First flight on my M20E and I have a maintenance issue

[wombat]

I bought my plane earlier this week and got out to go flying this evening.   When pushing back after landing I noticed it was dripping fuel out of a small drain just on the pilot's side of the nose gear doors.  It was pretty steady at about a drip every second or two.   If I turn the fuel selector to "OFF" it will stop, otherwise it continues to drip. It didn't do this on Monday when the seller and I flew it 3.1 hours total and it wasn't dripping at all during the inspection.  If I turn the boost pump on it sputters and streams out.   That drain (In the picture attached it is the one circled in red) is coming right out of the electric boost pump.  The green circle is around the drain that you can actuate next to the fuel selector; that one is fine.

 

Any ideas on what I can do other than just take it in and have the pump overhauled or replaced?  Is this fairly common?

 

Bummer that my plane is grounded on the first week.

[N201MKTurbo]

Bummer....

[MB65E]

When was the last time the electric pump was overhauled? The dukes pump requires calander overhauls. There are accessory shops that can service the pumps. Is will only leak out the vent as you described if there is an issue.

Good luck!,

-Matt

[cliffy]

Your pump is leaking internally. You are grounded until it is repaired or overhauled.

[pinerunner]

This rings a bell. Mine started with a bit of dripping and progressed to quite a puddle under that tube. As you said turning the fuel selector to "Off" stopped the dripping. When it happened to me my mechanic found a pretty good place to get it rebuilt and the cost didn't go over a grand. Following that repair the fuel pump hit me with a seized up electric motor (bet the two problems were connected) with in a month that they fixed for free since it was so close to the original repair. I was grounded for a bit but it wasn't so bad. Welcome to vintage airplane ownership.

[carusoam]

Probably a couple of seals for a few hundred dollars...

Keep your eyes open for all things that can age....

Use it or not, seals on electric pumps fail over time.

Was it hard to get started? When the seal leaks, the fuel goes to the ground instead of the engine. No prime, fire-up takes a few more blades.

Good luck,

-a-

[Rhumbline]

Same thing happened with me soon after I bought my plane. Overhaul or replace are probably your only options. You might try a search of the forums for information on the topic as I recall that there are at least a couple threads with good information relating to the options available depending on the route you wish to take.

[bhilgy]

Bought my Mooney in April and the flap relay went out during the first flight.  I've heard from almost every new aircraft owner of these first month bugaboos....particularly those planes that have sat for a while (mine had less 20 hours in the last 5 years).  That's my only maintenance issue with 80+ hours in the first 3 months so that may give you some encouragement!

[mooniac15u]

Welcome to vintage airplane ownership.

 

The one constant through my 9 years of Mooney ownership is that they periodically start leaking. Fuel, oil, hydraulic fluid, battery fluid...

 

My current Mooney is in the shop right now for a hydraulic fluid leak.

[DaV8or]

The one constant through my 9 years of Mooney ownership is that they periodically start leaking. Fuel, oil, hydraulic fluid, battery fluid...

 

My current Mooney is in the shop right now for a hydraulic fluid leak.

 

No kidding. I have had both brake calipers leak and this last annual I finally replaced the left caliper cylinder, piston and seal with brand new, not "reconditioned" and so far so good. I have also had one master cylinder leak, my flap master cylinder leak and my parking brake leaks, so I don't use it. I have had numerous oil leaks and many monies later, at least the oil doesn't make it to the ground. Oh yeah, one of my fuel tanks leaks too, but only on rare occasions, and it is seldom, so I'm not touching that thing until there are puddles everywhere I go.

 

As to the initiation into vintage plane ownership, I started seeing signs of generator failure on the flight home from picking it up. About four flights later, the generator was failing and the battery going dead. That was my first between annual visit to the shop and there have been many since. Mechanics tell me my plane is in great shape for 1966, but it just keeps failing here and there all the same.

 

Thankfully, I spent many years buying, selling and driving vintage cars and I learned that vintage machines just do that. No matter how much money you throw at them and proactively replace things, they will still always, always break down. I bought my plane with eyes wide open and have expected and budgeted for between annual failures from day one. It is what it is.

 

To the OP- I feel your pain and disappointment. It sucks. The best advice I can give is, if you don't have loads of money (and I'm guessing that is the case because you bought a vintage Mooney) then go get tools if you don't already have them, get instruction where needed and find an IA that will let you do the work with his sign off. Also get your Mooney to a reputable MSC for the next annual and do owner assist. Some of the MSCs do allow it these days. If it's not too far, I recommend LASAR in California.

[Mooneymite]

.

As I recall, the Dukes fuel pump was the very first thing I ever had to have overhauled on my 'C'.  Back in '98, complete overhaul was something around $300; it's been good ever since, but I suspect I'm coming up on another "refresher".

 

I'm not sure there's a relationship between "hours used" and rebuild, or whether it's just a calender thing, but I sure wish that there was a pump-on annunciator that would work better than my memory.  I hate doing my cruise check list and finding the electric pump still running.

[yvesg]

Just had a vacuum pump failure last weekend on my way back from Oshkosh. It had 1100 hours on it. It is getting fixed today.

