 Ovation. Brian keeps that beauty in perfect condition.  First class, top notch for Brian.

Agree.  They don’t get any better.

[GeeBee]

Depends on how far removed. However I know it is difficult for you to imagine, because you have integrity, honesty and bring professionalism to your shop and you take pride in being a professional. I have seen some pretty wild stuff, like a factory owned service center that pencil whipped a wing bolt exchange 4 years prior. The buyer had the service center do the pre-buy who told him everything was tip-top. A while later at an annual across the country the shop called to say the wing bolts were still factory because the factory inspector's sticker was still on one of the nuts! By that time the previous service manager at the factory shop was gone as was the chief inspector.

Just last year a fellow on our field bought a Mooney M20C with  "fresh annual". We found more rat's nest than a New York subway tunnel. Turns out the guy who signed off the previous 4 annuals has been in a rest home for the last 5 years. His son opened a shop under a new name and signed off the annual with his newly minted IA certificate to cover for Dad. The names should have been an alarm.

If you engage Savvy pre buy they will do the same thing. Seek a shop that has no prior relationship to the airplane or its owners. 

 

 

[RLCarter]

I agree with both @M20Doc & @GEE-BEE, a reputable A&P and/or IA will be working for the buyer and not the seller, with that said I would prefer not to have who ever did the last few annuals do the pre-buy. Fresh eyes are always good, and those eyes need to be familiar with the Mooney gotcha items.

[gsxrpilot]

36 minutes ago, GeeBee said:

Depends on how far removed. However I know it is difficult for you to imagine, because you have integrity, honesty and bring professionalism to your shop and you take pride in being a professional. I have seen some pretty wild stuff, like a factory owned service center that pencil whipped a wing bolt exchange 4 years prior. The buyer had the service center do the pre-buy who told him everything was tip-top. A while later at an annual across the country the shop called to say the wing bolts were still factory because the factory inspector's sticker was still on one of the nuts! By that time the previous service manager at the factory shop was gone as was the chief inspector.

Just last year a fellow on our field bought a Mooney M20C with  "fresh annual". We found more rat's nest than a New York subway tunnel. Turns out the guy who signed off the previous 4 annuals has been in a rest home for the last 5 years. His son opened a shop under a new name and signed off the annual with his newly minted IA certificate to cover for Dad. The names should have been an alarm.

You make very good points. But this seems to point to the problem of finding a reputable and knowledgeable shop, rather than just a shop that's never seen the plane before. 

Case in point, if I were selling my 252, you could probably skip the pre-buy altogether and just get on the phone with JD Casteel, who's done all the maintenance on it over the last four years. He is honest to a fault and in spite of our relationship, would be brutally honest with you about the condition of my Mooney. I would bet he'll know more about my 252 than say Don Maxwell could learn over the course of a week long pre-buy. 

But the prerequisite is finding an honest and conscientious shop... I believe I know a few of them. Every one can make mistakes, but as long as you're dealing with honest folks, I think you're ahead in the game.

[Jim Peace]

37 minutes ago, gsxrpilot said:

But the prerequisite is finding an honest and conscientious shop.

I have a list of who not to call......

Working on the other list......I will not need much paper....