Mooneymite Posted September 6, 2018 Report Share Posted September 6, 2018 From AIN: Wrong-surface Events Remain Nagging Genav Issue Calling wrong-surface events one of the top five hazards of the National Airspace System, acting FAA administrator Dan Elwell urged government and industry leaders to make the issue a top priority. In remarks at a recent FAA Safety Summit on the issue, Elwell noted that 1,100 such events have occurred nationwide in the last three years alone. Recently, the number of reported wrong-surface events has increased on arrivals, up 47 percent since early 2016, Elwell said. “The risk is particularly great for general aviation, where we’re seeing a much higher rate of incidents,” he said. Highlighting the summit, NBAA pointed out that general aviation aircraft were involved in 86 percent of the 596 landing/approach wrong-surface events from Fiscal Years 2016 to 2018. Mark Baker, a keynote speaker at the safety summit, cited loss of situation awareness as a root cause of many events and stressed technology can make a significant difference. He backed the promotion of existing and emerging technologies from iPads to head-up displays in combatting wrong-surface events. “In most of the cases we’re discussing, there weren’t any injuries or damage. That’s good news. But it still tells us that something in the system needs our collective attention,” Elwell said, stressing the need for collaboration. Read Expanded Version Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gone Posted September 6, 2018 Report Share Posted September 6, 2018 I remember coming into Wichita from St. Louis (travelling west) in 2015 at 8000' and when I looked out the pilot side window, I saw four (if not five) airfields with N/S runways facing me. Fortunately I was IFR and the instruments were pointing to the correct set of runways. Ok - no real problem, but I could imaging where it might actually happen. Then, last year, on my way to Oshkosh, Detroit Approach had me come around from the east to line up on 03R following a 737, which I had in sight. The controller had me confirm (twice) that I was looking at 03R. Remember that I was on a "visual approach" so they may not have expected me to confirm direction using cockpit needles. I am not certain if he knew I had the ILS for 03R dialled in on NAV1 and DXO (for the missed approach) on NAV2. They were worried about both my seeing which of these four runways was mine and when they could see me on the ground and out of their hair. I landed waaaay long to stay out of the "flare turbulence" of the 737. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Lloyd Posted September 6, 2018 Report Share Posted September 6, 2018 Heck, I had to read a third of the article before being certain about what the were trying to address. No wonder we get confused as to what airport we're looking at. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skydvrboy Posted September 7, 2018 Report Share Posted September 7, 2018 8 hours ago, Ned Gravel said: I remember coming into Wichita from St. Louis (travelling west) in 2015 at 8000' and when I looked out the pilot side window, I saw four (if not five) airfields with N/S runways facing me. Fortunately I was IFR and the instruments were pointing to the correct set of runways. Ok - no real problem, but I could imaging where it might actually happen. You wouldn't be the first, nor would you have been the last. There are airports all over in Wichita, the air capital of the world. I can think of 6 without looking at the map, but I know there are a few more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mooneymite Posted September 7, 2018 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2018 Very interesting to read the details of airliners landing at the wrong airports. Sometimes it was a clear case of "heads up and locked", but more often, when all the details come out, I think, "Gee! That could have been me". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyK Posted September 7, 2018 Report Share Posted September 7, 2018 I tried this going into Key West my first time there. I was focused on the big airport in front of me and tried to set up for NAS Key West. Tower got me straightened out with no harm or foul called. Long before GPS but I did have a kickin Loran on board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mooneymite Posted September 7, 2018 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2018 If Harrison Ford, Delta, Air Canada and Coninental can be confused enough to land (or line up with) on a taxiway, so can I. Those runways and taxiways all look similar... That may be good company, but I'd prefer not to join the club. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Peace Posted September 9, 2018 Report Share Posted September 9, 2018 https://www.flyingmag.com/news/cause-c-17-landing-too-small-airport-revealed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mooneymite Posted September 9, 2018 Author Report Share Posted September 9, 2018 Happens to the pros. http://articles.latimes.com/1987-07-08/news/mn-2686_1_delta-air-lines-pilots https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/ntsb-complex-error-chain-preceded-delta-767-taxiway-336663/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlunseth Posted September 18, 2018 Report Share Posted September 18, 2018 Get an iPad!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricJ Posted September 18, 2018 Report Share Posted September 18, 2018 (edited) On 9/7/2018 at 6:11 AM, Mooneymite said: If Harrison Ford, Delta, Air Canada and Coninental can be confused enough to land (or line up with) on a taxiway, so can I. Those runways and taxiways all look similar... That may be good company, but I'd prefer not to join the club. I dropped my airplane off at Phoenix Sky Harbor on Sunday for some warranty work on the avionics. I was very careful to line up where I was supposed to, not wanting to land on one of the many other options. On final for 7R below. Edited September 18, 2018 by EricJ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1964-M20E Posted September 18, 2018 Report Share Posted September 18, 2018 2 hours ago, EricJ said: I dropped my airplane off at Phoenix Sky Harbor on Sunday for some warranty work on the avionics. I was very careful to line up where I was supposed to, not wanting to land on one of the many other options. On final for 7R below. ohhhhhh multiple choice. I always go with C. Using the ILS for the runway you are assigned helps too once the needle is centered. I've been flying along to one airport on my left and about to pass the center line because I see another airport straight ahead in the distance that I think that is the one I am flying to. ATC calls out Mooney ..3Q the airport is 9 o'clock 5 miles turn anytime you feel like it. Oh yeah I was just lining up with the a a center line Mooney ..3Q thanks That wasn't the first time and probably will not be the last at least it was corrected before landing. We like to think we are out there and it's all us but many times it is a team effort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShuRugal Posted September 18, 2018 Report Share Posted September 18, 2018 2 hours ago, EricJ said: I dropped my airplane off at Phoenix Sky Harbor on Sunday for some warranty work on the avionics. I was very careful to line up where I was supposed to, not wanting to land on one of the many other options. On final for 7R below. Taxiway Hotel is about the size of my home strip... Bravo and Fox look like they are both about the same width, and twice the length... By my count, you could safely have.... 16-24 Mooneys depart simultaneously... one pair for every 3000' of runway and taxiway not adjacent to a building or ramp.... 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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