Upgrades 7741M

[TWinter]

Just a quick shout out for another great job by Aero Comfort. The side panels came in today and looking forward to getting them installed. The new yokes and glare shield are already at the shop for install. The plane should be buttoned back up within the next few weeks. Couple of quick pics as the newly covered side panels were opened up today. I dropped the avionics panel off yesterday. The shop was resealing tanks. Figured we would reseal while they had them empty for the calibration. 

-Tom

[Guitarmaster]

Looks good!  Glad to see someone else getting their wallet lightened!!

 

[Piloto]

Are you going to have dinner with your new panel?

[TWinter]

4 minutes ago, Piloto said:

Are you going to have dinner with your new panel?

Cleanest place in the house while I let the clear coat dry  She wasn't real happy about it either..lol

[Danb]

Tommy looks really nice, your turning her into the 21century, lot of work  that seems worth it, you've got a beauty.

[Jim Peace]

are the flight instruments going to be in the standard T configuration or are you going with the shot gun layout?

[TWinter]

1 hour ago, Jim Peace said:

are the flight instruments going to be in the standard T configuration or are you going with the shot gun layout?

There will be two Aspens in the center. To the left of them is the MD93 (timer/USB), below that STec 30 AP, far right on pilot's side is 2nd VOR.

The middle is the GTN 750, to the right of the 750 is JPI930 and the old refurbed KX radio below.

 

-Tom

[TWinter]

Shop says they are wanting to get caught up and plan to work all weekend. Owner told me he expects to have 7741M back together and ready for me by next Tuesday...Time get excited. Stopped by yesterday and the tanks were sealed up, right side panel is installed. It's all coming together...finally.

If they get it back Tuesday it will have been 8 weeks under the knife. Now hoping to be able to go the Mooney Homecoming. .A long time in the shop, but lots of work was done.

-Tom

[TWinter]

Went to check on progress...Looking good. Right side of the panel is in. The left side will go in tomorrow. Hopefully have some pics.

The bad news was that one of the Aspens was actually defective from the factory. The shop sent it back and we are waiting for the replacement to arrive. Should just be a extra couple of days..Just goes to show you even something brand new can have a problem. My shop has done several Aspen installs and this was the first he's ever had that was defective from the factory. I guess better that we find out now vs. in the air.

-Tom

[TWinter]

Slow progress is better than no progress. My shop will need to focus on installs and not photography. The glare from the pictures is awful. Here are a few pics from early this morning. I had hoped for completion by Tuesday, looking more like the end of the week. Still lots of tweaking to do as far as lining up the panel. After 8 weeks I'm just happy with any forward progress.

 

-Tom

[Raptor05121]

Wow that looks really awesome. I'm just nit-picking, but I don't like the two different style logos on the panel. Why?

[TWinter]

4 hours ago, Raptor05121 said:

Wow that looks really awesome. I'm just nit-picking, but I don't like the two different style logos on the panel. Why?

Just spreading the old with the new..The new yokes had the new style so I went with that on the panel.

[TWinter]

A few more days and we will be good to go. Fuel calibration by the end of today, finish minor wiring and hopefully a test flight Wednesday/Thursday to set the AOA on the Aspen. It has taken a while but very close. Quick picture from this morning with the Aspens and JPI displays alive.

 

-Tom

[TWinter]

Several days of minor setbacks. Today I was informed that since we decided to remove all the vac components there was an oversight from a IFR standpoint. We are now going to have to have the new Garmin G5 installed. The shop admits the oversight and knows I'm getting frustrated with the delays, so they we are doing the G5 installed at half the dealer cost. Total installed should be about $850 +/-. I wasn't really liking the way the panel came out with the modern style Mooney logo in a vintage bird  above the GTN750 so that looks like a good spot to install the G5. I also plan to apply a matte or satin to the finish of the panel instead of the high gloss of the clear. The clear has too much uneven glare. It's been quite the project, but feeling proud of the outcome. Really anxious to get it ALL finished. 

I should have the plane back tomorrow (Sunday) for test flight of everything else. The shop had preordered 2 G5 units and delivery is expected next Thursday. Install is pretty straight forward so they will install in one day the following week. Reseal of the tanks and calibration was a slower process than they expected for the JPI. On the brighter side the tanks are re-sealed..Going to keep an eye on the fuel senders and see how well they work with the JPI. One is lagging slightly, might be time for a rebuild on them...time will tell. We are closer to the finish line though. Test flight tomorrow afternoon.

