bonal Posted August 2, 2015 Report Share Posted August 2, 2015 Well I'm posting this as separate from my usual "today's flight" so coming into home field was a bit low on short accoss the numbers at 75 things seemed OK sight picture looked normal and I pulled power ready to settle it onto the gear the bottom dropped out and we bounced hard. I firewalled the power and before I could get the flaps in we nosed up and hit the skid. The stall was just about to happen when I got the nose to drop. Took a eternity to get positive rate but eventually things got normal. Went around and every thing went fine. Cross winds were as always perhaps lighter than usual. Second landing was OK and gear is fine. I've alwat wondered what a hard landing really was now I know. Right now my adrenaline is running way high and needed to post this to help myself relax. No idea what happened but I do know it could have been a lot worse. I'll be doing a close inspection to make sure everything is ok Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbridges Posted August 2, 2015 Report Share Posted August 2, 2015 maybe a gust disappearing or the wind suddenly slowing during the flare? It's God's way of keeping us pilots humble. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonal Posted August 2, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 2, 2015 I'm going to replay this in my head for quite some time right now I'm so pissed at myself Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbridges Posted August 2, 2015 Report Share Posted August 2, 2015 I'm going to replay this in my head for quite some time right now I'm so pissed at myself It's funny how you quickly forget about the 99 greasers you did before you turded up a single landing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryoder Posted August 2, 2015 Report Share Posted August 2, 2015 Clearwater airpark. KCLW has trees all around. I have never seen both windsocks pointing the same way. Some landings there are iffy to say the least. I came in with a friend a few months ago and the ASOS was reporting variable with gusts. Nobody was in the pattern. I came in and after I cleared the trees my stabilized descent turned into crap and I had trouble tracking centerline. I did a go around. Next time the situation was completely different and I made a nice landing. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danb Posted August 2, 2015 Report Share Posted August 2, 2015 I've had horrendous landings recently and was positive I forgot how to fly, I went to a maxwells for my annual a few weeks ago and he asked me about my landings because ha said he almost rolled it up a coupled times he took off he belly and readjusted everything and still no good, he proceeded to work on th yoke and it was hanging up and readjusted and repaired now I'm landing properly again I assume sometimes our planes get out of kilter and if it happens slowly were just adjusting our skills to make it right it took a couple of landings on the way home from Tx now all is well my point is if it continues to happens get the plane checked its not always us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marauder Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Well I'm posting this as separate from my usual "today's flight" so coming into home field was a bit low on short accoss the numbers at 75 things seemed OK sight picture looked normal and I pulled power ready to settle it onto the gear the bottom dropped out and we bounced hard. I firewalled the power and before I could get the flaps in we nosed up and hit the skid. The stall was just about to happen when I got the nose to drop. Took a eternity to get positive rate but eventually things got normal. Went around and every thing went fine. Cross winds were as always perhaps lighter than usual. Second landing was OK and gear is fine. I've alwat wondered what a hard landing really was now I know. Right now my adrenaline is running way high and needed to post this to help myself relax. No idea what happened but I do know it could have been a lot worse. I'll be doing a close inspection to make sure everything is ok Welcome to Mooney landings. It doesn't take much for your Mooney on landing to go from your best friend to "who invited Satan into the cockpit?". I don't care if you are a 20 hour Mooniac or a 10,000 hour Mooniac, there are just certain times the right conditions are setup to botch a landing. The challenging part is recognizing when it is going too far and doing a go around. One of the Mooneys on my field, an Ovation, found out the hard way this past week. If you porpoise, do it once, try to salvage it, do it twice, try a little harder. On the third porpoise, you better be in go around mode. He didn't and hit his prop... Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N33GG Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Don't feel special. You aren't the first to drop one in. It's called learning. Hard to really learn when everything goes right. It happens to the best, most experienced, and most rated pilots too. Don't ask me how I know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Vivian Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 High temps and gross weight turns a Mooney into a different animal! There is not much lift over a hot runway. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboy0681 Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 I've always felt that windsocks should be mandatory on the left side of the threshold at every runway. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oscar Avalle Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 I fly out of and thus land on an airport with very tricky winds. Unless it is hard IFR, winds are always gusty above 14 kts. Thus it is normal to have to work the landing very hard. The point is I could see myself in a similar predicament as you. I would say that it is just a question of bad luck what happened to you. There are so many different things that could have happened that put you in this corner. So don't worry too much about it Just go back ASAP and you will see how things get back to normal, including your selfconfidence and your bruised Ego. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MooneyPTG Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 If you didn't wreck the plane...it was a good landing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bravoman Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 It's funny how you quickly forget about the 99 greasers you did before you turded up a single landing. Rob, I think I heard you on approach freq today, coming out of Gainesville heading back to Perry. I was heading back to PDK from Laurens SC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbridges Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Rob, I think I heard you on approach freq today, coming out of Gainesville heading back to Perry. I was heading back to PDK from Laurens SC wasn't me. There is someone on this board that is 5099Q instead of my 6099Q, maybe it was him? Getting ready for deer season in a few months? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bravoman Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 wasn't me. There is someone on this board that is 5099Q instead of my 6099Q, maybe it was him? Getting ready for deer season in a few months? It was him for sure. Pretty similar N #s! Starting with the food plots next month. Too hot to do much work out there in August. How about you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonal Posted August 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Thanks for the kind words, I'll feel better once I know I didn't hurt anything. I'll tell you having that nose pointed so high that stall horn blaring and just waiting for the lift to break was one tense moment that lasted too long to suit me. I think my wife handled it better than Me. She has so much faith in my piloting I have to make sure to always deserve it. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbridges Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 It was him for sure. Pretty similar N #s! Starting with the food plots next month. Too hot to do much work out there in August. How about you? Probably not. My son got a buck last season, and I think it scratched his itch. High school football pretty much dominates the fall in our family. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DS1980 Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Get back into the airplane and go flying. If you dwell on it, fear will set in after the anger at yourself. I took the "8 second ride" in a Mooney and thought it would be great to take a break and reflect. I couldn't get into an airplane for 2 years. When the doubt sets in, you're done for a while. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyNameIsNobody Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 You'll have that...(Bad landings) The more experience we get, the better we land, the more critical we are of ourselves. Yes do a critique. Then stop beating yourself up or worrying. It happens. Sounds like the practice opportunity is on retrimming/configuring in a go around situation. You can simulate that at 4,000 feet. Opportunity to practice. Glad it worked out O.K. I have one Cessna and one Mooney landing burned into my brain...and one bounce/go-around in the Mooney....All worked out fine. Two were a "What the %$&^" fearfest and one was expected. I beat myself up pretty good as I had others on board both times and I wanted to NOT do that again as I was NOT in control/along for the ride... So far so good...until next time. DUM DUm dummmmmm.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob - S50 Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 Everybody makes a bad landing now and then. Lord knows I've made my share of them in multiple types of aircraft. Its usually followed with me saying 'take that runway!' I find that we go through a stretch when we grease everything. Then a couple weeks when you can't buy a good landing. Comes and goes. However, your tale makes me think about two lessons learned: 1. Do not fly a dragged in final. I see that a lot while waiting to take off. If we fly a very shallow final and the 'bottom drops out' we'll find ourselves on the ground short of the runway. Plus, being drug in means we are carrying more power than normal. That means more prop induced airflow over the inner wings which means more prop induced lift. When we finally chop the power, the reduction in power will tend make the bottom drop out even more. 2. While we don't want to fly too fast on final, we don't want to fly too slowly either. I get nervous when I fly with one of my partners when he lands because he sometimes flies too slowly on final for my taste. I don't like hearing the stall warning in the flare while I'm still stopping my sink rate. I prefer 80, slowing to 70 over the fence. He is often down around 65. If we are too slow and there is a wind shift, gust, or wind shear that results in a loss of airspeed; we just ran out of energy, altitude, and ideas all at the same time. Bob 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonal Posted August 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 1. Do not fly a dragged in final. I see that a lot while waiting to take off. If we fly a very shallow final and the 'bottom drops out' we'll find ourselves on the ground short of the runway. Plus, being drug in means we are carrying more power than normal. That means more prop induced airflow over the inner wings which means more prop induced lift. When we finally chop the power, the reduction in power will tend make the bottom drop out even more. Re Playing the landing I think this may be most likely what I did wrong. Also the possibility of down drafts caused by up wind hangars (always a concern here) I should have seen the signs and gave up on the landing with a go around sooner. I don't know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cruiser Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 An AoA indicator would have been a great help in your situation. I just installed one and I am much more confident in making trim/power adjustments for landings. It sounds like you were very much on the backside of the power curve coming in. IN the long bodies that configuration can generate very good landings at 1.1Vso with minimual roll out. BUT, you must, I repeat, you MUST carry the power all the way to the flare. As pointed out above, there is very little energy left to convert from airspeed to flare and pulling the power at the same time turns the prop into a brake that will help stop the airplane from flying quickly. IF you are not on the ground by then you will be shortly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonal Posted August 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 I'm really dwelling on this but as such I don't think I was dragging it in as I thought. I'm pretty certain I had power at about 10 to 12 MP as I crossed the numbers I know on the early part of the final I was behind the curve but able to reduce power once the GS was there. Given the most likely case as being a loss of lift based on a shift in wind direction (not uncommon) and based on that I should have been aware and carried more speed to the flare. I am going to dwell on it for some time for lessons learned and get back to flying ASAP. My wife says my best landings are when I'm high and fast and go a little long. All the comments and suggestions are well received. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob_Belville Posted August 3, 2015 Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 My wife says my best landings are when I'm high and fast and go a little long. Sure wish my wife was a CFI. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonal Posted August 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 3, 2015 I hadn't though of that context but I just got my first chuckle since this happened 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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