Monroy Tanks

[bill98]

Looking to get some Monroy Tanks for my E Model. Any cons to getting one in an E model? Obviously having roughly ~1000 mile range is a huge PRO!

@Piloto if you can, will you shoot me a PM when you have a chance.

[jetdriven]

Well the principal had a medical issue and  they’re not making or shipping kits last I heard, so for right now, hang onto your money

Edited September 18, 2018 by jetdriven

[Guest]

A client of mine had the Monroy tanks installed by Houston Tank Specialists.  The workmanship sucks, steer clear of them.

Clarence

[Bob_Belville]

An alternative... I have 64 gallon bladders in a '66E. LOP that's about 8 hours w/o reserves. Close to 1000 nm range.

[LANCECASPER]

Have Edison at Wet Wingologists or Paul at Weep No More do it. They've done more than anyone else has other than Jose himself. 

[Captnmack]

Hijack this a bit...anyone remove old tank sealant when installing Bladders?

[ShuRugal]

My C model POH says she'll go 1,000 miles on the stock tanks, if you don't mind taking 6.5 hours or longer to do it:

[Hank]

1 hour ago, ShuRugal said:

My C model POH says she'll go 1,000 miles on the stock tanks, if you don't mind taking 6.5 hours or longer to do it:

That's also solo, no baggage, with oxygen. 

My 1970 C shows similar range at 16"/2300, 12,500 msl and 128 mph at gross (or 145 mph at 2200lb).

But who wants to fly a Mooney that slow??? 51% power.  

[ShuRugal]

27 minutes ago, Hank said:

That's also solo, no baggage, with oxygen. 

My 1970 C shows similar range at 16"/2300, 12,500 msl and 128 mph at gross (or 145 mph at 2200lb).

But who wants to fly a Mooney that slow??? 51% power.  

not me.  I'd need to get out and take a break long before i reached 6 hours.  That's just too long to stay on a high state of alert.

[gsxrpilot]

26 minutes ago, ShuRugal said:

not me.  I'd need to get out and take a break long before i reached 6 hours.  That's just too long to stay on a high state of alert.

Go IFR and let someone else stay on high alert on your behalf 

[Hank]

54 minutes ago, gsxrpilot said:

Go IFR and let someone else stay on high alert on your behalf 

If you can see out the windows, the responsibility is on you, not ATC.

[gsxrpilot]

7 minutes ago, Hank said:

If you can see out the windows, the responsibility is on you, not ATC.

All true... of course... thus the 

At the same time I'm a lot less on "high alert" cruising along in the low flight levels on an IFR flight plan than I am down in the weeds, VFR on a "beautiful for flying" Saturday with all the NORDO's.

[kortopates]

The only con on the tanks is the challenge of knowing how much fuel you have in the tanks since their isn't a fuel gauge in the extended tanks. I found with my factory OEM gauges, they under reported till my tanks where half full of normal capacity (about 18 gals) - since that is the only time when all the fuel is in the main tanks. Certainly not an insurmountable task and much has been written about this elsewhere, but its an added complexity to consider for anyone adding them. 

[M20F-1968]

3 hours ago, kortopates said:

The only con on the tanks is the challenge of knowing how much fuel you have in the tanks since their isn't a fuel gauge in the extended tanks. I found with my factory OEM gauges, they under reported till my tanks where half full of normal capacity (about 18 gals) - since that is the only time when all the fuel is in the main tanks. Certainly not an insurmountable task and much has been written about this elsewhere, but its an added complexity to consider for anyone adding them. 

I just spoke with JPI about this today.  Initially my mechanic calibrated the JPI 930 fuel gauges with 5 data points (max allowed).  Namely, 0, 2,3, 4, F  (corresponding to 0, 1/4, 1/2, 3/4, Full).  Numbers in gallons were assigned to each data point.  I should be able be recalibrate each data point (rename with No. of gallons remaining) using my fur totalizer (which measures actual fuel used by way of the rotary sending in the fuel line).  This should correct for the non-straight line fuel filling in the top 1/2 of the main tanks during which time both the main and aux tanks are filling.  The sender arm will move less with each twenty gallons added, than compared to filling the lower 1/2 of the main tanks.  Once the main tanks are filled, I would list that as known fuel (which may be about 8 or so gallons less then topping off the aux tanks as there is no way of measuring that.  The fuel totalizer will account for it though so there is a way to know accurately how much fuel is used, how much fuel remains (by way of the fuel totalizer) and this can be cross referenced with the gauges from the tank senders.  But, the senders will not be able to account for the last approx 8 gallons put into the aux tanks.  Any other thoughts?