 

-Tom   

[carusoam]

What was the oversight? (If Ok to ask)

1) I'm seeing more ways to keep the clean side up than standard. Two Aspens and a TC.

2) How many batteries do you need. The ship's battery, and the Aspen probably has one.

3) Or something really technically quirky like distance from the centerline..?

Best regards,

-a-

[Marauder]

What was the oversight? (If Ok to ask)
1) I'm seeing more ways to keep the clean side up than standard. Two Aspens and a TC.
2) How many batteries do you need. The ship's battery, and the Aspen probably has one.
3) Or something really technically quirky like distance from the centerline..?
Best regards,
-a-

The Aspen installation requires a separate attitude indicator as part of the STC. Ironic, since both Aspens have the ability to run their own AI from independent AHRS and each has their own backup power supply.

Tom - I would verify that a G5 qualifies as part of the STC requirement for the Aspen. I think with the reg change, it does. But since they missed the original requirement for the Aspen, I would double check.


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[Marauder]

Several days of minor setbacks. Today I was informed that since we decided to remove all the vac components there was an oversight from a IFR standpoint. We are now going to have to have the new Garmin G5 installed. The shop admits the oversight and knows I'm getting frustrated with the delays, so they we are doing the G5 installed at half the dealer cost. Total installed should be about $850 +/-. I wasn't really liking the way the panel came out with the modern style Mooney logo in a vintage bird  above the GTN750 so that looks like a good spot to install the G5. I also plan to apply a matte or satin to the finish of the panel instead of the high gloss of the clear. The clear has too much uneven glare. It's been quite the project, but feeling proud of the outcome. Really anxious to get it ALL finished. 
I should have the plane back tomorrow (Sunday) for test flight of everything else. The shop had preordered 2 G5 units and delivery is expected next Thursday. Install is pretty straight forward so they will install in one day the following week. Reseal of the tanks and calibration was a slower process than they expected for the JPI. On the brighter side the tanks are re-sealed..Going to keep an eye on the fuel senders and see how well they work with the JPI. One is lagging slightly, might be time for a rebuild on them...time will tell. We are closer to the finish line though. Test flight tomorrow afternoon.
 
-Tom   

Tom - I saw your new panel picture. I didn't see an ASI or altimeter in the panel. Does your Aspen MFD have the extended battery in it?

If not, you have another issue to deal with. In order to remove the mechanical airspeed indicator and altimeter, the MFD is required to have the extended battery. This is an issue since the MFD with the extended battery is $1,000 more and requires a special mounting of the battery external to the unit. Sorry if this is bad news.


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[Oscar Avalle]

I am also looking at the G5 to get rid of the my AT and the stand by system. May be a way around this is that the G5 is the primary... and the ASPENs the back up...

 

Oscar 

[TWinter]

According to them the G5 will meet the requirements..He gave me the option of the Garmin G5 or the Sandia. He was leaning toward the G5 so that was what I went went with. As far as the Aspen and the back-up/extended battery..yes we did do that so we have that base covered. They just had the oversight on the requirement of the separate AI. I was surprised when they hit me with that about the G5, but they admitted and apologized for the misquote. hence the discount he offered. I'm not really sure how the oversight happened, because they do Aspen installs on a very regular basis.They have been in the avionics business since before most of us were born. I think what threw the wrench in the mix was the fact I had all the vac instruments removed. Not something that is done all the time. They also had a twin in the shop they were also taking all vac components out and they also notified the owner of that plane about the need for the extra G5 requirement. They were just getting started on his so he opted to keep the vac components and not go with the G5. Not sure the shop extended the discount since they were just getting started and his still had much of the vac system still in tact. It's early and only one cup of coffee so if this runs on or is not making sense..I'll re-read after cup three.   Trying to wake up so the owner of the shop and I can meet up this morning and give it the flight trail. Absolutely nothing in the plane is the way it was..all the way down to yokes, interior, panel and avionics..I'd be a liar if I said I wasn't a little apprehensive. Probably need to cut the coffee to 3 cups instead of my usual Sunday morning 4-5. lol

 

 

-Tom

   

[LANCECASPER]

On the Ovation that I sold, the previous owner when he installed a dual Aspen had to install an Electric Attitude with battery backup (since the vacuum system was removed), and leave the Altimeter and Airspeed indicator.