Yves

[fantom]

Just had a vacuum pump failure last weekend on my way back from Oshkosh. It had 1100 hours on it. It is getting fixed today.

Yves

Fixed or replaced????

With 1,100 hours on a vacuum pump, you more than got your $ worth.

[DaV8or]

Just had a vacuum pump failure last weekend on my way back from Oshkosh. It had 1100 hours on it. It is getting fixed today.

Yves

 

That's great service from a dry pump! Congrats!

[scottfromiowa]

You'll have that. Sorry you only got a week before the AMU's started to flow...hang in there.

[wombat]

A week?  I got 2 days and a single 1.3 hour flight!   *laugh*

 

I realize that this is part of the cost of owning one of these aircraft; I'm not particularly worried about it.  If I can have it overhauled I will, but suspect that it may be a replacement required.   The pump I have is the dukes one, but I couldn't read a model number off of it.

 

Does anyone know, are the Weldon pumps STC'd?  I see model 18020-A listed on aircraft spruce as being for the 'E, but I don't know if that's available for all serials or years.

[yvesg]

Fixed or replaced????

With 1,100 hours on a vacuum pump, you more than got your $ worth.

The issue is getting fixed by the replacement of the pump. Pump cost is $350 Cdn and two hours of labor.

Yves

[Marauder]

A week? I got 2 days and a single 1.3 hour flight! *laugh*

I realize that this is part of the cost of owning one of these aircraft; I'm not particularly worried about it. If I can have it overhauled I will, but suspect that it may be a replacement required. The pump I have is the dukes one, but I couldn't read a model number off of it.

Does anyone know, are the Weldon pumps STC'd? I see model 18020-A listed on aircraft spruce as being for the 'E, but I don't know if that's available for all serials or years.

My F with the IO-360 A1A was converted to the Weldon. I thought there was some sort of service bulletin that talked about the change over -- mine was done back in the 90s.

[takair]

A week?  I got 2 days and a single 1.3 hour flight!   *laugh*

 

I realize that this is part of the cost of owning one of these aircraft; I'm not particularly worried about it.  If I can have it overhauled I will, but suspect that it may be a replacement required.   The pump I have is the dukes one, but I couldn't read a model number off of it.

 

Does anyone know, are the Weldon pumps STC'd?  I see model 18020-A listed on aircraft spruce as being for the 'E, but I don't know if that's available for all serials or years.

It is a new PMAd replacement for the Dukes pump. Just did mine a few weeks ago. There is another thread on the subject. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions about the installation.

[Bob - S50]

A week?  I got 2 days and a single 1.3 hour flight!   *laugh*

 

I realize that this is part of the cost of owning one of these aircraft; I'm not particularly worried about it.  If I can have it overhauled I will, but suspect that it may be a replacement required.   The pump I have is the dukes one, but I couldn't read a model number off of it.

 

Does anyone know, are the Weldon pumps STC'd?  I see model 18020-A listed on aircraft spruce as being for the 'E, but I don't know if that's available for all serials or years.

We had to have our Dukes repaired (the impeller split into 4 pieces).  We sent it to Aeromotors LLC in Wisconsin.  They only had it for 2 days before it was back in the mail to us.  If I remember right, it was about $600 or so.

 

Here is their website:

 

http://www.aeromotorsllc.com/aeromotorsllc/

 

Good luck,

 

Bob

[DrBill]

There is a kit from Mooney (c$2000 ?) that converts it to a Weldon (8163-A) but Weldon just came out with an exact replacement for the Dukes(18020A). The 8163 fits a J model or an E or F with the  Mooney Kit (fuel lines and bracket).

Bill

[MB65E]

Speaking of the plumbing down there...Anyone have any instructions on cleaning the inline filter after the Dukes pump. There was an SB that was for the install, but I've not seen it as a service item. Actually, untill I read the SB for the install, I didn't know it was a filter untill then. I have always cleaned gascalator and Inlet screen to the fuel serv, they have always been clean. I'll re-read the Install SB and see if there is any info in there...

222B was the filter install SB, no mention of servicing procedures.

Thanks,

-Matt

[Immelman]

Sorry for the bad luck on your new bird.

 

Call George's Electric in Sacramento, CA, and see if they can repair it for you. They did for me, economically on my '66E, but I had a motor issue.

[47U]

Plus one for George's Electric. He overhauled my generator in Sep '13. I dropped it off after work on a Wed and picked it up before work on Fri. He basically had it for one day.

[wombat]

Thanks for the feedback everyone!   You are a really helpful crowd.   Based on the time to overhaul Vs. ordering a new one, I'm going to get a Weldon 18020-A pump new as soon as I can find a shop to do the work for me.   I have just this week and next to spend flying (I'm between jobs) so getting the plane flying again ASAP is critical to me.   At that point I'll have a Dukes pump that I can do whatever with.  It'd be a shame to throw it away but I don't have much use for it other than as a spare and that's only if I get it overhauled first.  Can I get the core value by sending it into one of the overhaul shops? Does anyone have any good ideas on what I can do with it?  

 

Clay