John Breda

[carusoam]

52 gallons in the M20C, gets by with one sensor per tank....

100 gallons in the M20R, uses two sensors per tank...

The wing dihedral makes this mandatory.... the outer sensor will sit on the floor of the tank... the inner sensor hits the top surface...

The tanks are pretty regular in shape and having a set of five calibrated points should work pretty well...

Look into using Cies gauges to be any more accurate than that.  Cies reportedly can be calibrated by the gallon, being 100 points... extra accuracy is good for tank volume users like speed brakes and other hardware...

That takes a serious effort during the calibration... get it done right, the first time...

 

See if you can get all of the following....

• Monroy extended range tanks...
• four Cies digital fuel senders.
• Improved tank vents, (anti-ice/bug collision blocker) or better... reverse NACA vent from a modern mooney...
• jpi 900
• fuel flow/totalizer
• gps 

integrate all that hardware together to have fuel needed to get to your destination and advice if it looks like you will be unable...

Compare fuel used from the totalizer to the Cies system, again advise if they are different.... indication of a tank leak....

PP thoughts only, something I have been thinking about... awhile.

Best regards,

-a-

[jetdriven]

9 hours ago, Hank said:

That's also solo, no baggage, with oxygen. 

My 1970 C shows similar range at 16"/2300, 12,500 msl and 128 mph at gross (or 145 mph at 2200lb).

But who wants to fly a Mooney that slow??? 51% power.  

 That’s also no reserve for range. Which means that 1101 miles the engine get silent

[Hank]

3 hours ago, jetdriven said:

 That’s also no reserve for range. Which means that 1101 miles the engine get silent

Another benefit to my "modern" 1970 Owners Manual:

I tried underlining the part about the included 45-minute reserve, but the tablet editor makes way too thick of a line. So yeah, my plane won't go silent at just over 1000 miles, although I generally use enough power to hold >160 mph true which shortens my range to just over 800 miles + 45 minutes.

Note #3 bears remembering in Southern summers and northern winters, too, and is why she climbed like a homesick angel on that WV winter breakfast run, solo, at 8°F.  

[Bob_Belville]

9 hours ago, M20F-1968 said:

I just spoke with JPI about this today.  Initially my mechanic calibrated the JPI 930 fuel gauges with 5 data points (max allowed).  Namely, 0, 2,3, 4, F  (corresponding to 0, 1/4, 1/2, 3/4, Full).  Numbers in gallons were assigned to each data point.  I should be able be recalibrate each data point (rename with No. of gallons remaining) using my fur totalizer (which measures actual fuel used by way of the rotary sending in the fuel line).  This should correct for the non-straight line fuel filling in the top 1/2 of the main tanks during which time both the main and aux tanks are filling.  The sender arm will move less with each twenty gallons added, than compared to filling the lower 1/2 of the main tanks.  Once the main tanks are filled, I would list that as known fuel (which may be about 8 or so gallons less then topping off the aux tanks as there is no way of measuring that.  The fuel totalizer will account for it though so there is a way to know accurately how much fuel is used, how much fuel remains (by way of the fuel totalizer) and this can be cross referenced with the gauges from the tank senders.  But, the senders will not be able to account for the last approx 8 gallons put into the aux tanks.  Any other thoughts?

John Breda

John, I added 2 more bladder cells and CiES senders to my E this year getting to 64 gallons. Since the short bodies only have one sender per side, I have a similar problem to yours in that the float for the CiES is in the first cell. When we calibrated the CiES to the JPI 930 by adding 8 gallons at a time (empty-1/4-1/2-3/4-full) the factor changed very little from 3/4 to full since the sender was already pinned to the top of the tank. So what happens in flight as the fuel level comes down there is no change to the fuel gauge until I've used about 8 gallons = 1/4 tanks. From 24 gallons remaining to empty the indicated fuel remaining is scary precise. (The JPI displays the fuel remaining based upon the fuel flow sensor right beside the fuel tank level scales. Gotta love it. First time in 50 years of flying I know with a high degree of confidence how much and where the fuel on board is.