 

It's my understanding that the G5 is only certified as a replacement for an Attitude Indicator or Turn Coordinator.

http://newsroom.garmin.com/press-release/featured-releases/garmin-introduces-g5-electronic-flight-instrument-certificated-aircr

 

I think the Sandia Quattro is certified for backup for all of the six pack. Tons of info to wade through here: http://www.beechtalk.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=112613&hilit=sandia+quattro

 

[Yetti]

I have done Information Technology for 25 years.    The last system I upgraded, I made them test every function on the new version.  Every button every click.  That equated to 600 tests. The goal was a flawless conversion that none of the users knew about.  The only thing the users should see is the new features and stuff that was broken, now working.

Has anyone ever designed a test program for the new panels like this?   You have several vendors to integrate and several platforms.   How do you know it all works before you get up there and need to rely on it?

I have about 20 hours behind a G1000.   My comment was :"Every time you fly it you learn something new"

[gsxrpilot]

I've been doing quite a bit of research myself on this. I'd love to eventually have an all glass/electric bird without a vacuum system.  So here's what I understand...

One Aspen panel - remove Turn Coordinator and DG/HSI
Two Aspen panels - remove VSI
Extended battery backup for second Aspen - remove Altimeter and ASI
Backup electric AI - remove vacuum AI and entire vacuum system

The G5 will work as the backup electric AI.
Something like the L3 ESI-500 can serve as the backup electric AI AND the backup Altimeter and ASI therefore eliminating the need for the extended battery on the second Aspen.

 

[Marauder]

I've been doing quite a bit of research myself on this. I'd love to eventually have an all glass/electric bird without a vacuum system.  So here's what I understand...
One Aspen panel - remove Turn Coordinator and DG/HSI
Two Aspen panels - remove VSI
Extended battery backup for second Aspen - remove Altimeter and ASI
Backup electric AI - remove vacuum AI and entire vacuum system
The G5 will work as the backup electric AI.
Something like the L3 ESI-500 can serve as the backup electric AI AND the backup Altimeter and ASI therefore eliminating the need for the extended battery on the second Aspen.
 

Close. You can remove the VSI with a single Aspen. You can remove the turn coordinator with one Aspen IF you don't need the TC for the autopilot (us STEC owners need them).

The big question is the AI. I elected to keep the vacuum AI in. I'm fine with the vacuum system in the plane, but at over $600 for a new pump, if it fails I will most like move to a glass backup.


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[Marauder]

I have done Information Technology for 25 years.    The last system I upgraded, I made them test every function on the new version.  Every button every click.  That equated to 600 tests. The goal was a flawless conversion that none of the users knew about.  The only thing the users should see is the new features and stuff that was broken, now working.

Has anyone ever designed a test program for the new panels like this?   You have several vendors to integrate and several platforms.   How do you know it all works before you get up there and need to rely on it?

I have about 20 hours behind a G1000.   My comment was :"Every time you fly it you learn something new"

I was the test pilot for the new glass panel in my plane. It took me 10 solid hours and most of it with an instructor buddy to get comfortable with a plane that I owned for 22 years prior to the upgrade.

Some of it was due to the buttonology of the GPS and new features available. Others were due to how the new technology functioned over the old stuff. A good example was the usage of the AI. A 10° climb on my mechanical AI was a lot less dramatic looking than on my Aspen's AI.

Another adjustment was flying using tapes. It was a real adjustment to look at real numbers and not the mechanical analog version. I eventually needed to cover the ASI up to make the transition. After 3.5 years, I am using the tapes exclusively.

There are some major benefits with glass. The information is all there in front of you. How long before the next way point? It's there. Am I in icing temps? It's there. What are the winds aloft? It's there.

When I hear people talk about glass as something that isn't needed, that's fine. But making that jump for me was the best thing (aside of the STEC 60-2) that I installed in the plane. Just adds so much more awareness which I find extremely beneficial in IFR flying.

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[gsxrpilot]

I'm really looking forward to glass. I'm in possession of the Aspen PFD 1000 Pro and will be getting it installed in the next few weeks.