Attitude Indicator Dying - Replacement?

[Skates97]

I have an RCA 22-7 ADI in my plane which has been dying a slow death. It has been very noisy on shut down as it winds down for quite awhile. Now it is taking longer and longer to stand up after starting. When I flew yesterday it took it about 15 minutes before it finally decided which side was up...

So, I could send it out to Aircraft Quality Instruments http://www.flyaqi.com/gyro.htm and have it overhauled for $360. Or, I could put in a Gamin G5  or a Dynon D10A for about 7x the price. Or, other options I'm not thinking of?

I know what the "practical" thing to do is, but if I am going to go after an instrument rating in the next year or so it would make sense in my mind to just put in the G5 or D10A now. Part of me is hoping that maybe they will have some kind of a discount on one or the other at the Aircraft Spruce Customer Appreciation Day in a couple weeks to help justify spending the extra money... My hangar is at Corona a couple miles from AS so I plan on stopping by.

I know how all of you like to spend other people's money so give me your thoughts. 

[MIm20c]

Do you have a shotgun panel or a standard T?  The G5 will make the scan a little easier if you have a shotgun setup. 

[Guitarmaster]

It really depends on the existing Instruments. What the plan for the future is. How long you keeping the plane.
Personally, I would get it overhauled, but I'm only planning on keeping my plane for 4-5 years.
Longer timeframe; I would go with a G5 or Skyview. The Skyview is the most bang for the buck.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

[MIm20c]

Just now, Guitarmaster said:

It really depends on the existing Instruments. What the plan for the future is. How long you keeping the plane.
Personally, I would get it overhauled, but I'm only planning on keeping my plane for 4-5 years.
Longer timeframe; I would go with a G5 or Skyview. The Skyview is the most bang for the buck.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
 

 Agree but there is a pretty big price gap between 3k and 25k, especially on an older plane. 

[Skates97]

17 minutes ago, MIm20c said:

Do you have a shotgun panel or a standard T?  The G5 will make the scan a little easier if you have a shotgun setup. 

This is an old picture, the portable Garmin on the yoke has been sold and replaced by a tablet. Standard six pack layout.

13 minutes ago, Guitarmaster said:

It really depends on the existing Instruments. What the plan for the future is. How long you keeping the plane.
Personally, I would get it overhauled, but I'm only planning on keeping my plane for 4-5 years.
Longer timeframe; I would go with a G5 or Skyview. The Skyview is the most bang for the buck.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
 

The plan is to have this plane for a long time (of course sometimes plans change). I've been very happy with this plane and it has done everything I need it to. It fits the mission profile perfectly, and the only change to the profile will be when my youngest son moves out and then I'm just flying my wife and I around, which still fits perfectly.

10 minutes ago, MIm20c said:

 Agree but there is a pretty big price gap between 3k and 25k, especially on an older plane. 

No way I'm going to drop 25k into the plane. If I was heading that direction I would sell it and buy a different one that already had it installed. That's not much less than what I paid for the whole plane. 

[Jerry 5TJ]

Friends don't let friends fly with mechanical gyroscopes.  

I've seen solid state RCA2600 AI on the used market under 1 AMU:

  https://m.ebay.com/itm/RCA2600-3-Digital-Horizon-Indicator-PN-102-0203-01-01-/292234375835?hash=item440a86b29b%3Ag%3AvusAAOSwSj1ZgITD&_trkparms=pageci%3A1b027aa9-a18c-11e7-a021-74dbd1801a27%7Cparentrq%3Ab6875c0315e0ab116112f804ffcffe68%7Ciid%3A2

 

 

Edited September 25, 2017 by Jerry 5TJ

[MIm20c]

9 minutes ago, Jerry 5TJ said:

Friends don't let friends fly with mechanical gyroscopes.  

I've seen solid state RCA2600 AI on the used market under 1 AMU:

  

I really like this unit but I’m not sure if it’s a legal option without a battery backup when used as the sole AI. 

[N201MKTurbo]

Do you have an autopilot?

[Skates97]

2 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

Do you have an autopilot?

Nope

[Jerry 5TJ]

10 minutes ago, MIm20c said:

I really like this unit but I’m not sure if it’s a legal option without a battery backup when used as the sole AI. 

Aircraft Spruce claims "The RCA2600 is FAA certified and is perfect for replacing your primary AI or adding as a backup in whatever you fly!"

( It can hardly be worse than a mechanical gyroscope driven by a single dry vacuum pump.)

If your present AI drives an autopilot the RCA2600 won't be your panacea. 

Edited September 25, 2017 by Jerry 5TJ

[HRM]

I am planning to put dual G5's in and lose the vacuum driven instruments completely. I'll keep my vacuum pump for the AP and step, but if I lose it in flight I won't sweat it 

When you take a hard look at the G5 you'll be ready to drink the Kool-Aid. I have a love-hate relationship with Apple and Garmin is so much like them I've decided to just bite the bullet and have a ménage à trois.

[Jerry 5TJ]

1 minute ago, HRM said:

....I have a love-hate relationship with Apple and Garmin is so much like them I've decided to just bite the bullet and have a ménage à trois.

I'm adding a pair of L3 ESI-500s to back up the G500:   You don't absolutely have to join the Borg.  In general though, resistance is futile.  

[HRM]

Just now, Jerry 5TJ said:

I'm adding a pair of L3 ESI-500s to back up the G500:   You don't absolutely have to join the Borg.  In general though, resistance is futile.  

If you have one you can just turn it in right now (CB card):

       L3 ESI-500 (x2) = $10,578

       Garmin G5 (x2) = $5,950

 

[Piloto]

The overhauled option comes with 100+ hours of gas free or a real nice 80" HDTV with recliner, is your pick, check with the boss. 

José

[Jerry 5TJ]

23 minutes ago, HRM said:

If you have one you can just turn it in right now (CB card):

       L3 ESI-500 (x2) = $10,578

       Garmin G5 (x2) = $5,950

 

Sorry, I already had to surrender my CB card when I traded in the Ovation. 

One ESI-500 goes to the left of the G500 as the legal backup & replaces 3 mechanical instruments. 

The second ESI-500 goes on copilot panel and replaces 6 more mechanical instruments.  

Saves 25 pounds & eliminates all spinning gyros.  Wait, I tell a lie -- the yaw damper still has a remote mechanical gyro.  

I like the compact ESI-500 a lot better than a pair of G5 boxes.  The latter are good for replacing AI and HSI.  

José, I don't think the 80" HDTV will fit in the panel.  Too bad.  The BarcaLounger would be a great upgrade too.  

Edited September 25, 2017 by Jerry 5TJ

[Jerry 5TJ]

To get back on topic -- a solid state AI is now competitive in price with a spinning gyro AI.   

 

[Cruiser]

I would get it repaired and wait till your ready to start IR training. By then you will have more choices. Probably cheaper too.

[Rwsavory]

If you're serious about getting your IR and actually using it for traveling, I would suggest that you spend your mad money on an autopilot.

 

[carusoam]

So many answers...

1) If considering the endless upgrade cycle... the L3 fits with the expensive G stuff...

2) If going electric, Compare Aspen vs. the G5.  Aspen adds so much more flexibility.

3) Staying mechanical is becoming less and less of an option over time...

Having the IR is only a hint to the direction you are going.

I made the expensive flying decisions after the IR.

Best regards,

-a-

[Jerry 5TJ]

2 minutes ago, Rwsavory said:

If you're serious about getting your IR and actually using it for traveling, I would suggest that you spend your mad money on an autopilot.

For my initial Instrument rating my CFII didn't allow use of the autopilot at any time during training.   

By contrast P46T transition for single pilot IFR operations stresses use of the autopilot virtually all the time.  

So, no you don't need autopilot for training but yes you should get one for single pilot IFR operations.  

Strictly speaking the OP could just placard the AI as inoperable for now.  CB to the max!

 

[Skates97]

1 hour ago, Cruiser said:

I would get it repaired and wait till your ready to start IR training. By then you will have more choices. Probably cheaper too.

Thanks for all the input everyone. This is the direction I think I am headed. If I do start the IR it is still probably 6-8 months away. I'm looking for a new challenge in training but want to get through annual as well as replace the #1 Nav/Com before starting. My #2 Nav/Com is weak and I want either GPS in the panel or at the very least two working/reliable Nav Radios before starting.

1 hour ago, Jerry 5TJ said:

Strictly speaking the OP could just placard the AI as inoperable for now.  CB to the max!

 

This is probably my immediate future for the next couple of weeks. I need to contact Aircraft Quality Instruments and find out what their turn around time is if I FedEx it to them and have them FedEx it back. I have a couple of trips planned and want to work the overhaul/replacement in between them. (A sticky note to placard it for the first 15 minutes of flight until it wakes up? )

[Guitarmaster]

Also check out Rudy Aircraft Instruments. They did a great job on my AI. Quick turn around too!

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

[ArtVandelay]

I am planning to put dual G5's in and lose the vacuum driven instruments completely. I'll keep my vacuum pump for the AP and step, but if I lose it in flight I won't sweat it 

When you take a hard look at the G5 you'll be ready to drink the Kool-Aid. I have a love-hate relationship with Apple and Garmin is so much like them I've decided to just bite the bullet and have a ménage à trois.

+1, except the plan is in motion, just placed the order.

But I don't have a step and STEC uses the TC and will be losing the vacuum and the electric backup. I figure I will get 24 lbs back in useful load.

I'll have a lightly used vacuum pump and AI for sale when I'm done.

[Bob - S50]

I agree it depends on your future plans.  If you want an autopilot some day and if you want to get rid of your vacuum pump some day, I'd buy the G5.  That gives you an ADI with a battery backup.  It also gives you one part of the Garmin GFC500 autopilot.  And it gives you a backup airspeed, heading, and altitude indicator.

If you don't care about an autopilot (but boy are they nice on long trips or when IMC) then I'd just get the gyro repaired.

[HRM]

11 hours ago, Jerry 5TJ said:

19 minutes ago, Bob - S50 said:

I'd just get the gyro repaired.

My view is that is money tossed down the ....

As you pointed out, a single G5 gives you an ADI with a battery backup as well as  backup airspeed, heading, and altitude indicator. It also starts you towards a glass panel and removal of antiquated vacuum driven mechanical clocks (that's all they are).